Match D23 for Football, Weather and Merit

Chance Me / Match Me!
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Demographics

  • US domestic : US citizen
  • State/Location of residency: Texas
  • Type of high school : Small competitive suburban public
  • Gender/Race/Ethnicity : white
  • Other special factors: Was on the athletic scholarship track, but decided she didn’t want to play college soccer, quit club to focus on academics her junior year.

Intended Major(s) Political Science or something social science-y and interdisciplinary (i.e., International Studies)

GPA, Rank, and Test Scores

  • Unweighted HS GPA: 3.8
  • Weighted HS GPA (incl. weighting system): 4.2 (these grades are after Sophomore year. Will update when 1st semester Junior year comes out soon.)
  • College GPA (for transfers): N/A
  • Class Rank: Will probably be between Top 8% and Top 6%
  • ACT/SAT Scores: 31

Coursework
By end of Junior year, will have 8 APs, including AP Seminar/ Research. Will be doing at least 3 more Senior year. 3 years of Spanish.

Awards Will be on track for AP Scholar, AP Capstone Diploma

Extracurriculars
Club Soccer, Travel team for 5+ years, School soccer and Cross-Country, NHS, FCA, Newspaper, jobs, consistent volunteering at the local food bank.

Essays/LORs/Other
Not sure yet. They’ll be fine.

Cost Constraints / Budget
We’d feel comfortable up to 30k-ish. No chance for need-based. There’s a chance she might qualify for a grandparent scholarship but that might come with strings attached (to go to an alma mater where she’d be 4th generation) so that’s why we’re doing our best to merit hunt as well.

Schools
D23 is very clear on her basic needs: She wants the Southern football school experience. She’s interested in Greek life but she doesn’t want someplace that’s known as only a party school. She wants a school with some name recognition/ prestige. She’s grown up in Texas but thinks out of state would be great. She definitely has some kind of grad program on the horizon, (law school, MPA, something like that), so undergrad needs to be appropriately affordable but also something that would prepare her for the next stage.

  • Safety (certain admission and affordability)
    Texas A&M - auto-admit, can afford, checks all the boxes

  • Match
    Auburn - visited, really liked it. Would need merit to get it to in-state
    Clemson - visited, really liked it. Would need merit.
    Georgia - visited, was meh on the atmosphere, but would consider if full-ride. lol
    TCU - planning on a visit. She really loves the idea of the location (close enough to Dallas that she could pop home on the weekend but not around the corner) and it would check lots of boxes but the price tag…?

  • Reach
    Texas - I’m putting it here because she’s on the Top 6% bubble. If she manages to squeeze into the Top 6% by the end of junior year… well that changes everything. But she says it would be her dream school, checking all the boxes.

We know Arkansas and Alabama should be on the list, but she has it in her head that they’re the party schools of their states. Oklahoma probably won’t give her anything that A&M won’t and it doesn’t feel far enough away to be exciting.

She’s mentioned U. Miami a few times. Her dad and I aren’t crazy about Florida, but should it be on the list? Likewise, Tulane keeps popping up in our discussions but their football and Greek system are different.

Basically, I’m asking for any other information that we’ve missed or possibilities for a warm-weather football school with respectable academics that gives out merit. I’d like her to have multiple safeties/ likelies/ matches to remove the sting of potentially being Top 6.5% and missing out on Texas. TIA!

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You’d have to look at NPCs, but what about Arizona and Arizona State? Mississippi State? LSU?

Now here’s a real curveball…Utah. Yes it gets cold in SLC, but they still get over 300 days of sunshine per year. SLC is a very cosmopolitan town with good restaurants, bars, shopping and parks. It’s a great campus with really nice dorms. The honors dorms are the nicest we encountered, and we toured lots of schools. You can party if you want, but it’s not a classic “party school.” They are RABID about sports. The Might Utah Student Section (MUSS) is probably unparalleled in college sports for unified student sports engagement. They get 15,000 people at gymnastics dual meets! Academically it’s a very good school. If she can stomach a different climate, it’s certainly worth a look. The average temps are very similar to Little Rock.

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have her look at Blount Liberal Arts program at Alabama - no slouches in that group…lots of political science students…

https://blount.as.ua.edu/about/description/

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We drove around the Utah campus last summer and I thought it looked really cool (loved the rail that connects the campus to the city and I love that SLC is a direct flight to DFW). D23 loves to ski so I will suggest it. Funnily, I think it would be a better fit for D24, who is probably going to be an engineering/ computer major of some sort, but who hates to ski.

Arizona could be a good option. I think MS State and LSU get us into the same place as… what do they offer that her safety won’t? Baton Rouge = College Station?

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I think that additional research on her part is warranted. Although there are definitely parties at those institutions, and just about any university, these schools have large populations. That means there are thousands upon thousands of students who attend them who are are not big partiers. And at Arkansas your daughter should qualify for in-state tuition as she’s from a neighboring state.

I’m not sure how generous Clemson & Georgia are in terms of providing OOS waivers to pay in-state prices, and although your daughter has some wonderful stats, I don’t think they’re going to be sufficiently competitive to earn major scholarships at those two institutions.

If she’s thinking about the state of Florida, what about University of Florida or Florida State? I’ve heard they can be more generous with OOS tuition waivers, and they have more moderate tuition costs for OOS anyway. I don’t think that U. of Miami is going to end up meeting your budget needs and Tulane is unlikely to do so either.

I’d add in LSU and Ole Miss if she wants southern, football, merit aid, and tons of school spirit.

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I think that’s a great question to be asking about all of the schools.

First off, has she visited Texas A&M? Ticking off all the boxes on paper and feeling like it’s a fit in-person are two different things. Has she looked at the social sciences coursework and the frequency of the classes she’s interested in being offered and spoken to students about class availability?

If everything feels right at Texas A&M, then that’s fabulous. If not, however, that’s when it’s helpful to have some of the other choices. Perhaps she likes the social science offerings better at one of the other institutions (and I’m not speaking necessarily of LSU or Ole Miss, but Oklahoma, or Arkansas or wherever). Maybe she qualifies for the honors program at some of the institutions, but not at others. Although honors programs differ by college, most tend to offer smaller classes, nicer housing, priority registration, and other perks. Maybe there are faculty members she’d like to work with, or special research opportunities, or a unique club, or competitive intramural soccer, or…

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Oh, yes, I know. It’s funny, I think because of the Texas auto admit rules we can have an unrealistic view of what admissions look like in other states. Visiting Clemson and Georgia was one part, “let’s get out of town for a justifiable reason during Covid” and one part, “You say you want to go OOS, this is what it’s going to take.” Sitting in those conference rooms, hearing admissions officers state actual numbers really opened her eyes.

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Also, I’m not sure how great the skiing is, but University of Tennessee might want to be under consideration as well.

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You have skiing in Gatlinburg, TN.

THe OP should also consider Appalachian State University in Boone, NC: a good school with lots of school spirit and a pretty decent football team (they beat Michigan in the Big House a few years back); and there is skiing available in the vicinity of Boone. Although you may not get much merit from them (UNC system schools can be stingy giving out merit money for OOS students), it still might be worth a look.

FSU and Ole Miss should definitely give merit money to your daughter.

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Perhaps the University of South Carolina as well.

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My daughter is a freshman at Clemson, checks your boxes except price. I believe they give OOS merit between $8000 - $12,000, my daughter has a very similar resume (except 3.9 UWGPA, 33 act), and was offered $8000 a year. She loves it though.

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University of South Carolina or FSU might come in under cost with the waiver. S21 is at FSU with the waiver and Honors. He’s very happy there. It can be a party school but you can do well academically. All schools have parties to varying degrees.

Her stats are good but probably not good enough for enough merit from UGA or Miami. UT Knoxville, Utah and App State are good suggestions. Ohio State or Miami of Ohio give merit but not sure if her stats would make it.

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I’ve worked in Oxford and thought Ole Miss might be a good option- the scene at the Grove is pretty cool. We will investigate!

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I know. I’ve heard that 8000 OOS is pretty standard. I didn’t know what to expect when we went there and when we drove out of town, I had this moment of instant clarity, that I would feel so comfortable leaving my kids in Clemson. I hadn’t had that yet, so it really speaks to the town/ college. I hope your kid is having a great time.

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My daughter is the first student from her high school to attend (according to Naviance), it was a last second sick of Covid restrictions application on her part. Flew in the end up April and even without entering a building she knew it was for her. She feels so lucky, I don’t think she attended a single high school football game and hasn’t missed a home Clemson game. Apparently everyone is super nice.

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So this is a tough one - and I’m sure you have all the suggestions above mine - so I’m probably repetitive but when you mention merit, you’re going to get some of these:

  1. Alabama - you’re $24K off the $31K tuition auto merit. You can’t distinguish the school from Auburn on parties. You can distinguish the towns - Auburn nicer - but not as cheap.

  2. Arizona - with your GPA, it’s $20K auto so you’d be at $18K or so tuition - the Honors dorm is awesome - with dining hall at the bottom and gym adjacent. OK - but it’s not “Southern”.

  3. Mississippi State will be dirt cheap.

  4. FSU is cheap on its own but if you get an OOS waiver which happened with a 31 ACT in the past, tuition is $7K or so. It’s only low 20s full pay. It’s a match - not an easy get anymore. UF also reasonable - but it’s a reach and there won’t be merit.

There are others - like Mizzou (hey, it’s in the SEC), Arkansas which takes care of Texans, Ole Miss, LSU, U of SC which is much more aggressive then Clemson and has the top Honors college.). Then there’s UTK and UK. If you wanted smaller, less intense, you could look at Coastal Carolina, App State, and Miami Ohio (best rep) - it’s not Southern…but it kind is.

You mention Tulane and Miami.

  1. If you got in and both are reaches, best case, you’d be $50K a year (total) - that’s best. case if you scored merit.
  2. Alabama has nothing on Tulane when it comes to parties - I think your daughter is hearing things that are believable but not necessarily true. My son goes to Bama - dislikes partying and football. He hikes, is in the sailing and astrobotics club and has a fine time.

Good luck.

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@gandalf78 @chmcnm I will bring up South Carolina again. Thanks for the suggestion. Ohio would be out of the question. “Too cold.”

@tsbna44 Is it a tough one? I feel like with all the discussion of Ivies and UC’s and Computer Science research geniuses around here, my girl is coming off only slightly-above-average (but I decided to ask because parents of slightly-above-average kids deserve info too! :sweat_smile:) Anyway, repetition of answers means it’s good, solid information.

I’ve suggested Missou several times - too cold.

I’m definitely going to push Alabama, Arizona, Ole Miss and South Carolina and make her consider at least two. On paper it’s exactly what she wants and I have a feeling we’ll need a couple of good merit offers in our back pockets.

I think there have been three or four cautions against Tulane and Miami too so thanks everyone. We know people from her high school who were similar students who are at both but I’m not sure we want to fall in love with someplace that won’t love her back. We’ve already got that fickle Texas to deal with.

Curious that no one’s mentioned TCU. Is it the merit part of our requirements? I have no clue what a school like that tries to recruit. I’ve heard lots of California students are going there.

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I didn’t mention TCU because I thought it was one you were going to look at. Several kids from my children’s high school went to TCU (I don’t know whether they got money or not) and all of them seemed to have very good experiences there, FWIW.

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Your daughter has some great stats; don’t get thrown for a loop that everyone on CC seems to be 1600 SAT/4.0 UW with tons of leadership positions and national awards (kidding…sort of). And all students, regardless of their GPA and test scores deserve the best guidance possible.

I highly recommend that you become familiar with the Common Data Sets for the universities which interest your family. (A quick web search with the university’s name plus “common data set” should find it.) In it you will be able to find admissions information like what percentage of the class has which GPA, rank, SAT/ACT scores, etc. It also lets you know about how many students get non-need based aid (aka merit, found in section H2A). Thus it would give you a pretty good idea as to your child’s likelihood of admission and merit aid (likelihood and average package).

According to its most recent data set, 1168 out of 2560 freshmen received merit aid averaging $19,405 (46%). TCU is going to run about $68k for tuition, room & board, so the average cost with merit aid is going to be $48k, in all likelihood going to students in the top half of the admitted class. TCU didn’t fill out the GPA section, but 40.2% of its freshmen were in the top 10% and 40.9% has ACT scores in the 30-36 range. Its ACT range is 26-31, so only 25% have higher than 31, so it seems as though there are a lot of students at that 30/31 mark. All that to say, I think your daughter would get merit aid, but probably not enough to meet your budget.

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TCU and SMU not cheap - and you seem to be good with your in-state public from a cost POV. SMU does have a full ride.

A 3.8 UW with 4.2 weighted - if using .5 for Honors and 1 for AP is excellent- but not off the charts - hence you won’t get max aid at Bama or Arizona. Miss State is better in that sense.

A 31 ACT is wonderful - in fact it’s 95% - but when you are talking about merit again - ehhh - it’s not in the top range. I’m sorry to say it like that because it’s really really good but…these schools, while not necessarily tippy top, all have tippy top students roaming the campus if that makes sense.

You can also look at secondary schools that have football but they’re not big conference - UCF (huge), USF, La Tech, Memphis, Houston, etc.

In the end, you want to go to a school (for merit) where you’re above the norm.

Mississippi State has an easy to fill out calculator and it’s a lovely school. You’d get $19K off. So it has a $43 COA including room & board - and you’d be $24K ish or so.

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