@Midwest67 that’s funny, my kids call me the Spreadsheet King. I have a spreadsheet with about 95 columns of data and I added some placeholders for a few of your data points including the NPC, inflation and the 4 year cost.
I’m a Data Analyst so I bring the data set into a visualization tool called Qlik so I can make pretty dashboards with charts, graphs and KPIs. Right now I have several dashboards: Estimated Finances and ROI, Acceptance Rates, Key Dates, AP Credits, SAT/ACT Averages, College Freshmen Profile, Application Type & Requirements and College Details.
Tracking about 30 schools so far and it has been very handy to compare them by filtering only the ones she’s is applying to, the type of school and any other number of ways.
“At Pitt and JHU we talked to engineering students that were minoring in Entreprenurialship or Business, which seemed smart to me.”
This seems smart to the average layperson, but most hiring engineers will see it as a negative. The engineers on the engineering sub-forum routinely advise students against this. It does two deleterious things, shows an employer they have different motivations than being an engineer and it dilutes the depth of engineering they can take. Nearly all engineering managers who pick up business credentials do it well after they’ve been in the trenches for a while. Companies don’t hire green engineers to manage.
The one counter argument is if a student knows beyond a shadow of a doubt that they want to start a company themselves. Even then, the tech rules. You can learn the business stuff on the side.
As for Pitt, Penn State and Temple, slam dunk. Her stats are WAY above the 75th percentiles in their most recent, respective CDSs. All three accept over 50% of their applicant pools. Sure, engineering may be more selective at any or all of them, but she’s not getting rejected from any of those schools.
The notion that schools require some sort of engineering experience to prove interest is not accurate advice. Students who have no access to such programs are accepted to all levels of institutions all the time. It’s by far and away the exception to the rule that students have “engineering experience” like First Robotics. As such, schools that really desire said background as a litmus test are rare. At my son’s school, none of the Rensselaer Medalists around his time had any engineering experience. They didn’t have First until very recently. They did participate in math club, but that hardly counts as “engineering experience.” What they had in common, was a rock solid math and science foundation. They all ended up in very good engineering programs. She will be fine anywhere she applies with the record she has amassed. If she doesn’t get in, it won’t be because of her stats or lack of experience. It will be the simple math of far to many qualified applicants.
Lastly, engineering isn’t what most of us think it is. As was previously mentioned, it’s not generally tinkering/inventing, although it can be. It is largely applied math and physics. Those who thrive, generally love math for its own sake.
FYI, Duke has a separate school for engineering. First years apply to Trinity School of Arts & Sciences or Pratt school o Engineering. It is much easier to move from Pratt to Trinity, but might be worth knowing more.
Agree, although such experiences in high school, if available, can help a high school student determine whether s/he is really interested in engineering before applying or matriculating to college as an engineering major.
Note that the same can apply to the AP CS principles course, which is rather useless for advanced placement in college, but can be a good way to determine how interested the student is in CS, and where the knowledge learned can be useful even if the student decides not to major in CS.
I will suggest University of Cincinnati. It has a respected Engineering School and many other majors should she decide she doesn’t want to continue in engineering. Also, residents of Pennsylvania qualify for the National Outreach Scholarship at UC. https://financialaid.uc.edu/cincinnatusprogram/nationaloutreach.html.
If she is interested in biomedical engineering consider VCU in Virgnia. They have a very established bme program. I personally feel their program is better than UVA and more aligned with JHU and Duke.
She may qualify for the presidential scholarship. To be considered she would have to apply Early Action by Nov 15th. I would also recommend applying for the honors program.
Presidential
This four-year scholarship covers the cost of tuition and fees up to $14,000 per year (maximum amount of $7,000 per semester), as well as room and board*. The estimated total value of this four-year award is approximately $104,000
Average GPA: 4.63
Middle 50 percent: 4.53-4.78
Average SAT-I* score: 1501
Middle 50 percent: 1460-1550
Ohio University was a fantastic find for our family. It meets your geographic and budget needs. Their scholarships are good. Though DS passed on it, it literally came down to the last hour of decision. DD19 will be applying.
@tpike12 not sure about coops/internships. I know the engineering majors are popular, and I’ve head they’re strong, but I’m not familiar details. There are two hospitals on campus and an eye institute, which I would think could offer internship and coop opportunities. Here is some information that might be helpful:
Adding VCU, Ohio University, Rochester and U of Cincinatti to my research. Thanks for all the suggestions.
D visited Drexel and Penn this weekend. She did not get a good vibe from Drexel. Really liked Penn, beautiful and tranquil (she said the noise level between Drexel and Penn was startling).
I talked to her about the option of applying to a few more schools outside of the NorthEast and she seemed agreeable after I explained the Alabama NMF package.
I attended OU as an MA student, so you can ask questions. I love Ohio U. It’s half the size of Ohio State and is in a beautiful–though economically depressed–part of OH. Athens is doing fine because the university drives the town’s economy. OU also has one of the most beautiful campuses you will see. The architecture is consistent (lots of red brick), and a river borders one side of campus. There’s is a beautiful quad that ends, at an angle, at Court St., the main “strip.” There are bars, yes, but also a shiny diner and a Mexican restaurant (Casa Nueva) that is a co-op, owned jointly by all its employees. Downtown Athens has a very “crunchy” vibe, even though its students come from all walks of life.
It has a reputation as a party school, but what large university doesn’t? Students were bright. I never felt like I was teaching at a school where the students seemed like castoffs from more selective schools. It’s a great place to have a traditional four-year experience.
Is your daughter interested in Steven’s Institute in Hoboken? Likely merit aid for her stats that may match with the in state options. You have good choices with Pitt, Temple and Penn State. To me , any other university would have to offer something more, like the networking opportunities at Steven’s, or a higher ranking etc at a comparable net price, or slightly higher (of course a lesser price tag would be even better
@momprof9904 - The name of the university is Stevens (not “Steven’s”).
Pitt, Temple, and Penn State accept some 60% of their applicants. Stevens acceptance rate is about 37%. The most recent freshman class has an average high school GPA of 3.9 and SAT of 1400/1600. The curriculum is extremely rigorous even by the standards of engineering schools, as a result of the broad-based philosophy of Stevens from its founding. Students study a foundation in all engineering specialties, with many required breadth and depth courses in areas other than and in addition to their specific major. That gives rise to a high credit load (148-152 credits is typical in four years). Many engineering schools today have become specialized. Stevens considers it essential for an engineer to understand the interdisciplinary nature of engineering work and not to only understand how to do one thing.
Stevens graduates come in at tenth in the nation for starting and midcareer salaries, and return on investment of tuition (source, Bloomberg Business Week/Payscale “What’s Your College Degree Worth, 2018”). That is higher than Pitt, Temple, and Penn State, so yes, Stevens offers more.
@tpike12 , sounds like you have good in state options. But if she wants to diversify her choices, take a look at the Florida public schools. As a NMF, she would receive full cost of attendance (tuition, room, board, costs, books). University of Florida is a top ten public, and I hear UCF is popular with engineering majors and has a good honors college. My son is at FSU on the NMF scholarship, but FSU is not really known for engineering.
@momprof9904 and @Engineer80 we did look at Stevens and actually have a good friend attending there right now. The reason we have not pursued it is because if she ends up not pursuing engineering, she does not have a good Plan B at Stevens. Great engineering school though.
Stevens has mathematics, computer science, physics, chemistry, chemical and molecular biology, and biochemistry and offers bachelor’s, master’s, and doctoral programs in each.
