<p>I should have made this thread a long time ago since he is now a 3rd year student, but he appealed his financial aid award in his 3rd year where his father filed for bankruptcy in December 2010. The FAO told him his EFC is still 46000 due to the fact that his father owns 2 houses and a business (that profits 2000 a year). Luckily his grandmother's college fund for him will support him for fully pay at a UC until the end of his 4th year. Before his father filed for bankruptcy, he was still in a bad position with a high EFC and low financial abilities. What should he do?</p>
<p>His father should recheck all FAFSA input. If there is substantial equity in the properties, I dont understand why the BK filing. Many lenders would require cross collaterization of properties/business, so he should check if he allocated liabilties to properties correctely. But it could be correct – sounds like a complicated bankuptcy. </p>
<p>If the GM trust fund is in his name, this could create the high EFC</p>
<p>If correct, he should finish UC. For grad school, FAFSA does not look to parents.</p>
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<p>If your friend is paying $46K to go to a UC, he must be an OOS student. The UCs do NOT promise to meet full financial need. They are public universities in CA…a state which is having a lot of financial issues overall. </p>
<p>If he has a college fund that is supporting ALL of his expenses to attend this UC, I’m not sure I understand the problem? </p>
<p>Your friend’s appeal of his financial aid might net him nothing in the end.</p>
<p>Chaos, gotta ask, are you becoming the “resident financial aid expert” for all of your friends at your UC? This is the third “friend” you have posted about. It is very possible that you (as a fellow college student) aren’t hearing the full financial picture from your friends.</p>
<p>Yes, it is possible for someone to have a parent going bankrupt and still have a high EFC. The EFC is set up with standard rules and if the way things work are in set categories, the assets and income are fully included. That the parent owns a business and property outside of his primary residence is included in the calculations. Your friend can ask for an appeal and perhaps the market values can be reassessed, but the methodology remains firm. It is federal methodology. </p>
<p>I have a friend who make his living and has his retirement in a bunch of rental properties. His income is modest, but because of the values of his real estate his kids got no financial aid. His FAFSA EFC is high and his son who went to Harvard which has one of the most generous financial aid calculators, did not give him a cent. A young man on this forum, turned down Yale because the college would not give him aid, again based on income properties. For financial aid purposes, such properties are going to be counted at full value as assets and there is no break there.</p>
<p>Yes, Cpt but if OPs friend’s dad is in a BK filing, that would imply to me that his liaiblities exceed his assets. What I am suggesting is a review of banking arrangements and the FAFSA filings to see if all property values have been reduced by associated debt.</p>
<p>The “friend” should check the figures on the FAFSA (everyone should do that). BUT the bottom line is that the UCs do not guarantee to meet financial need with aid. They don’t. The most this student “might” get (if he had an EFC of $0…) is the Pell grant and the Stafford loan. </p>
<p>And again…my gut feeling is that the “friend” doesn’t have the whole financial picture. As Kayf said…this sounds complicated. How much of the financial picture is missing from that told to Chaos? </p>
<p>And again to Chaos…what exactly IS the issue? This is an OOS student whose grandmother has a college fund that is FULLY FUNDING the OOS cost. That is what the grandmother’s college fund presumably is for.</p>
<p>It depends on how the business and the ownership of the buildings are structured. He can certainly appeal and if things are structured in a way that the financial aid office can view it favorably for him, good for him. Every case has its individual issues and it is entirely possible that this case may find a niche where the EFC can be recalculated. But I know many folks who filed for BK and many with such holdings, and they did not come out too well on the financial aid end, especially with FAFSA. With PROFILE, an individual college has a lot of leeway and can do just about whatever it pleases with its own money, but FAFSA is a whole other story. I’ve seen some pretty crazy cases where income and assets should not have been valued or even counted the way they had to be according FAFSA methodology and the only way out is to take off that year and wait till the dust settles. It’s only been because of the huge number of unemployed that the “displaced worker” exception was allowed. Your EFC is based on numbers from the prior year and even if you are flat broke right now, it’s 2010 numbers that hold. But, certainly the OP’s friend should discuss this with the college financial aid counselors.</p>
<p>But also, as others have commented, even lowering the EFC somewhat is not going to be much help to an OOSer at a UC most likely. You don’t get PELL monies unless that EFC is waaaaay low, so subsidization of the STaffords is about all that may be accomplished and he may already have that. I recommend the student gives it a try to discuss the situation with FA, but not get the hopes up. It’s always good to be known to your FA office and get whatever ideas you can from these counselors and more familiarity with the system. There can also be some mistake or loophole or something in the present situation that gets caught. I just want to caution not to get ones hopes pinned on a bonanza from the session due to the circumstances as they are reported.</p>
<p>If this student is OOS for a UC, then it really doesn’t matter if his EFC is $46k or if it’s $16k. The UC’s aren’t going to give him money.</p>
<p>Even if he’s instate, if family income were really that low for 2010, he’d qualify for Blue and Gold - which I think only looks at income, not assets. </p>
<p>Chaos…you’re probably not hearing the whole story from your friend. And, if he’s getting money from Granny to pay for college, that also gets noted on FAFSA, which also would cause EFC to rise.</p>
<p>Was the bankruptcy a personal one or a corporate one…big difference.</p>
<p>Your friend doesn’t need financial aid. Let grandmother use the money how she planned and leave the financial aid for those who need it.</p>
<p>It is a learning experience worth getting to sit down with a financial aid counselor and go over the figures and the methodology and try to negotiate the process. For that alone, the student should do this. Getting any real money out of the process is a very slim chance, in my opinion. </p>
<p>But, I did not think my college son would get some of the funds he has managed to get in the last three years and they have added up to a very nice amount. If he had not tried, he wouldn’t have gotten a dime of that money. We did not count on him getting it, however.</p>
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<p>Well it wouldn’t hurt to gain more information. Not only this, but I wouldn’t mind exploring the career path of being a financial aid officer after graduation as one of my after graduation options. Also I don’t remember the 3 friend threads. One of them is this. One of them is the bank account, checking account FAFSA verification (who does not attend a UC), and I cannot remember what was the other thread I made for a friend. Do you remember?</p>
<p>Actually this person who has a 46000 EFC is a California resident and his COA is only 31000. Well the fund will not have enough money to support his last 2-3 quarters.</p>
<p>Luckily his grandmother’s college fund for him will support him for fully pay at a UC until the end of his 4th year.</p>
<p>*Well the fund will not have enough money to support his last 2-3 quarters. *</p>
<p>Well, then he needs to work as much as he can over this summer and next summer to earn as much as he can…even if that means working 2 jobs over each summer…and work during the school years. </p>
<p>And, he needs to talk to his DAD about how his DAD can do something to bring in more cash for his child’s education. He clearly has assets or something. </p>
<p>Also, your friend should be finishing his junior year at his UC. If he needs 6 more quarters, than that suggests that he hasn’t taken full loads, or he’s dropped classes, or he’s changed majors, or he’s refused to take courses at “inconvenient times.” He may need to tweak his schedule over the next 3 quarters to minimize his need to take 2-3 MORE quarters. If he can manage to only need 1 extra quarter, then his summer incomes can pay for that.</p>
<p>Something is not right. Blue and Gold eligibility is based on income, so if he’s eligible, then he should get something.</p>
<p>However, I suspect that the dad has a greater income than what your friend is really saying - hence the high EFC.</p>
<p>Yeah, it sucks that you can only edit posts until 20 minutes has elapsed. </p>
<p>He is a 3rd year right now and starting his 4th year, he will only have $10,000 in the fund. He can graduate in 4 years though.</p>
<p>It is suppose to say end of his 3rd year. And even then I would still consider it “lucky” because most parents / guardians don’t have a savings of over $90,000. But yeah, I’ll tell him to work. Also I will try to get a bigger picture from him. I may be missing something important. You are right about the Blue and Gold thing.</p>
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<p>■■■■■ post.</p>
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<p>Is it taking him longer than four years to graduate?</p>
<p>There are a LOT of things that could factor in to your friend’s issue with his EFC. First, if there were life insurance policies upon his mom’s death and the money from those is in savings, this would be counted as an asset. Sometimes life insurance policies are a lot of money. There could have been something in both the friend and his father’s names…both would be assets. The houses they own, if in CA (not the primary residence) if owned for an amount of time could have very significant equity in them…again…assets on the FAFSA. </p>
<p>The best advice you can give your friend is to make an appointment with the financial aid officer. If there is something on his FAFSA that is NOT representative of the family’s current finances, the friend should have WRITTEN documentation to support this to give to the financial aid folks.</p>
<p>If he’s an instate resident and his income is below a certain amount, he would have been eligible for the Cal Grant. If his income isn’t that low, he would not receive that OR any federally funded aid either.</p>
<p>What kind of aid is your friend looking for? I"m not from CA, but my understanding is the BULK of their need based aid comes in the form of the Cal Grant for those who qualify for it. I don’t think there is much else.</p>
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<p>This poster is not a ■■■■■…she brings up a good point. This student HAS a college fund…it presumably was set up for him to attend college and you, yourself, said that it would support four years of study. Most students with financial need aren’t quite so lucky.</p>
<p>*He is a 3rd year right now and starting his 4th year, he will only have $10,000 in the fund. He can graduate in 4 years though.</p>
<p>It is suppose to say end of his 3rd year. And even then I would still consider it “lucky” because most parents / guardians don’t have a savings of over $90,000. But yeah, I’ll tell him to work. Also I will try to get a bigger picture from him. I may be missing something important. You are right about the Blue and Gold thing.
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<p>Well then, if he has $10k in his college fund now… He needs to do this… quickly submit a FAFSA now for this PAST current year 2010-11 year (it’s not too late). He should be able to borrow UP TO $7500 dollars. (again, this money will be awarded based on this current school year). When he gets that money, set it aside for this next year. Also, file FAFSA for this next school year. He should be able to borrow $7500 for this next year. So, he’ll have $15k right there, plus the $10k from Granny.</p>
<p>However, he needs to work over the summer to borrow the least amount that he will need.</p>
<p>Problem solved.</p>
<p>All right I’ll tell him what thumper1 and mom2collegekids said. </p>
<p>Regarding the ■■■■■ post, he does have a college fund, but the college fund won’t be enough for 4 years. He can graduate in 4 years though, but he is unsure at the moment.</p>
<p>Tell your friend to act immediately on getting the Direct Student loan for this current school year. I know that 2 quarters are already complete…that’s ok…he can still get the loan for this past year. This means submitting the FAFSA for the previous year…the one that could have been submitted on Jan 1, 2010.</p>
<p>Then, he needs to get the loan for this next school year (fall 2011 and forward). That will require the FAFSA that was probably already submitted that gave the high EFC. However, it he didn’t submit it (or it wasn’t finalized), then he needs to do so. That way he can get another $7500.</p>
<p>It doesn’t matter that his EFC exceeds COA…he can get both loans…but he needs to act NOW for that first one.</p>
<p>All right. I’ll tell him this too.</p>
<p>Actually Chaos, have your friend discuss the finances with his family FIRST. To me, there is a huge missing piece in this story. If the family determines they will need these loans, then yes…apply for them. BUT they may say they don’t need them. If the family says they don’t need the loans, there is no reason for this student to take them.</p>