<p>I fell in love with Vassar the minute I saw it. So green, so mountainous...heaven...then I did some more research. It's a top school, perfect size, and I thought I had hit the jackpot. But I want to go into Neuroscience and Music, and I haven't heard anything about the department of the latter there. I emailed the flute professor and heard zippo back. So I think I have to replace it with Oberlin. Not my dream campus, but the academics fit.</p>
<p>We can't afford to apply to all of the ones on my list, so it's between these two for a spot. Am I making the right choice?</p>
<p>Are you applying for Oberlin's conservatory? Or just CAS?</p>
<p>I'd try and get a fee waiver from your guidance councellor. I submitted all my application with them because there was no way we could have afforded it.</p>
<p>And Oberlin's student body is changing pretty quickly. My friends who are upperclassmen and recent graduates aren't happy with the way the school is going. Just a warning.</p>
<p>Also, be sure to stay overnight at Vassar. My friend did, and she told me some . . . interesting stories later.</p>
<p>Overall, I think Vassar is a better school. They are more selective and have a higher graduation rate. But, for music and neuroscience, I think Oberlin is preferable. Does Vassar have neuroscience? I did not know that. Have you checked out U of Rochester? Rochester is the best college in the country for the rare neuroscience/music combination. These subjects are strengths at Rochester.</p>
<p>Heyyyyyy, Future Obie....I'm reading thru your post and I'm thinking, sure sounds like Oberlin material .... musician, neuroscience.....yep the campus is pretty but not gorgeous, beautiful historic buildings and ugly 50's buildings, nice dorms and crappy dorms...its a real place not a confection of an ideal college. But the faculty and the student caliber?...awesome..that said, Oberlin could seem pretty out there, opinionated, conflicted, idiosyncratic, rude, fun, outrageous, serious and silly, egalitarian to a infuriating extreme (this coming from a quaker kid whos used to this stuff) , challenging, and maybe not as nurturing as other "quirky" colleges (theres that word again...) but I know its for me....and they gave me the best aid package of the 6 schools i applied to.....do the research...contact some alumni......do the all student/no parent open house visit in the fall ...you might fall in love...</p>
<p>Aika: what did your friend oppose about the new students? Are they getting too wild and party-hearty, boring and unmotivated, unsociallable or preppy? The main thing I was concerned with is the drinking. Regarding the "interesting night" at Vassar, if it refers to homosexuality, I'd be okay with that. If it refers to drugs, I'm much less tolerant (I'm a liberal prude, if that makes sense :confused: )</p>
<p>collegehelp: I looked at the UofR, and you're right, their Biological Sciences departments are amazing! The two problems I have with it: 1) It's bigger than the others I'm looking at, and 2) it snows all the time according to what I've read. But maybe that's true of the other places I'm applying to?</p>
<p>Spiker: thanks for the vote of confidence. I did notice that Oberlin was the one college that sent me materials like two days after I voiced my interest. It was kind of spooky. I got viewbooks for music and science, an application and enthusiastic letter, and this was like in November of Junior year! It would be very interesting to go to a liberal place. I grew up here in a tiny Bible-belt SoCal town, where the words "I'm a Democrat" will get you whipped. And the college experience is about expanding your horizons.</p>
<p>At U of R, the undergrad school has a smaller feel to it than you might think. U of R has a large percent of grad students who lead very separate lives. It snows a lot in Rochester, more than in most northern cities because of proximity to Lake Ontario. I happen to like the snow. A fresh snow is beautiful. Without winter, there would not be the beautiful fall and spring. Buy a goose-down jacket and Gortex boots.</p>
<p>Well, my friends said the student body's getting less intellectual and the school's in some serious financial trouble. I was basically told the incoming freshmen are a bunch of "emo" or "scenester" kids who are using artyness to fake intellectualism. When I visited, the upperclassmen I stayed with were awesome, and if I was accepted I would have attended anyway. I really really reccomend a visit to get a feel for it. </p>
<p>Vassar . . . your second guess was right. My friend on an overnight said that the girls offered her dope and coke. Not cool. Check if there's substance free-housing, then I'm sure you'd be fine. </p>
<p>Best of luck!</p>
<p>And yes, it snows all the time in Rochester; half my friends are at RIT.</p>
<p>amen tkm256...prepare to get your world rocked! I've gotten a little push back for encouraging people to really branch out and challenge themselves...but if not now...when??? if youre bold, tolerant, confident of the values that you do not want to compromise (ie pick your battles) and embrace a good argument then challenge yourself.....</p>
<p>(re Aika's post yes Oberlin is pretty druggy among some groups but I think you can avoid it if you want to there is also a substance free dorm and many "affinity group" houses. these houses are not "victim houses" as on some campuses but can be supportive environments for people who know they want to ease in.... I chose a program house based on my area of study because with my slight ADD (oh look a penny...) I know I need a quiet home rather than Animal House for my freshman year. I think Oberlin is one of the few colleges where biology/neuroscience and music are very strong. You might also check out Bates.</p>
<p>As someone who went to Oberlin and stays closely in touch, I can tell you that what Aika reports about Oberlin is flat-out wrong. The upperclass students ALWAYS think that the incoming freshmen are less intellectual, more conservative, etc. etc. They have thought that for at least 25 years...</p>
<p>And the school is not in serious financial trouble; the downturn in the economy has affected Oberlin no more than any other school. Oberlin's endowment is very, very large. No need to worry.</p>
<p>The financial trouble I mentioned has nothing to do with the economy, it has everything to do with the president sucking the school dry. I don't remember exactly what they said, but two unconnected people said the same thing. </p>
<p>right on DAve...I heard the school is in such good financial shape (due to both increased contributions, good management AND some painful but strategic cutbacks) that some Oberlin.style obstreperous students are demanding this and that, increased spending, divestiture from some corporations who are not as socially responsible as they should be, better benefits for support staff (all worthy questions i am sure) ... I am certainly benefiting from Oberlin's financial health...I thought that since I was on the wait list for a while that i might not receive the financial aid that would make this possible...but I was pleasantly surprised. As far as declining brain power goes...we always think the next class is a bunch of morons even in high school ...it just makes us feel comfortably superior....(!!!) </p>
<p>and yeah there is a big contingent of emo types, pretentious types ....there were a lot of these folks at my high school too and i learned that most of these guys are ok one on one... I saw at Oberlin first hand on my no.parents visit that people from different groups are pretty cool and relaxed with each other </p>
<p>I think the Oberlin college community takes a certain amount of turmoil in stride, .....as my fiftyish Mom said....Honey, it sure sounds familiar...</p>
<p>What I recall is as follows:
1) They have suspended their "semester in London" program, for the time being, due to the whacked exchange rates making this particular program too costly to keep going at the moment; and
2) They are changing student body selection somewhat to beef up the athletics end of things (I think). Still searching for kids who share their core values, but no reason necessarily why some such kids wouldn't also want to throw a football..
Not everyone among the student body appreciates this slight change in focus. They think that not playing sports IS a core value, up till now.</p>
<p>If you are not wedded to a neuroscience major per se but rather a great biological science department, consider also Case. It has a graduate neuroscience department in its med school but also well-repected undergraduate biology. And it is affiliated with the Cleveland Institute of Music. The two share a joint major program and students from Case perform in many well respected student ensembles - </p>
<p>Hi! I am a big fan of U of R. Yes it does snow ALOT so that is a fact of life. But the campus is fairly compact and the undergraduate enrollment is under 5,000. All of the academic buildings are connected by tunnels (I believe) so there are ways to limit your being outdoors in the snow. It's a wonderful school and it is well regarded in neuroscience and music. (eastman school). Alot of kids who apply to Rochester also look at Case, so I would suggest you check them both out. My kids and I are partial to small universities as both my d's thought LAC's would be too small and confining for them. A school like U of R does not have an overwhelming student enrollment so it may exhibit some of the feel of a school like Vassar or Oberlin-- Just bigger. Good luck.</p>
<p>monydad - Thanks for backing me up with actual facts. I'm a victim of the "new focus" (ie: rejected), and I don't think wanting athletes should hurt kids who weren't athletic. Bah.</p>
<p>And, the Dollar to GBP exchange rate is the lowest it's been in 2.5 years, if memory serves me correctly.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I emailed the flute professor and heard zippo back.
[/quote]
Did you call the music dept and see if the prof is even around? A lot of music folks spend their summers earning money by playing in summer festivals, or take the summer off to travel.</p>
<p>Very true about the flute professor who is probably between gigs and not at the college. If you are looking for the LAC experience without the pressure of the conservatory and are interested in neuroscience and music, take a look at Wesleyan in CT. Excellent research opportunities for undergrads in neuroscience and lots of extracurricular music opportunities.</p>
<p>Guiltguru's suggestion is a good one. A neuroscience/music double major is a difficult road. If your passion is more toward the neuroscience than the music, you might better look to the Vassar/Wesleyan type of experience which will afford you the opportunity to continue your interest in music, even double major in it, without competing against conservatory students. </p>
<p>You probably don't want to write off Vassar for the sole reason that you have not yet heard from the flute instructor if it seems otherwise perfect for you.</p>
<p>At Oberlin, you can apply to the school of general arts and sciences or to the conservatory. The latter requires a much more rigourous audition process and is reputedly much more difficult to gain admission to. And while students who are not accepted to the conservatory but are accepted to the Arts and Sciences college are permitted to take courses through the conservatory, note the following quote from Oberlin:</p>
<p>"Courses. Although most courses in the Conservatory are open to qualified students in the College of Arts and Sciences, in reality many Conservatory courses (or the schedules of applied music teachers) become filled entirely with Conservatory students. Thus, although efforts are made to accommodate Arts and Sciences students, they should not expect to enroll in all the Conservatory courses of their choice."</p>
<p>At both U of R and Case, the music major is through the college, not the affiliated conservatory (ie Eastman and CIM), although at Case (and most likely U of R) you have the benefits of the affiliation.</p>