Music Composition Graduate Studies -- what schools might fund me?

College Majors Music Major
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<p>Hello! First off I just want to say I'm amazed by the wealth of info you all provide by writing in this forum that I have just now discovered. Thank you for taking to the time to share it.</p>

<p>I'm sure this is a complicated question. I'm Canadian, and did an undergrad degree in composition at a middle-level sort of Canadian university. For 7 years since then I've been composing in a free-lance way, with some private teaching and freelance performing in there. I think I had sort of misconceptions about grad school that had me not consider it until now; I figured that being a composer would be about a lifetime of trying to develop my abilities myself, and so I set out to do that. But now, I've gotten more interested in the possibility of one day teaching at a university, and I've slowly learned (what's probably always been obvious to everyone) that graduate school can often be much more economically feasible compared to the undergrad experience, and I just want to learn and grow in that school way again</p>

<p>I'm applying to grad schools for composition in Canada and the US, and as bad as it sounds, perhaps my biggest criteria is funding. Or, rather, that all the other factors, especially the teachers, are huge to me, but that I might not be able to go anywhere unless my tuition is covered and there is some chance of paying my livelihood at the time without going into debt. This is simply because that I've only been able to survive as a freelance composer for this long by living insanely frugally and avoiding debt; and after any grad studies I do, with the competitiveness for teaching positions these days, I could well have the same freelance composer life needing to avoid debt. </p>

<p>I don't expect anyone to evaluate my portfolio here (although if you want to, I'd be grateful!), and that's probably the biggest criteria for acceptance (I would hope!). Perhaps I have more pieces under my belt than the average recent graduate because I've been composing for a while since my degree. I've got music in most genres; some quite substantial works; decent recordings of them; I like to think that my technique is rigorous; maybe my style would be considered neotonal. I've been trying to listen to music of grad students at possible schools, and I feel that my music stands up; but that's just my own evaluation. I haven't won many awards though, or published any papers, or have much else to light up my CV other than the pieces and their performances. I'm not sure which GPA calculation they would use but the average for my semester GPA's for my undergrad was 3.9. I haven't taken the GRE yet, but I suspect from my prep that I'll get a fairly high score.</p>

<p>There are quite a few schools I'd love to go to -- like University of Chicago, Yale, Harvard, Juilliard, Princeton, Cornell, Berkely-- for their programs, teachers, and their guaranteed funding! But obviously these are top level schools. How do I know if I have any chance at all? Should I bother with any at all? I should also apply to some "safer" schools as well -- but how do I know what those might be? Does anyone have tips on finding "safer" schools that might have good chances of funding for composition grad students? Can anyone comment on what will make the real difference for acceptance?</p>

<p>I can only apply to so many schools, because of the costs. I wish us students could just post up our profiles, and let schools shop for US, and make their offers, and then we could just pick the best among them:)....</p>

<p>Any comments or help at all would be greatly appreciated!</p>

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<p>I know that for undergrad once my son started corresponding with professors at the various schools which were of interest, he got a good feel of where he would be welcome. Have you written to any of the schools you’ve listed, or met with the professors? Many, although not all, of the professors were willing to listen to my son’s music before he ever applied. Also, a number of schools will tell you up front what kind of financial support for their composition grad students they provide. For some, if you’re admitted, you automatically get the support.</p>

<p>Most of the schools you’ve listed have very different aesthetics - are you truly attracted to the professors/aesthetic at each one? Or just to their financial support? because there are plenty more grad programs to add to that list. Also, are you looking at any Canadian programs?</p>

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<p>Thanks so much for your reply SpiritManager. That is a great idea. I’m kind of late in the game on contacting professors, but I was worried it would be an imposition to ask them to listen to my music, so it’s good to hear the suggestion from you. What sort of things did your son correspond about with the professors? I’m pretty green about what questions would be good to ask, being out of school for a while.</p>

<p>I can certainly tell a lot about the aesthetics of composition faculty members from their music, but I don’t know how to tell the aesthetics of the school as a whole, other than the occasional words here on their websites about specific courses and such. And actually I was quite glad for an earlier post on this forum about composition styles and schools. But tips in this regard would be great. I figured that if there was at least one faculty member who had something I could appreciate in their music, and the program otherwise looked good, then I was interested (if they might fund me!,) knowing that diversity is interesting too and music style of a professor isn’t the same as the teaching they impart. The schools I named were just the main schools that advertise on their websites that you get support if admitted, and also had other aspects that attracted me. Any experiences or even reputations about any schools for composition would be great–I don’t know about other prairie Canadians, but I certainly didn’t grow up with these as household names :)</p>

<p>Probably Iwill apply to UBC, Western, and U of Toronto in Canada too, and I think I could get admitted, but no idea about funding (other than Western covering tuition of Masters students). From websites, most schools seem to fall into the category of “some students get merit-based funding” and so it’s hard to decide.</p>

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<p>You might look at Curtis if your style is neotonal, and Juilliard would be a good fit too. I agree with spirit manager that the schools you list have different prevailing aesthetics and that that might be one of the most important criteria to look at, along with funding.</p>

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<p>Thanks very much compmom! I’ve enjoyed yours and SpritManager’s posts very much on other threads too.<br>
Curtis doesn’t have grad studies in composition. I guess I wouldn’t put too much emphasis on me saying neotonal, because we all often use words like that in different ways, nor so much on the school I named, because I could list other school of interest too, but their funding isn’t so promised. But any tips on aesthetics of schools, what to say to professors, how to gauge one’s chances, and how selection is made, or any other experience or tips are great!</p>

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<p>You’re right: Curtis does have an MM program, but it is in opera. They do have a diploma program. When we visited, we talked at length with a composer who had been out of school for some time, who was doing the diploma, which I had remembered incorrectly.</p>

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<p>I think if you find a program which is the right ‘fit’, i.e. where they want you and appreciate what you’re doing - that the money will fall into place. I would approach the programs first from the professor/network angle, and worry about the money second.</p>

<p>Grad school will be the place where you make the connections for your future career - so you’ll want to choose the arena where you’d want to end up! And you want to choose a place where you’d be comfortable with your fellow composers. Somewhere you think you’d be both stimulated and pushed, and nourished and supported, as well.</p>

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<p>On the high end, add Columbia, Stanford, UCSD to the list. They all provide fellowships and stipends. Another school to check out is University of Missouri-Columbia. They have money for grad students and are seeking to build a top notch new music composition program.</p>

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<p>I do believe that most of the composition programs we hear about will provide large fellowships to some, if not necessarily all, of their grad students. If he finds a program which really wants him, then it’s likely they will help him find a way to attend.</p>

<p>I think our OP needs to find a department which supports his aesthetic before worrying about the money side. It’s certainly something he can ask about in his first interchanges with the professors - what is the institutional support for its grad students?</p>

<p>We could certainly list more schools: UMKC, USC, Michigan, Indiana, CSU Long Beach, Miami, Vanderbilt, Illinois, Iowa, CCM, Univ, of MN, Grand Valley State, SF Conservatory, CSU Fresno, Miami, Wesleyan, Hartt, Eastman, Rice, Univ. of Colorado, UNLV, SUNY, Mannes, NYU, Manhattan, Peabody, Northwestern, and on and on…</p>

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<p>I will not list schools for the sake of listing schools. I mention schools because I have some basis for listing them. In the first list these are schools that Oberlin composition grads attend with frequency in addition to some of those that the OP mentioned. I suggested Missouri simply because of my son’s experience with it in the application process. The OP leans neotonal thus leans towards Bartok and Stravinsky as do many Oberlin grads. So the schools I listed would fit his “aesthetic.”</p>

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<p>I do agree with you that there is a natural progression to grad schools for Oberlin and Harvard undergrads to UCSD, Stanford and Harvard. No disagreement from me there. Guess I’m just unclear what neotonal means to our OP…</p>

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<p>It could be as broad as anything beyond tonality which is certainly broad! I picked Bartok and Stravinsky as early and popular examples. The two newest members of the Oberlin composition faculty are Ph.D’s from UCSD and Columbia. As you have said there are several Oberlin grads in the Ph.D program at Harvard including Ashley Fure.</p>

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<p>Thank you all so much, and Bartokrules its great to see you on here too! You’ve all helped me realize that the key will be contact with the composition faculty…which I realized I got a bit waylayed from, trying to narrow down by funding and acceptance possibilities first. Hopefully I can still make some headway there, this late in the game.</p>

<p>It can be difficult but interesting to try to generalize about style. In most contexts I’ve been in, anything resembling Stravinsky or Bartok or 20th century modernism is considered very conservative, as is anything that doesn’t involve electronics, graphical notation, or using predominantly extended techniques. So I find it hard to interpret what other people mean by “modern”!</p>

<p>That being said, does anyone have any “word on the street” about the aesthetics of these schools, who have some profs that interest me: SUNY Stonybrook, University of Miami, U of Chicago, Peabody, SFU, Stanford, Bowling Green, Florida State, Brandeis, North Texas, Pittsburg, Berkeley (not Berklee)? Or any experience about funding or acceptance in general at any of them.</p>

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<p>Insightful comment that describes the aesthetics of some programs, such as Harvard and Oberlin, very well, at least from what I know:</p>

<p>“It can be difficult but interesting to try to generalize about style. In most contexts I’ve been in, anything resembling Stravinsky or Bartok or 20th century modernism is considered very conservative, as is anything that doesn’t involve electronics, graphical notation, or using predominantly extended techniques. So I find it hard to interpret what other people mean by “modern”!”</p>

<p>Terminology is a problem when writing about new music/contemporary classical/contemporary concert music in general. “Modern” is becoming a term for old-fashioned in other art forms too. “Modern” and “classical” can refer to specific time periods or to styles. Then we have post-modern, which is also old-fashioned at this point, actually going back 50 or 60 years now.</p>

<p>So, what do you mean by “neotonal”? My interpretation is different from Bartokrules, I think, and it might help others if you could elaborate just a little.</p>

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<p>Regarding U of C, if you have not already, take a look at the Graduate Music Society and the listing of grad students on the Department of Music website. Many interesting things. Getting in contact with the Graduate Music Society could also be useful. Several other schools list their grad students in composition, some very detailed, some not so much. From an electronic standpoint the program at Brown is first rate. A Timara faculty member at Oberlin came from there. Andrew May at UNT is head of the center for experimental music. Many moons ago I had email discussions with him when my son was beginning composition studies in high school. Dr. May is very forthcoming. As far as Stanford goes, quite a few of its faculty came from UCSD and also have heavy modern European influences which I think is a good thing. It is great that this thread has created a discussion regarding modern, post modern, avant-garde, neotonal (which may cover everything) music.</p>

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<p>Ok, here’s attempting to say a little more about my style: </p>

<p>I try to make music that is clear, moving, understandable; I use melody, counterpoint, harmonic progressions, motivic development, I use consonsance and dissonance, I care a lot about musical structure. Sounds pretty broad, and applies to most music in western history, but in most new music contexts that’s considered quite conservative. Because I care about pitch then it’s technically tonal, but I choose from all twelve tones and don’t restrict to major/minor modality or anything. I tend to focus on instruments rather than electronics, and might use extended techniques in an expressive way without making them the main point. I prefer precision over aleatory, and haven’t yet been interested in the post-modern philosophical approach. I still might write a fugue, a passacaglia, a symphony. I tend to prefer the meaning to be in the music rather than attempting to verbalize a big conceptual thesis for each piece. Maybe especially because I wasn’t intending to pursue an academic compositional life, I am interested in being entrepreneurial, and writing music that is “high art” but that many people will play and understand and enjoy. I am still most influenced by 20th century greats like Hindemith, Debussy, Ravel, Bartok, Stravinsky, Britten, Copland, Barber, Martinu, along with others and earlier folks. If Nadia Boulanger or Hindemith were still alive; I’d go study with them. Their students tend to be dead or retired now :frowning: . I actually would love a school/faculty/community that had diversity in aesthetic; I AM still interested in every 21st century innovation, and sifting through the “research” to see what might be useful for me to apply towards my expressive goals. But I’d love an “old-school” sort-of mentor that cares a lot about technique. </p>

<p>compmom, are you meaning that Harvard/Oberlin/UCSD are modern in a 20th century Bartok/Stravinsky way? Or more a focus on “electronics, graphical notation, or using predominantly extended techniques.”?</p>

<p>Thanks so much guys!</p>

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<p>Describing aesthetics is always a challenge, at least for me. My son regularly attempts to illuminate these matters for me :wink: For example, this comment:</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>…Might make me think what you really mean about your work is that it is predominately neo-tonal and perhaps classical minimalist in structure?</p>

<p>(Eg. Glass/Adams/Reich/Riley/Oliveros…)</p>

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<p>^I posted that BEFORE I’d seen your further elaboration.
So, straight up neo-classical, perhaps ;)</p>

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<p>I have learned a few things from Bartokrules, in this discussion. We have “talked” about vocabulary in the past. </p>

<p>So I googled neotonalism for my own purposes and am sharing some of what I found, which explains Bartokrules’ interpretation. Much of this will be old hat to the OP and perhaps others:</p>

<p>[::</a> Welcome to Concise History of Western Music, 3rd Edition ::](<a href=“W. W. Norton & Co.”>W. W. Norton & Co.)</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.courses.unt.edu/jklein/files/80_INFLUENCES_SERIALISM_0.pdf[/url]”>http://www.courses.unt.edu/jklein/files/80_INFLUENCES_SERIALISM_0.pdf&lt;/a&gt; (see the slide on neotonal composers)</p>

<p>Most basically, and pardon the Wiki: <a href=“http://www.courses.unt.edu/jklein/files/80_INFLUENCES_SERIALISM_0.pdf[/url]”>http://www.courses.unt.edu/jklein/files/80_INFLUENCES_SERIALISM_0.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Always lots to learn!</p>

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<p>Putwither, well said, very articulate. I guess I can see why you might be interested in a variety of environments. Maybe someday we will hear some of your music. You sound very mature in your musical vision but at the same time open and eager for new growth.</p>

<p>I love that you mentioned using extended techniques expressively but they are not the main point :)</p>

<p>Have you considered the European American Musical Alliance in Paris in the summer? The Alliance still focuses on the teaching methods of Nadia Boulanger in their summer programs. Perhaps the list of professors’ schools of origin could be helpful to you, too:</p>

<p>[European</a> American Musical Alliance](<a href=“http://eamusic.org/]European”>http://eamusic.org/)</p>

<p>EAMA offers summer music programs in Composition, Conducting and Chamber Music at the historic Schola Cantorum in Paris, France – taught in the tradition of the legendary Nadia Boulanger. These programs offer intensive study of the crafts of counterpoint, harmony, analysis, and musicianship as well as composition and chamber music performance taught by professors from The Juilliard School, Indiana University, Mannes College of Music, Westminster Choir College, Peabody Conservatory, San Francisco Conservatory, the Paris Conservatory, the Ecole Normale de Musique de Paris and La Schola Cantorum.</p>