Merit Scholarships At T20 Schools

@homerdog “Are these scholarship recipients at your school hooked in any way? First gen? URM? Questbridge?”

I checked it, and yes, both UChicago students with scholarships are URM. One is a NMF, National Hispanic Scholar, Illinois State Scholar, varsity soccer, and bunch of academic achievements. She would be eligible for most things, even if she weren’t Hispanic. The other’s parents are upper middle class African immigrants (father is faculty at NU’s medical school). She was a high stats student, but that’s all I really know.

The Cornell student who got the Tanner isn’t URM or first gen, just really good (one of 4.0 UW GPA students announced by the HS).

There was a Questbridge kid, but I didn’t put them on that list, nor the four Posse kids from 2019, because the OP’s income is too high for QB, and there is only one Posse city in TX, and it does not send kids to any of the colleges on the OP’s list.

@MWolf thanks for checking. I know there are kids out there who are not URM getting merit at some elite schools that offer them but, honestly, I’ve followed threads for those T20 schools that give merit and almost always the students who receive those awards are URM …at least the ones on CC are. I’m just trying to make sure people understand that it’s very very difficult to get merit at Chicago, Duke, Wash U, Vandy, etc and I do believe it’s even more difficult for those who are not URM. High stat URMs, regardless of family income, have a better shot at that money.

@Riversider, do not take consider UT Austin a safety for engineering or CS even if you are in the top 1% or have perfect scores. I have seen kids with both not accepted to their major. I have seen valedictorian’s from competitive Houston HS with large graduating classes not get accepted into engineering. I have seen kids with 1550 SAT scores not accepted. Do not take it for granted that it will happen. UT Austin is not a safety school for those majors.

@homerdog Good point.

Recalculating… From class of 2022, except Northwestern (88), UChicago (42), Stanford (31), Vanderbilt (29), Yale (25), and Brown (24) no other of those colleges got more than 20 applications. Caltech and Williams each got only 2, Dartmouth 8, while Amherst and Rice each getting only 9, and the rest in the teens. A total of 361 applications were sent out to the OP’s T-20.

Because most kids who are applying to these colleges apply to more than one, we’re talking about 200 or so students who applied to the T-20, and only one non-URM got a merit scholarship. If we go by number of applications, and ignore the overlap, there were 361 applications to the OP’s T-20, and only one from a non-URM was accepted with merit. Well, perhaps more were accepted with merit aid, but were not reported since they decided to accept another offer. I do not know, since the school only reports scholarships that are accepted.

So my previous estimate of the chances of being accepted to those colleges with merit are inflated. Fewer than 1% of kids who apply to the OP’s T-20 are accepted with merit aid. It’s probably lower, since not many kids at our HS applied to those colleges, except to the two Chicagoland ones.

Yes. Top of the class is guaranteed acceptance at the University of California…but not necessarily at the UC campus of their choice. So a top CA student who only applies to UC Berkeley is more likely than not going to receive an invitation to attend UC Merced. California students with a guaranteed UC spot are encouraged to identify several campuses that they would like to attend and apply to as many of those as they can.

@Otterma Absolutely correct. My D19 was waitlisted at UC Berkeley for EECS but accepted by MIT. Competitive programs at competitive schools are competitive squared! Any school that uses holistic or unpublished criteria is somewhat unpredictable. If your requirements are complex (“top” schools, certain programs, types of aid needed, etc.), then a wide net is important. D19 applied to 19 schools and in hindsight I think she would have only dropped two from the list.

Menloparkmom, my oldest was a national merit scholar in 2016. He also had a 35 ACT 4.5 weighted, president of choir, award winning actor etc …my brother got his masters at USC and taught adjunct there for 9 years. We toured the campus twice…he didn’t even get waitlisted.

@RedbirdDad , as I have mentioned dozens of times on the USC forum, touring the campus does not indicate “genuine interest” to those in the admissions office. If the student does not show genuine interest in GOING to USC in his essays, and in other ways - questions he/she asks of the local admission rep, whether he reaches out to dept heads, etc, etc, then regardless of his NM status, he is unlikely to be admitted.
Just as at T20 schools- being a NMF gets an applicant into the “considered” pile , but does nothing to help them in the final decision process.

menloparkmom, I think you are beating a dead horse. My son spent a great deal of time detailing his interest in cell phones and why Viterbi was his first choice because of the history of contributions to the technology he is interested. He couldn’t have been more specific. I’d say his NM status and being white had a lot to not getting in and not because he didn’t demonstrate his interest in GOING to USC in his essays. Turned out to be a blessing. USC has been a disgrace nationally on several fronts the last couple years and we dodged a bullet…maybe bad metaphor given where the campus is.

menloparkmom, that came out harsher than I meant it to be, given I didn’t mean it to be harsh at all:) I don’t know how to delete these and want to apologize…I didn’t mean to be rude or standoffish. I appreciate you and anyone’s feedback and wish to be a good community citizen here.

“why Viterbi was his first choice”

Viterbi is one of the most competitive colleges at USC - far more than almost ay other majors save CSA, and acceptance there is also more competitive than at many T20 colleges that don’t accept by major.
sorry you did not understand that.

I’ve gotten the impression recently that accepted students at Viterbi have the "equivalent " grades and stats of the most qualified NMF’s.

These days, being a NMF is NOT a guarantee of having a GREATER chance of acceptance at USC, just as it is not at the most selective colleges. It is ONLY a guarantee that IF he WAS accepted, AND he enrolled at USC, he would be guaranteed to receive a 1/2 tuition scholarship.

and yes, your snarky remarks, nearly 45 days after college admissions decision were out on April 1, were not appreciated.

That said, it was greedy , dishonest athletic staff , lying parents.,fraudulent test takers and above all, Mr Singer who were the cause of the recent “disgrace” at USC, as they were at other top colleges in this federal crime investigation, NOT the admissions staff or the fine professors and other professionals at USC.

@RedbirdDad , one of my nephews was accepting to USC. So was a friend’s DD. Neither had had stats that would have elicited a high probability of acceptance prediction. It was the most selective school on both of their lists.And they were turned down by schools less selective. Neither had any hooks either

My nephew chose W&M over USC. Liked it better and with some merit was about $10-15k less though still pricier than his state school.

Sometimes it is beyond me why some kids are accepted over others in this admissions gauntlet. I can’t even concoct some story that makes sense to me. Sometimes there is some sliver of info that can rationalize what happened but not always. I don’t think luck, both good and bad does play a role in this

We learned some hard lessons in this admission process as first time college applicant parents. My son applied to more schools than he probably should have. Our EFC is higher than what we can truly afford due to some factors not taken into consideration. We knew going in what we could pay reasonably. What we didn’t know is how painful it would be to get into a dream and then see the financial aid and realize it isn’t possible.

My son got into Georgia tech with an out of state tuition waiver, but net price after that was more than we could afford. Also, he would have been giving up our in state tuition merit money and the small scholarships he got that were for in state tuition only.

My son also got into Duke. That was the dream! The financial aid package was amazing, but all need based. He didn’t get invited for any of the merit that were long shots anyways. What I didn’t understand about a school that meets full need is that the parent contribution is stable if they get additional outside scholarships. His outside scholarships knocked the need down, but our contribution was the same no matter what. I lived in a dreamland that thought we could cover some of that expected contribution with scholarships to make it possible.

I’m lucky my son didn’t see our state school as a second tier and could balance the financial decision well. He will be attending UF.

@ufalumn1997 , Oh that had to be painful, and I am sorry. I think that is one of the crueler things about EFC. That a student with zero need, even if his EFC is 999999 and he’s a Rockefeller, can picket the proceeds of merit awards, …but let anyone who gets financial aid get a dime of scholarship money, and it reduces what ever award the person has received and doesn’t go towards reducing EFC.

I went to college in the day that scholarships and financial aid were stackable, and it was the only reason that I had affordable options. I had no clue back in that day why certain schools gave me less than others. Now I know those were schools that gave zero merit money and only met need. I ended up at a school that gave me enough to cover both tuition, books and room and board, and was able to stack outside awards on top of that to cover travel and personal expenses. Even had some money to put into my account for extras. Could not do that these days.

@cptofthehouse

Even students with unaffordable EFCs can get full tuition or full pay MERIT awards…just like your Rockefeller example.

Unfortunately for the above poster, the more generous merit awards weren’t received.

There are schools that do allow stacking, it’s not an across the board rule. It makes sense to me, however, that if you receive an outside scholarship your need decreases.

@thumper1 yes we know some who got full pay merit or substantial merit. I am not bitter, upset, or angry. I believe the right path opened for my son!

I do wish I had been more knowledgeable about the stackable piece when you receive need based. I know each school has their own policies. As a parent who has to do this 2 more times, I’m glad I learned to look into this for the future 2 kids. I think it’s important for people like the original poster to know…so if the student seeks out outside scholarships thinking it will impact efc they know the school’s policy upfront.

@RedbirdDad can clarify…but IIRC, he is not eligible for any need based aid…with a family contribution in excess of the cost of attendance at most schools.

But yes @ufalumn1997 in most cases, outside scholarships reduce your financial need…so need based aid is reduced, usually starting with loans and work study…then grants.

The OP is only interested in the 20 schools listed, and only interested in academic merit. It doesn’t matter if other schools allow stacking only if the 3-4 on the list that offer merit do.

The OP abandoned this thread almost a week ago.