Marilee Jones starts a "second act"

Parents Forum
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<p>sax said: “Every day that she allowed herself to be called Dr. Jones she was lying. Everyday right up to when she was caught.”</p>

<p>Good point; she continued and prepetuated the lie.</p>

<p>geomom said: “I would take issue with the assessment that she was a good dean.”</p>

<p>That description was based on news reports from back in the day such as:
[MIT</a> Admissions | Blog Entry: “Marilee Jones in the news”](<a href=“http://www.mitadmissions.org/topics/before/helping_your_parents_through_this_process/marilee_jones_in_the_news_1.shtml]MIT”>http://www.mitadmissions.org/topics/before/helping_your_parents_through_this_process/marilee_jones_in_the_news_1.shtml)</p>

<p>[High</a> Anxiety Of Getting Into College - New York Times](<a href=“http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9E0CE1D6163FF93BA35757C0A9619C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=2]High”>http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9E0CE1D6163FF93BA35757C0A9619C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=2)</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/27/us/27mit.html[/url]”>http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/27/us/27mit.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Kei</p>

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<p>I agree with you, jessie. It is disappointing to see with what malicious glee some people on CC discuss other people’s misfortunes and misdeeds. </p>

<p>Look, I liked Marilee Jones, although I did not personally know her. I thought she was a very warm, dynamic presence in MIT admissions. She put the “worriers” (cough – self – cough) at ease.</p>

<p>Here’s what puzzles me about the story, though, if some of the details are correct, such as that she called herself “Marilee Jones, Ph.D”. Did nobody in her world – family, friends, or anyone – ever notice that she had no doctoral diploma framed on the wall? No pictures from the graduation ceremony? Why did nobody say “hon, you just can’t tack the Ph.D. onto your name if you haven’t sweated blood over the dissertation”?</p>

<p>I really wonder about this. Every step of the post-graduate degree process is a long schlog, and the grad student does not make a secret of it! Everyone around you knows you are suffering through it.</p>

<p>It’s possible the graduate degrees were honorary (but she would have clarified that?), but she would also be in the position to know that most honorees don’t use the title “Dr.” (Bill Cosby excepted, but I think he should :)).</p>

<p>Marilee Jones’s story is still a puzzlement.</p>

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<p>Are these links showing that she was in the news because she was promoting
her book evidence that she was a good dean?</p>

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<p>I work at a university, and many of the professors and administrators here don’t have their degrees on the wall or pics from graduation in the office. In my department, it’s 50/50. Their directory profiles list their relevant degrees, and I take them at face value (I’m not involved in hiring.) </p>

<p>Remember that Jones was the boss of most of the people she interacted with daily, many of whom stayed in the same office for much shorter periods than she did. People are unlikely to accuse their boss of fabricating a degree even if things look suspicious. If my boss referred to a credential I didn’t know about, my first thought would likely be that he’d had a strategic reason for not listing it previously, not that he made it up. (Suppose I had a master’s in dance. It might not be part of my web bio at this job, and my co-workers might found out about it only if they saw my complete CV.)</p>

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<p>I’ve refrained from posting on this thread, because I don’t know how much my feelings are colored by the fact that my son was rejected by her the year this all came out. That said, I always felt like she spoke out of both sides of her mouth. The only students that were accepted at MIT from our school were the super overachievers - the last one I remember was a Presidential Scholar, Eagle Scout, valedictorian, Intel finalist. Mere mortals need not apply. </p>

<p>It all turned out fine in the end - I suspect CMU is actually a better place for my son, though I’d much rather be doing the drive to Boston where I have family than Pittsburgh where we know no one!</p>

<p>The degrees were not honorary - they were made up pure and simple.</p>

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<p>Not at all, sax, that’s not what I said. It is unclear from the things I read whether Ms. Jones referred to herself as “Dr. Marilee Jones, Ph.D.” or whether others referred to her as such and she didn’t correct it. Maybe that question is academic (as it were).</p>

<p>What I wonder about is why didn’t anyone close to her say – “um, you should tell them you are not “Dr. Marilee””. It’s just a compelling question, don’t you think?</p>

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<p>It’s not at all surprising to me that she got away with it for so long. Who besides her husband would know where she’d been in the 70’s? In theory, her bosses might have remembered what was on her CV from the time of her promotion, and then seen her listed for a speaking engagement with a Ph.D. attached. But there’s no guarantee they’d remember, and anyway it’s extremely unlikely that a higher-up at MIT would attend an admissions conference or read the program.</p>

<p>I wonder what all the prestigious institutions that invited her to speak before her resignation, like Philips Exeter and Choate, think about having their brands used to promote her business on her web site.</p>

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<p>From a Boston Globe article shortly after she resigned from MIT.</p>

<p>"On her resume, Massachusetts Institute of Technology officials said yesterday, Jones said she had degrees from Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Union College, and Albany Medical College, all in New York State. She does not have a degree from any of them.</p>

<p>Rensselaer said yesterday that Jones was a part-time student in a nondegree program from September 1974 to June 1975. Albany Medical and Union said they had no records that she had ever attended.</p>

<p>“I misrepresented my academic degrees when I first applied to MIT 28 years ago and did not have the courage to correct my resume when I applied for my current job or at any time since,” Jones said in a statement issued through MIT. “I am deeply sorry for this and for disappointing so many in the MIT community and beyond who supported me, believed in me, and who have given me extraordinary opportunities.”</p>

<p>Jones did not respond to requests for an interview yesterday and asked for privacy in her statement.</p>

<p>Because the administrative assistant job for which she was being considered in 1979 did not require a degree, the university did not check Jones’s academic credentials, said MIT chancellor Phillip L. Clay. Jones rose through the ranks and performed spectacularly, Clay said. In 1997, a committee chose Jones, who had been associate director of admissions, to become dean.</p>

<p>Rosalind H. Williams, MIT’s former dean of students and under graduate education who oversaw the committee, said the group did not check Jones’s credentials, in part because she had worked at the university for 18 years."
[MIT</a> dean quits over fabricated credentials - The Boston Globe](<a href=“http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2007/04/27/mit_dean_quits_over_fabricated_credentials/]MIT”>http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2007/04/27/mit_dean_quits_over_fabricated_credentials/)</p>

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<p>Another link, this one to MIT’s investigation:
[Marilee</a> Jones Did Receive Degree - The Tech](<a href=“http://tech.mit.edu/V127/N23/marileeupdate.html]Marilee”>http://tech.mit.edu/V127/N23/marileeupdate.html)</p>

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<p>I have a Ph.D. but the diploma has never been framed and put on any wall. It’s in a drawer, still in the mailer that the University of California used in sending it to me decades ago. </p>

<p>We did have case of a scientist at my company fired for falsely claiming to have a Ph.D. A Ph.D. was not an absolute requirement for the job, but they are very common at that level. He got found out when he left his wife and and ran off with his mistress. The angry wife called the company and outed him. Like Marilee, he had been living that lie for many years. He wasn’t fired for not having a degree but for lying about it. So for those of you living a lie, let this be a lesson to you: Never betray those who are in on your little secrets.</p>

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<p>“>>Did nobody in her world – family, friends, or anyone – ever notice that she had no doctoral diploma framed on the wall? <<”</p>

<p>I know lots of people with doctorates who don’t have them framed or displayed on their walls. Mine is framed, but not displayed.</p>

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<p>Link to thread in College Admissions
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-admissions/822070-shes-back-marilee-jones-disgraced-mit-2007-reinvents-herself-again.html#post1063660981[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-admissions/822070-shes-back-marilee-jones-disgraced-mit-2007-reinvents-herself-again.html#post1063660981&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>I think she inadvertently invented a new category of sheepskin when she awarded herself a . . </p>

<p>. . . Dishonorary degree.</p>

<p>Kei</p>

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<p>Just for the record: Bill Cosby is entitled to use the Dr. designation. He has an Ed.D from UMass, 1977. His dissertation had something to do with Fat Albert.</p>

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<p>On President Jackson’s Page at RPI there is a button on the right side of the page to take you to the “2010 Honorary Degree Nomination Form”.</p>

<p>[Office</a> of the President - Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute (RPI)](<a href=“Martin A. Schmidt '81, Ph.D. | Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute”>Martin A. Schmidt '81, Ph.D. | Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute)</p>

<p>Should be simple to fill out. Lets Try!!!</p>

<p>Candidates Name: Marilee Jones DOB: June 12, 1951
Residence: Concord, MA
Present Position: Homemaker and Parent </p>

<p>Reason for Awarding Degree: Candidate has a long association with Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute; having claimed an Undergraduate Degree from RPI since 1979, and she did attend as a part time non-matriculated student during the 1974-75 school year. She has risen to prominence in her field and proven that formal training is unnecessary to excel. A noted speaker on College Admissions she has advanced the idea that Colleges need to reduce the level of stress for students in the College Admissions process, A theme that has been widely applauded. She has published a well received book "Less Stress, More Success: A New Approach to Guiding Your Teen Through College Admissions and Beyond,” written with a pediatrician, Dr. Kenneth R. Ginsburg. The book had added to her reputation as a kind of guru of the movement to tame the college admissions frenzy.</p>

<p>“Less Stress, More Success” addresses not only the pressure to be perfect but also a need to live with integrity.</p>

<p>“Holding integrity is sometimes very hard to do because the temptation may be to cheat or cut corners,” it says. “But just remember that ‘what goes around comes around,’ meaning that life has a funny way of giving back what you put out.” </p>

<p>This would be an excellent Topic for Marilee Jones to present in a Commencement Address considering the unique perspective she can bring to the discussion.</p>

<p>We strongly support Marilee Jones as a Candidate for an Honorary Degree and as a Commencement Speaker at RPI</p>

<p>Degrees earned and Institution: None that we know of
Previous Honors and Organizations Awarding: Too Numerous to Mention - and listing them all would cause me stress!!!
Suggested as both: Commencement Speaker and Honorary Degree Recipient</p>

<p>Proposed by: (Just fill in your Title, Name, address and Phone #)</p>

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<p>After you have filled out the online form you can just email it to the Presidents Office at RPI. a Link is even provided on the form.</p>

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<p>Once Marilee has her Honorary Doctorate, maybe she can get her old job back, if a degree was all that she was lacking. :rolleyes:</p>

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<p>I agree with Northstarmom - what college wants to rely on an unethical fraud providing advice to students applying to their instituition? The women’s career was based on a faked resume. She clealrly had questionable morals and ethics - and we want her advising college applicants?</p>

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<p>Because people on C-C are whiny?</p>

<p>I mean, that observation isn’t targeted at anyone in this thread. But anyone who has spent time on either the MIT board or C-C in general knows that there are plenty of whiny, bitter students and parents who didn’t get in, or whose kids didn’t get in. The thread you’re referring to was started by some bellyaching newbie with a bunch of misconceptions about how MIT admissions works, who was upset that some kid from their high school didn’t get in. The fact that C-C discusses something doesn’t mean that the OP is clearly true. And a lot of the thread’s activity was people <em>defending</em> MIT.</p>

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<p>She ran her office well and hired excellent people. She was a great proponent of MIT’s student culture in her later years as dean, an advocate for students. She pushed good messages, to try to de-stress admissions, something that many of us here claim to agree with. She and her people, and their policies that some people here complain about, put together good classes, as demonstrated by the accomplishments of their admits. She and her people were accessible to prospective students and their parents. Under her reign, the office started its popular blog program that many other colleges have copied and that has been wildly successful. It improved its minority recruitment efforts. She was liked and respected by everyone that I knew in the office, good at managing.</p>

<p>It is true that in her early years as dean she said some things that were problematic when it came to student culture (which made her unpopular among students for a while). And I’m sure that alums of the time, like students of the time, were irritated. But she revised her opinions as she got more experience, and made up, IMO, for those early mistakes.</p>

<p>I understand why people have reservations about her, given what she did. But I also think that she’s obviously qualified to help students and parents through the college admissions process, and that she mostly did a good job while she was at MIT. In the interest of full disclosure, I knew her personally, worked with her, and liked her, so I am obviously not dispassionate here. And I understand that some people think she’s just too tainted to work in the field, and I don’t think that’s an invalid opinion. But I’m troubled by the level of viciousness in this thread. It’s like she kicked your puppies or something.</p>

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<p>^ ^ </p>

<p>So well said, jessie.</p>

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<p>jessiehl, Marilee’s admissions philosophy helped many people, but it did in fact hurt an equal number of people, particularly Asian-Americans who might be stereotyped as “another textureless math grind.” I am not at all sure that the admissions policy she promoted was best for MIT. I also think that instead of reducing the stress of college admissions, she inadvertently contributed to increasing it, by causing the view among applicants and their parents that nothing could possibly be enough to guarantee admission to MIT. I imagine that this will cause some of the pro-Marilee people to say that I’m espousing “entitlement.” In fact, I am espousing entitlement. I think that if a student has qualified for the IMO, the student is entitled to admission to MIT, absent disqualifying issues of character.</p>

<p>If you know people who might be stereotyped as “textureless math grinds,” then you know the falsehood of the stereotype. I think one of the most important qualities in an admissions staffer is the ability to view every single one of the applicants as an individual, who is just as “feeling” and complete as any other applicant.</p>

<p>As far as kicking puppies goes: I applied to MIT years and years ago and was admitted, but chose to go to a large public university instead. Any limitations I’ve experienced since then have been my own, not those connected with my undergraduate institution. So I am not caught up in “HYPSM-or bust.” No one else in my family or among my close relatives applied to MIT. But my heart goes out to the highly academically qualified and hard-working students such as geomom’s son, mathmom’s son and several of QMP’s classmates who were rejected from MIT, but would have fit there extremely well.</p>

<p>(Addendum: I know that Carnegie-Mellon is a top institution for computer science and probably ranks #1 in that field in most years. I still think it was wrong for MIT to reject mathmom’s son.)</p>

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<p>jessie-
Good food for thought. What I gathered from reading the posts here is not necessarily doubt that she has good interpersonal/people/management skills, sensitivity to the needs of college applicants or good ideas etc, but that the ick factor" (to borrow a phrase from another poster on another thread) comes from the intellectual dishonesty, not only in creating the first resume falsehood, but apparently in later embellishing it by granting herself new degrees or titles that became such a part of her identity that she couldn’t help but continue to live a lie. She surely developed a lot of great college admissions/counseling skills across her decades of work in the field, but the bottom line for me is… fraud is fraud. And somehow it feels ickier in the academic and college admissions arena. And maybe the NYT article is slanted, but some of the quotes mentioned by NSM above do sound like Marilee might have been thumbing her nose at the “lower level” institutions. If the quotes are accurate, it also sounds like she has felt she has put in her time working in the trenches and doesn’t want to have to “work that hard” at this point in her life or her career. Under normal circumstances as one reaches senior levels in their career that makes sense and is reasonable, but when one has to rebuild their tarnished reputation and repent a bit, it doesn’t seem like the right time to come across sounding entitled.</p>