<p>Historically, Vanderbilt was not as selective as Northwestern. But Vanderbilt caught up in the last two years (not sure how). When you compare selectivity, you should consider the school mix. Engineering schools are gonna be more stats driven than journalism schools. Also some schools put more efforts to get a more geographically or racially diverse class and in the process, may let their scores drop slightly.</p>
<p>75% of Vandy’s student body are in the college of arts and sciences or engineering; for NU, it’s 69%. Almost all of the remaining students at Vandy are in their education school, which is ranked #1 in the country (the music school is extremely tiny). Northwestern also has more racially diverse student body. Given these facts, for you to claim Vandy is more selective in the schools of arts and sciences or engineering, its overall test score need to be 20-30 points higher and even at that point, it’s still probably not conclusive. </p>
<p>But that NU is ranked higher in nearly every field is a fact. :D</p>
<p>Vanderbilt didn’t catch up to Northwestern – it surpassed it. Northwestern accepted 23%, compared to 16% for Vanderbilt. Vanderbilt’s test scores surged this past year and are higher than those at Northwestern (this is for enrolled students):
SAT: 1400- 1560 [2070-2330]</p>
<p>The diversity numbers seem pretty comparable to me – the one exception is Northwestern has more Asians. In the United States, Asians make up 4.8% of the population so in terms of demographics Northwestern is just overrepresented at a larger rate than Vanderbilt. Both schools have good diversity.</p>
<p>NU hasn’t even published 2012/13 data; you don’t know Vandy’s scores are higher unless you have some insider knowledge. Nobody cares about the small difference of 10-30 points even if it’s higher. NU has more students in schools that are less stats-driven. Vandy doesn’t have a rich history of producing many Putlizer-Prize winners, directors, and producers like Northwestern does.</p>
<p>Vanderbilt has a rich literary history. The Fugitives and Agrarians are two of the most famous literary groups which both had their start at Vanderbilt – among the writers, Robert Penn Warren (only person to win Pulitzer Prize in both poetry and fiction, most famous for the classic novel All The Kings Men). In terms of literature, Vanderbilt is also the birthplace of “New Criticism” which became a dominate mode of textual analysis. There are also Academy Award winning directors/producers who went to Vanderbilt if you look through our alumni list. Along with Nobel Peace Prize Winners (Al Gore and Muhammad Yunus won it back to back), Nobel Peace Prize scientists, former Supreme Court Justices, US Senators, famous musicians (Amy Grant), famous entrepreneurs (creators of Bain & Company/Boston Consulting Group). Also, John Arnold went to Vanderbilt who was one of the world’s youngest billionaire after graduating after three years of Econ at Vandy and became probably the one most famous traders for energy (see Centaurus Energy).</p>
<p>Feel free to try and debate Vandy and NU academics, but lets be honest, Northwestern’s ranked higher in most every department, but it’s fairly negligible. Northwestern’s more well known in the Midwest, I’m sure, but Vanderbilt is probably more well known in the South. Either way, Vanderbilt’s maybe a bit “inferior” academically but both are extremely close in that regard. Unless someone’s going into Journalism, Theater, or some other extreme specialty of NU, I wouldn’t base it on academic reputation.</p>
<p>NU vs VU debate is slitting hairs. It comes down to feel and fit for each student. There are 3,000+ colleges out there. All the top 20 schools (and many others) offer great career opportunities and academics. If you look at the top 20 schools and ask which offer “the total college experience” the list includes: Stanford, Duke, NU, Vanderbilt and Notre Dame. Pick your own order, you can’t go wrong.</p>
<p>Those rankings that you refer to are rankings of graduate programs. The OP is interested in undergraduate quality, for which measures of the qualities of the schools’ student bodies, undergraduate teaching, student to faculty ratios, undergraduate research opportunities, and the like are much more relevant. I would actually be inclined to give Vandy the edge here because it’s smaller, but they’re both mid-sized and they should be fairly comparable in many ways at this level. </p>
<p>Neither one is significantly more targeted than the other by banks or consulting firms. Northwestern will be better for Chicago placement, without a doubt, but I sincerely doubt that it will have any advantage at all for NYC. Vandy has a new program called “Vandy Meets the Street” which allows undergrads to go to New York and network with Vandy alumni and meet recruiters (most firms brought their HR departments along) at top firms on Wall St. This year BAML, Jefferies, Cantor Fitzgerald, and JP Morgan were there for Ibanking; Blackrock was there for FMA; Deutsche Bank was there for S&T; and Citi and Goldman were each there for both S&T and Ibanking. Vandy also has a new finance mentoring program which matches upperclassmen whom have had internships in finance with underclassmen whom themselves are aiming for finance. Vandy’s real strength is placing into Dallas, Houston, Atlanta, Charlotte, and other Southern locations, but it has respectable placement across the country. </p>
<p>I’ll take a stab at your question about hazing, OP. Hazing isn’t any more of a problem at Vandy than it is at Northwestern or most other schools throughout the country with active Greek scenes. In fact, Vandy greek organizations themselves have so strongly opposed the practice of hazing recently that I would go so far as to say that it’s more of a problem with our sports teams (womens soccer and womens LAX, apparently, and although we do not know what exactly they were convicted for, it was minor enough that they themselves were not aware that what they did was considered hazing). I think that most of the stigma attached to Vandy’s greek scene comes from the fact that Vandy students just party a lot in general. That said, you don’t need to be Greek to have a good social life or even to get into Greek parties. If you want to get into a frat party, just get to know one of the brothers and you’ll be good to go. I really should underscore that this is a very friendly, welcoming community; the social scene is very active – as you know – but also very inclusive. If you are concerned about being subjected to hazing, you need not be.</p>
<p>A quick research should let you know Northwestern has lower student to faculty ratio. The only reason Northwestern has more undergrads is that it has more colleges. You mentioned undergrad research opportunities. Well, it’s the faculty that bring in the research in the first place and graduate rankings reflect that strength. Northwestern has been one of the top producers of Goldwater and Fulbright scholarship winners in the past decade and the abudance of undergrad research opportunities has played a significant role.</p>
<p>neg·li·gi·ble [neg-li-juh-buhl]
adjective
so small, trifling, or unimportant that it may safely be neglected or disregarded: The extra expenses were negligible.</p>
<p>It is a fact that Northwestern is higher ranked, however I said that it is “so small, trifling, or unimportant that it may safely be neglected or disregarded” which means I don’t think the slight boost in the rankings is important. And, by the way, graduate school rankings means that department is strong, which means research, professors, etc. are strong. Some professors teach Grad and Undergrad, so having a great grad program correlates to a great undergrad program. Plus undergrads can join graduate research, so that adds to the departmental ratings. Also, NU is also higher ranked in USWNR and other undergraduate rankings, again, negligible, but still ranked better for undergrad too.</p>
<p>I care SO little about being in finance that all of your attempting to make Vandy sound more impressive in being recruited really doesn’t matter to me at all. Northwestern has a better name in the North, Vandy in the south, but either one is going to have a better chance than someone who went to a less prestigious school.</p>
<p>As a Southerner, Vandy is a presitious college in south where all the smartest people in south go. Northwestern is just one of the good colleges in north. I would definitely go for vandy.</p>
<p>Student to faculty ratio is just one of the items that I mentioned, and both schools exceed here. Anyway, my point was that they’re comparable insofar as pertinent undergraduate resources are concerned.
True, the faculty are what allow for high-level research to be conducted, but the importance of the research that one is assigned should not matter for an undergraduate. Undergrads make very small contributions to graduate-level research at either school; they receive benefit from honing their skills in scientific inquiry. There are more than enough undergrad research opportunities to go around at Vanderbilt.</p>
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<p>I understand that you said that the differences in rank between the two was negligible, but you DID make a point of stating the difference nonetheless. I’m not one to parse small details myself, but I do feel that I should point out that using very questionable rankings to substantiate your point is itself a questionable practice. </p>
<p>I agree that a great grad program does correlate with a great undergraduate program, generally speaking. However, this would not be because the professors between the two programs are the same. A very distinguished professor – such as a nobel laureate – will not necessarily be a better lecturer than an ordinary PhD from the same field, as both will know more than enough to properly instruct undergraduate classes; in fact, top LACs such as Williams and Amherst are renowned for the quality of instruction that their undergraduates receive, despite the lecturers at these colleges being less “distinguished” than their counterparts at major research universities. This is because they have developed the orational skills, charisma, and other traits that truly determine teaching capability. </p>
<p>Also, I brought up campus recruiting because wildcatalum (see post #3) started a discussion on it. I included specific details to lend myself credence, but I was in no way trying to prove Vandy’s superiority to you.</p>
<p>^ kdy0218, I don’t know that Northwestern is “just one of the good colleges” regardless of its location, which should be considered Mid-West and not grouped with the abundance of northeast schools you are probably associating it with. It is a GREAT college and should be viewed as its own entity, as should Vanderbilt. The supposed lack of comparable prestigious colleges in a school’s vicinity (not the case for the south at all, think Duke, UVA, Rice, William&Mary, Emory, etc.) should not make the case for a school’s being more or less prestigious.</p>
<p>Northwestern is world famous in business and journalism. Top chemistry PhD candidates from around the world come to NU too. Apparently, this Southerner misses all that.</p>
<p>It’s not just one ranking. I don’t really pay attention to the rankings that much (it’s not a major factor, whatsoever, in my choosing NU as my top college), but for one college to top the other in pretty much every ranking means something, no matter how small. Let’s be honest, Vanderbilt is “just one of the good colleges in” the South. Northwestern is not “in north” it’s actually in the midwest and there are fewer great colleges in the midwest, than in the South. In the midwest all I can think of (add some if I’m not hitting them all) are UChicago, Northwestern, U of M, and then some LAC’s. South you have, like someone said, Duke, UVA, Rice, William & Mary, Emory, GA tech, UNC, Rhodes, Davidson, etc.</p>
<p>Sam Lee, it really isn’t part of the Northwestern brand equity to dump on a peer or close-peer college. Northwestern’s a great school. Vanderbilt’s a great school. In the absence of significant financial difference, or in the absence of a program in which one is clearly superior to the other (e.g., theatre at NU), this comes down to personal preference. We’re happy with who we are; we don’t need to denigrate other perfectly fine appropriate choices nor dragoon everyone into agreeing that NU is superior. </p>
<p>There are other top 20 schools (particularly one with a one-syllable name) where it IS part of the brand equity to assert superiority over close competitor schools loudly and gracelessly. But we aren’t them, and thank goodness.</p>
<p>Posting a link to WallStreetOasis and summarizing what those posters wrote doesn’t mean I “dump on” or “denigrate” another school. The OP is asking about NYC recruiting and there’s nothing wrong to direct him to the site that addresses it and that says one is more of a target than another. Whether you agree or not is up to you. I have no problem with people saying Wharton is more of a target than Northwestern; it doesn’t mean Northwestern isn’t great. It seems so PC for you to call me out; what about the Vandy fans coming here and saying our girls and tailgates are inferior? Show some school spirit and protect your own house!</p>