<p>My daughter is going to be a Junior. She took APUSH and Honors English 10 and got C's in both. She doesn't seem to be disciplined enough to take on extra curriculars and still succeed in school. She ended the semester with a 2.5 GPA. Her cumulative GPA used to be a 3.5 but obviously will be much lower than that now. She wants to be a marriage and family therapist but I'm very worried that she won't even get into college because of her poor performance during second semester of her sophomore year. So my question is should we stop having her pursue academic honors and just work towards a regular diploma and get B's? I am not sure that C's in honors classes are going to do much to help her. I am at my wits end with this whole situation and just really need some advice.</p>
<p>Cs in honors or AP courses are not going to help your daughter in her college applications. In her situation dialing down the courses so she gets Bs and perhaps an occasional A is clearly the right thing to do.</p>
<p>School work has to come first so extra-curriculars should be curtailed or suspended until her academic problems are succesfully dealt with. As for Academics, not all high school students are able to succeed in facing the extra challenge of Honors classes or are mature enough at that age to do more advanced work. It might not be a bad idea to have your daughter take regular junior year classes this coming year and the possibility of taking Honors or AP courses could be revisited for her senior year depending on how she does junior year with regular classes.</p>
<p>My oldest son was very disorganized and imature in high school, never took any Honors or AP courses and did not do particularly well in the classes he did take. He did get accepted at a local state university due to his SAT scores of 640 CR and 620 Math being higher than those of most of their students and the fact that state universities in California do not look at the writing section of the SAT in which he got a 540. He started as an Engineering major but soon decided to switch to Geology. His Freshman year was difficult taking “weeder” courses like Calculus with the Engineering majors since these courses are also prerequisites for Geology. During his second semester he did start showing some maturity and mental toughness that he lacked in high school and his first semester at college. He has now completed his sophomore year and finished his three semester Calculus sequence with a particularly strong performance in Calculus III. He has also gotten off to a good start in his Calculus based Physics classes and Geology courses. I have no doubt now that he is going to make it and earn at least a BS in Geology and Physics and possibly an MS in Geology.</p>
<p>Your daughter could be very similar to my son in not being ready to take on difficult academic challenges in high school but can still get into college and gain the motivation and skills to succeed there.</p>
<p>I agree that she should take regular classes and do her best in them. It would concern me that her GPA is going down. It seems to me that she should have been able to do better in those courses she took. I would be concerned that she is not buckling down and doing her work. Maybe distracted by other things in her life. </p>
<p>Friends of ours have a daughter who has always been a bright kid taking honors, gifted classes and always scoring well on the standardized tests. She did pretty well on the SATs–I’m sure she could have done better if she had put some more effort in studying for them, but still the scores were respectable. But she started showing a downward trend and took lite fare senior year to shore up her grades. Nearly every school to which she applied, called her on this. They did notice. She did not get into a number of schools that should have been very likely acceptances.</p>
<p>* She wants to be a marriage and family therapist but I’m very worried that she won’t even get into college because of her poor performance during second semester of her sophomore year.*</p>
<p>Relax. You do realize that probably every college in the nation has some students with some C’s on their high school transcripts, don’t you? Heck, there are colleges who have students who had D’s on their transcripts.</p>
<p>I’m guessing that you do know this, so what is your real concern?</p>
<p>What schools would your D be applyin to?</p>
<p>What is her cumulative GPA for the last 2 years?</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Take a step back and decompress. It’s very frustrating, but this is a time to press strategy, not to fret or panic. It’s going to be okay. </p></li>
<li><p>Temporarily dial back some, but not all, of the academic rigor - get a few successes under the belt.</p></li>
<li><p>Temporarily dial back on the ECs. Being fully committed to less is more anyway. </p></li>
<li><p>Reset. Focus on regaining positive momentum and rebuilding confidence. </p></li>
<li><p>Push forward and ramp up again strategically and gradually. It’s not too late to get back on track.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Her cumulative gpa will be around 3.0- not high enough to be accepted into most of the state colleges which require around a 3.4. She hasn’t taken the SAT yet but she’s a year behind in Math. Next year she is trying to double up in Math and take Algebra 2 and Geometry, but she ended this year with a C - in Algebra after taking two years of pre-algebra. So I’m worried about her ending up with 2 more C’s in her transcripts. She wants to go to a small, private college which I’m sure there are some that would take her but without financial help we can’t afford it and her gpa is too low to be in the area of consideration for merit aid.</p>
<p>She should take the level of classes that she can do well in, while still being a bit challenging. Based on her past performance, she should take regular level classes. There is no problem taking regular level classes. You mention that she is a year behind in math? Did you switch school districts or was she placed in below level math? Has she ever been tested for learning differences? </p>
<p>I’d also disagree with taking her out of ECs completely. ECs give girls confidence and a positive social place to belong. If she has to spend so many hours studying that she can’t fit in at least one or two ECs, something else is a problem. Good luck!</p>
<p>Not sure why she is doubling up in math, especially if math has been a problem for her. She has two more years, so she could do geometry one year, and algebra 2 another year, right? That satisfies the math requirement at most schools, and many schools recognize that some kids don’t do as well in all subjects, especially math. I would keep the stress down if possible.</p>
<p>Everyone else had good advice: ramp down the academics, but keep honors in a subject or maybe two subjects that she can do well in, and is interested in.</p>
<p>Extracurriculars can really make a difference in a student’s development. It is good, by junior year, to focus in on one or two areas that the student really enjoys. Is she a theater kid, a musician or does she mainly like to volunteer in the community? Does she do a craft or art? School newspaper? Often taking an interest that has been pursued at school, and applying it outside of school (writing for the local paper, volunteering at a local theater of social service agency etc.) can be inspiring.</p>
<p>A fifteen year-old really isn’t going to know what she wants to do in life, for work. It is great that she wants to be a family and marriage therapist but most students change goals, and intended majors, many times. Just encourage her to do the best she can, find her areas of strength and interest, and have two good years that remain in high school.</p>
<p>She will get in somewhere that will work out just fine. Help her consider many options for college, in a positive manner, so that she can feel good about her applications and admissions when they happen. In other words, give her the feeling of success whether she gets into a small private with merit aid, or ends up at a public that is more affordable. Reaching high is great but too many kids end up disappointed when it doesn’t work out. Laying the groundwork to avoid that seems to help.</p>
<p>I agree with Compmom on the math. I would also say it’s good for kids to push themselves academically. Our job as parents is to make sure what they are doing is reasonable. That they have balance in life which means a mix of academics and life experiences (think sports, music, arts, clubs etc.) I think it is not healthy to be focused on which college or what major with a sophomore. I think it is healthy to be looking over the proposed schedule for the next two years and tweaking it. You might consider suggesting she take one AP or one honors class at a time. What are her goals and what is she thinking is also an important part of the equation? Kids that whiz through elementary and middle school often hit bumps sophomore year so focus on her capabilities helping her excel in areas she can and helping her tweak the schedule in areas of weakness.</p>
<p>Normally English is her strength but she spent so much time on APUSH that her English grade suffered. She is doubling up on Math because she is a year behind in Math for academic honors diploma. Our state colleges prefer this diploma when making admissions decisions. We told her last night not to worry about academic honors but she really wants to do it. She’s also worried about her sat due to being behind in math.</p>
<p>1) First of all, doubling up on math after getting a C- in Algebra is a terrible idea. </p>
<p>I believe that algebra is actually something that every responsible adult needs to master to avoid getting ripped off by people in the financial industry. </p>
<p>Frankly, she needs immediate tutoring in Algebra just to learn the material, all future math classes depend on mastering Algebra. A C- isn’t really good enough. She may even be better off just repeating Algebra, or buying the Thinkwell package. I don’t know how high she can score on the SAT math without Algebra II, but I think it’s still good enough as long as there is mastery of Algebra. </p>
<p>She should take a single, non-honors math class. She’s behind in math. It’s a fact of life, but it will only get worse without a mastery of Algebra. Graduating high school with only Algebra, Geometry and Algebra II is not a disaster. Graduating high school without mastering Algebra is. Colleges offer classes in precalculus.</p>
<p>2) She needs to definitely go for a non-honors curriculum and get better grades. AP Psych is an exception. It’s a really easy class. </p>
<p>3) Did she learn enough APUSH to be able to pass the CLEP US History exams. Those are easier than the AP exams, which given the C, she may not have scored high enough to get credit. This could help her get some credits under her belt and save you some money, or lighten her load once she gets to college. It would be a shame to waste having taken an AP class without getting the credit. </p>
<p>4) I think that she’s headed for a public college. University of Minnesota Morris is a public LAC that does not charge out of state tuition. I don’t think that she needs to attend the most competitive college to pursue her ambitions. </p>
<p>Good luck.</p>
<p>“Relax. You do realize that probably every college in the nation has some students with some C’s on their high school transcripts, don’t you? Heck, there are colleges who have students who had D’s on their transcripts.”</p>
<p>Exactly! Your DD will get into college, relax. She should aim for As and settle for some Bs. forget the honors classes or maybe take only 1.</p>
<p>ClassicRockerDad is correct. Taking Geometry and Alegebra 2 (which is considerably more difficult than Algebra I) at the same time after a C- in Algebra I and repeating Pre-algebra is a recipe for disaster. She could end up failing both courses which would destroy her GPA and make acceptance at any college problematical. In fact I would be amazed if her high school would even allow her to do something so irresponsible. I agree that ideally it would be best if she repeated Algebra I but since she is going to be a junior next year and most colleges require Algebra I, Geometry and Algebra II to be eligible for admission she does not really have the time to do that.</p>
<p>She should probably take Geometry her Junior year and attempt Algebra II her senior year. If your daughter can do that she should be able to apply to nearly all colleges and universities. She is unlikely to get a particularly good score on the Math portion of the SAT but you do want to avoid a conspicuously bad score. If she can get a 500 or better she will be alright if she applies to colleges as a Liberal Arts major. Algebra II is not really needed to get a 500 on the Math SAT I. Knowing and understanding a few basic facts can make a real difference on the SAT. Knowing the formulas for the areas of a circle, triangle and rectangle, being able to use the Pythagorian Theorem and knowing the Quadratic Formula can make the difference between an acceptable and unacceptable score. She should also have an electronic calculator that she is familiar and comfortable with and can use well.</p>
<p>Just a note of encouragement octoberdana:</p>
<p>In my second semester sophomore year of high school I ended up with a GPA somewhere around a 1.5 (flunked 3 classes, got Cs in most else) - this going from previously having been a straight A student. It was a lot of reasons but mostly, I think, I hadn’t grown into my brain yet. I was irresponsible and immature, a little rebellious (refused to do work I didn’t think would benefit me), and was also confronting the fact that I couldn’t skate by on the thinnest of blades anymore - geometry and intro chem were kicking my ass even when I studied!</p>
<p>It was okay. I pulled my grades up (mostly) during high school. I went to a top 25 liberal arts college that I still think I basically lucked into, and did well, graduated with honors and several job offers, and have already been accepted to an MBA program at the top business school in the country. Don’t worry - she still has a future and all her dreams and hopes can still <em>happen</em> even with a bad semester here and there.</p>
<p>Khan Academy may allow her to learn the material at her own pace by going backwards and relearning some of the areas giving her problems.</p>
<p>[Khan</a> Academy](<a href=“http://www.khanacademy.org/]Khan”>http://www.khanacademy.org/)</p>
<p>Are you saying that you believe she cannot gain admission to a desired state U with a 3.0? What is your in-state school and what school(s) is she targetting?</p>
<p>My step grand-S was admitted to his well-respected state U (ranked near the USNews top 100), with just about a 3.0; with zero AP or Honors classes; with limited math preparation. He did very well at University. A friend of DS was admitted to his (Tier 3, I believe, but regionally well-respected) state U with about 2.8 GPA - no honors or AP for that kid, either; also limited math preparation. None of the AP Calc for these kids; in fact, no calc or pre-calc at all in hs.</p>
<p>So, I am with those who do NOT have her double-up on math during the coming year, and have her do her best in a College Prepartory curriculum. Don’t stress about AP and Honors; if there are one or two where she feel she would do well… go for it. If not, do well in the CP classes.</p>
<p>Not enough information for me to opine about whether she should dial back her EC’s; but I am wondering why that isn’t under consideration. If she can’t handle academics and ECs, then I would usually say academics should come first… but there are exceptions, I guess.</p>
<p>ALEKS is another good online program for filling in math gaps. [What</a> is ALEKS?](<a href=“ALEKS – Adaptive Learning & Assessment for Math, Chemistry, Statistics & More”>About ALEKS)</p>
<p>Ask at your D’s HS, as they may have a site contract that would allow your D free access.</p>
<p>This thread has stayed on my mind, because I’m hoping there are some good options for the D that will alleviate some of mom’s worries. OP, can you enlighten a little more about public schools she is considering or would consider, that would be a financial fit?</p>
<p>“she ended this year with a C - in Algebra after taking two years of pre-algebra” - That concerns me the most. I agree that doubling up on math would be a challenge. Could the student somehow take one of those math classes in summer school, with tutor?</p>