<p>Looking over the last few years admission results at my child school I'm fairly confident in stating the following that if a child qualify for NM Semifinalists status then the chances to get into Ivies increases > 75% with the caveat that the student is taking a rigor curriculumn and have a decent SATs.</p>
<p>Sure anyone getting the NM SF are capable students but it has been seen that most of the students applying to top colleges are capable students.
What I'm trying to fish out that does it really give you an edge if actually get NM SF?</p>
<p>I agree with incubyte for the most part... however I do feel that being a semifinalist/finalist definitely is an asset to one's application. No one from my school was a semifinalist this year, however, there were three last year. Of those, one currently goes to Darthmouth (he was a finalist in the NMSF), one was rejected from Yale EA & goes to Middlebury, and one applied to Williams ED & was accepted (also a finalist).</p>
<p>It cannot be just coincidence Look at the National Merit SemiFinalis/Finalists and Commended (NM Total) status and college admissions fto US News top 30 for those years</p>
<p>ParentOfIvyHope, no one is saying it is coincidence that NM kids do well at Ivy admissions. The point is that the NM recognition is not the most important factor. What's more important is that the same factor's which lead kids to do well with NM are much the same as those which elite colleges are looking for.</p>
<p>I think it's a non-factor. I got national merit finalist status. I got rejected at all 4 ivies I applied to. I'm not a weak student (4.3, 2200 SATs). I just don't think it carries that much weight at that tier of education.</p>
<p>It is so true that being a NM finalist doesn't always help. In fact, it can help a student be denied. For instance, if your GPA is not so great when your SATs are "through the roof", you look like a "lazy waste of high potential" to the admissions officers. Sorry for the phrase, but that was all I could think of at this hour. : )</p>
<p>Also, in terms of getting into an Ivy, I think that you have to work super super hard to distinguish yourself from a crowd. As with the comment from Visirale, there are many great, qualified students who get rejected. To me, this happens because everyone who applies is great and some ways that the admissions officers distinguish between great people is by reading their essays and recommondations. They also look for students who will add to the "culture" of the school. So you can be a great student but not a good match for the school community.</p>
<p>I think colleges know that Semifinalist status could mean a lot of things. You could have gotten a 205 on the PSAT in some states and become a semifinalist, while in others, a low 220s wouldn't have been enough.
Many 'commended' students may have done better than 'finalists.'</p>
<p>Me and the valedictorian in my class were both semifinalists who went on to be finalists. He was deferred then rejected from MIT, but now plans on going to Brown (though accepted at Cornell, and waitlisted at Princeton). I was rejected early from Stanford, waitlisted at Penn, and accepted at Cornell (which I'm considering choosing between that and USC, but I'm still doing Penn's waitlist). However, our salutatorian was only a commended student with a score of 219 (MA) and got into Princeton early. So it really does not matter so much, I would say.</p>
<p>Thanks takeme2cali, your input does suggest that NM status may not make or break the case of a student when applying in bulk from the same school.</p>
<p>But the question is if there are 20 students applying from the same school does it matter if you are NM Finalists or Commended or none at all.</p>
<p>Since my child school stats doesn't seem to suggest so</p>
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But the question is if there are 20 students applying from the same school does it matter if you are NM Finalists or Commended or none at all.
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<p>It might matter more in terms of teacher and guidance counselor recommendations than anything else. If a particular student is one of, say, only two NMSFs in a given year from that high school, the teachers and counselors will know it. In fact, the whole town will know it because the kid's picture will have been in the newspaper and the kid's name will have been announced on the big bulletin board outside the school. The teachers and counselor writing those recommendations will have the thought "one of this year's superstars" in the back of their minds. It can't hurt.</p>
<p>On the other hand, at my daughter's school, where there were 36 NMFs this year, being an NMF does not, by any stretch of the imagination, make a kid a "superstar." In such an environment, I don't think it means a thing.</p>
<p>Are you sure that the students accepted to Ivies and students who are NMSF are the same students? Considering that I got into two top 10 schools and another top 30 without NMSF (was commended though) it seems like it has less pull for top school admissions. Also, of my friends this year who got into Ivies, many of us were not NMSF (though we do have a mix of incredibly strong applicants, legacies, and almost all are commended).</p>
<p>One thing to consider is a student missing the cutoff by a point or two. Does that really make him weaker than a student who gets NMSF right at the cutoff? No. It could just mean luck or a stupid mistake or something along those lines. </p>
<p>Also, NMSF (or is it NMF?) are offered admissions and money on the spot at a number of colleges and that should also be taken into consideration because a student whose family earns too much to receive need based aid to an Ivy may still not be able to afford it, so it doesn't make sense to focus on those applications, but to take the automatic scholarships and apply to "better" colleges that also offer good merit aid. </p>
<p>National Merit is a good award to have on an application, but it really isn't make or break for Ivies as they really do not want to rely on one sitting of one test to judge an applicant.</p>
<p>Both my kids attend schools with large numbers of NMSFs. As to an advantage in Ivy apps...some kids choose not to go the Ivy route; they've worked insanely hard and want to have a life in college. Others feel Ivies aren't a good fit for them. Other kids take the big merit money and accelerated placement that a state honors program might offer. Ivies don't offer NMF money, unless one is selected for one of the $2500 awards from NM.</p>
<p>As Marian said, it probably makes a difference at a school where there are few NMSFs (at our local school, it averages one every other year). For a school with a critical mass of very bright kids, a student's lack of NMSF standing might hurt a little, but being NMSF would probably not be a big plus, either.</p>
<p>Besides, colleges don't look at PSAT scores for admission -- they look at SATs, which may be quite different!</p>
<p>Well...we could use some advice. Because of being a NMF, my son was offered a hefty merit package and honor college status at our large state university--which is a wonderful school and has everything from A to Z--the cost to us would be less that 5K. He was also admitted to a very prestigeous college in a exciting city that offers no merit aid--it would cost us 47k. It would be very difficult for us, but using all of our savings and earnings, we could possibly manage it without too much debt--but what happens when he wants to go on for further education--we would be broke. People looks at us as if we are nuts for not accepting the well-known school, and I know that it is a very special, life-altering place, and I don't want to push him into anything that he may end up regretting--so I am staying out of the decision, but I am having a hard time deciding what I would like him to do also--How important is that name school.</p>
<p>A well known college will remain with your son thorugh out his life starting from the first dream job to the corner office.</p>
<p>This is a myth that college won't make a difference after few years in the job.
As it is always make a difference getting the first job at companies like GOOGLE to every subsequent jobs. Whenever someone have to choose between a state college and known National university with similar stat the known National university will win.</p>