Nurturing, liberal LAC or Univ honors prgm that gives merit aid?

College Search & Selection
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<p>I've just spent the last year or so guiding/advising my older (h.s. senior) daughter in her college app process, and have neglected my younger (h.s. junior) daughter in this area. It's way past time to try to narrow down some schools and plan visits with D2, which is what we're FINALLY working on now. </p>

<p>I'd be grateful for advice on LACs or University honors programs that are more nurturing and cooperative (versus ultra-competitive and cut-throat) and that are more liberal versus conservative. Also, the possibility of merit aid is important, as we do not qualify for need-based aid. She is not interested in schools for women only or schools in the South or in Texas. :(</p>

<p>She would like to major in something like biology/biological sciences/microbiology/neuroscience and minor in something like English. She thinks she may want to be a doctor or researcher some day.</p>

<p>Her stats: 2400 SAT, 36 ACT, ranked 1/~585, 98.8xx gpa uw.
Her ECs and awards revolve around chemistry, math and English/literature/writing.</p>

<p>Other interests that she has mentioned: </p>

<p>Molecular bio, neuroscience, open curriculum, strong English + writing, flexibility of switching majors, medium to small size (but that is not a deal-breaker), research opportunities, hospital and other health-related volunteer opportunities, good pre-med advising, no religious affiliation, little to no Greek life, prefer city if possible.</p>

<p>We've done some research trying to find merit aid opportunities and good pre-med advising and this is what we've come up with:</p>

<p>Schools that might fit her that offer merit aid:</p>

<p>CalTech
Carnegie Mellon
Claremont-McKenna
Clark
Grinnell
Harvey Mudd
Kenyon
Northwestern
Univ of Chicago
Wash U</p>

<p>Schools that might fit her, but NO merit aid available:</p>

<p>Carleton
Colby
Colgate
Haverford
Pomona
Reed
Wesleyan
Williams</p>

<p>Can you offer comments on these schools or suggestions on other schools, especially wrt their environment (cooperative, liberal)? I am especially clueless about honors programs within various universities. Thank you for your advice.</p>

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<p>honestly…for neuroscience or micro she could try Un. of Pitt… if she’s going for pre med, she’d be an idiot not to go there. They have the UPMC’s with lots of research opportunity and a great med school
they have a very good honors program and she would nearly certainly get merit based aid…possibly a full ride
not only that, but i don’t think its cut throat at all…i have a few friends down there who enjoy it immensely and they are all bleeding heart liberals…
it is in the heart of Pittsburgh which is a very livable(and affordable city)…
there is greek life, but its pretty insignificant…</p>

<p>also, there are joint ventures in their neuroscience that sshe could take classes at CMU and pitt, which are both excellant schools…
id say take a look!!</p>

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<p>How far East or away does daughter want to go? I found out recently that Bucknell in PA (highly selective LAC with undergrad engineering) now has very selective Bioengineering offered. By very selective, I mean acceptance is @30% and the program is in their engineering program which is fifth in country according to US News for colleges with undergraduate terminating Engineering degress. Great school for faculty and facilities but very secluded.</p>

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<p>Just wanted to put a word in for Claremont McKenna. I majored in Math and Biology there years ago (graduated in '94 so I’m kind of old), but I loved the Joint Science Center, took classes at Mudd, Pomona, etc. and was just generally ecstatic about my experience. I was able to do research there and got a prestigious internship working on the Human Genome Project (it was cutting edge back then) at LLNL. I ultimately decided not to go pre-med and went into consulting. Kind of a random lane change but something that was probably only possible b/c I was at Claremont and exposed to so many things. Everyone I know who applied to Med School got in – actually there were only two of us who even got Jt Science honors and we were two of the only folks not going to Med School, so even the average students got in pretty easily. Also, the merit aid was great. I was lucky in that I did qualify for Financial Aid, but I also received sizable merit awards and overall CMC was cheaper than Berkeley or UCLA (my other leading contenders.</p>

<p>As far as some of the others on your list, my husband graduated undergrad from Mudd and got his PhD in Physics from Caltech. Both places can be tough if you’re looking for a more well rounded experience. It helps that at Mudd you have the consortium, but women are still in the minority at Mudd and it can be a little strange socially. As far as Caltech, my husband coached the XC team for a while when he was a grad student and while the student body is out of this world intelligent, it can also come across a little strange. No where near as well-rounded and diverse as MIT or some larger places.</p>

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<p>Thanks very much, you guys!</p>

<p>@momma1777: PA is not too far, so thanks for the info on Bucknell.</p>

<p>@oldcmcalum: Thanks for the info on CMC. Someone recommended Pomona, but then we found out it has no merit aid. It sounds like from what you said, CMC is definitely worth looking at. (When we go visit in the early summer, I hope she won’t fall in love with Pomona instead!)</p>

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<p>Bowdoin College, Carleton College, Amherst, Swarthmore</p>

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<p>You should have her look at Bard College. They have two merit scholarships that would work for your daughter - one for students ranked in the top 10 of their school (top 10, not 10%) they offer the same price as in state tuition at your public institution. And for those interested in science they have some full tuition scholarships. They have other merit awards, as well, for other interests, which are extensive. Seriously strong in creative writing and they’re building up their sciences about which I’ve heard really good things. Only downside for her - it’s definitely not in a city - although New York City is about 2 hours away.</p>

<p>As an aside, my older son’s roommate at CMC was pre-med and had no trouble getting into med school. Their merit aid, however, is not that extensive. 10K, I believe. On the other hand, their financial aid is great. I wouldn’t exactly call CMC liberal - but, it is a school which encourages differing views.</p>

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<p>she’s definitely a solid candidate for merit aid at top schools. if i were you i wouldn’t even bother with those offering no merit aid unless she feels strongly about certain schools. From your list, here’s my take;</p>

<p>Reaches- CalTech, Harvey Mudd, Northwestern, Univ of Chicago, Wash U
Matches- Carnegie Mellon, Claremont-McKenna, Grinnell
Safeties- Clark, Kenyon</p>

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<p>Important to bear in mind: If she really is keen on going to medical school, then she might want to consider the grade policies at different schools because medschool admission is very numbers-based. Mudd and CalTech would probably not give her the greatest GPA for medical school.</p>

<p>I would put Swarthmore on the list as well. Near to Philly, good in bio, definitely the liberal-artsy-flexibility too. It offers merit aid, but I understand that’s very very competitive. </p>

<p>Also, if CalTech and Mudd are there, why not MIT? I know MIT doesn’t give merit aid, but their FA program is pretty awesome on the off-chance that you’re borderline.</p>

<p>I support the suggestion Mudd, I’m going there this fall :slight_smile: Nowadays, the women-men ratio isn’t even that skewed! (much better than CalTech) Plus, I’ve heard that women are eligible for the minority scholarships (lol) on Facebook, so that’s another merit scholarship available at Mudd. Research opportunities are abundant at Mudd, however, there’s a pretty restrictive Core.</p>

<p>I concur with the suggestion of WUStL, they have some pretty good merit aid programs. Plus it’s recommended for premed :)</p>

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<p>I’m familiar with Reed (D1 graduates next month):</p>

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<p>D2 deserves HPY or another ultra-elite school.</p>

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<p>Austinhills, My son is a Williams graduate. Williams has excellent sciences and academics overall. Excellent English with good writing focus. Double (or even triple) majors in disparate discipines are common. Very strong pre-med advising, internships, research opportunities. </p>

<p>It is rural and insular but rates highly on the nurturing, supportive scale. Liberal, but not overtly political. Williams generally does not offer merit, however, your daughter may qualify for the Tyng scholarship. This award is ostensibly need based, but I’m not sure how need is determined.</p>

<p>Blithely ignoring her women’s and Southern go no zones :slight_smile: I would suggest that your daughter look at Emory. Most likely she could qualify as an Emory scholar.</p>

<p>And at Smith, which offers excellent sciences and generous merit. It’s also part of a five college consortium which opens up more social options.</p>

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<p>Heh momrath, I had a college to recommend but because of the no-go zones… Well I’ll suggest Rice then.</p>

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<p>"Her stats: 2400 SAT, 36 ACT, ranked 1/~585, 98.8xx gpa uw.
Her ECs and awards revolve around chemistry, math and English/literature/writing.</p>

<p>Other interests that she has mentioned: </p>

<p>Molecular bio, neuroscience, open curriculum, strong English + writing, flexibility of switching majors, medium to small size (but that is not a deal-breaker), research opportunities, hospital and other health-related volunteer opportunities, good pre-med advising, no religious affiliation, little to no Greek life, prefer city if possible."</p>

<p>All of these qualities are satisfied by Harvard, and with your daughter’s stats and varied interests maybe she would be interested in H or another Ivy. But admittedly I would not say Harvard provides a ‘nurturing’ environment and it has no merit aid. However it has better financial aid than other schools.</p>

<p>I am curious as to why your daughter has not considered any Ivies when her profile is obviously Ivy - Caliber and Ivies probably offer some of the best liberal arts educations?</p>

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<p>Swarthmore offers very little merit aid, but it has generous need-based aid. It is very hard to get into, though–17 percent. But your daughter sounds like a strong candidate. I have also heard a lot of good about Claremont-McKenna and Harvey Mudd.</p>

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<p>I’ll have to agree with Fiona - Check out Rice. Don’t let any preconceived notions of Texas hold y’all back from a visit to Rice - its the best of small & nurturing while still being Ivy League-ish. Check out the Rice-Baylor program for Medicine. Plus, the area of Houston right around the University, looks like a Northeastern college-town suburb.</p>

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<p>Rice. It’s the place to be if you want to go the pre-med route. A bunch of research opportunities with the atmosphere of a LAC, and amazing academics. Additionally, it’s smack in the middle, or pretty close to smack in the middle of the largest medical center in the world = bunch of internships/opportunities for premeds who want to make their applications stand out. I should also mention that the med school acceptance rate of Rice is always a solid mid-90%. I chose Rice over Amherst because of the amazing nurturing liberal arts college-y atmosphere, and the numerous research opportunities for undergrads. Got to love the college system. Plus there are tame squirrels as big as your head spread out throughout the campus. Financial aid is also amazing, my fin. aid package was by far the best. I will add that although Rice is in TX, it is not, by any stretch of the imagination, conservative. I believe Harris county went blue in the 2008 elections. I’m also positive your daughter has a good chance of getting into Rice/Baylor, which is one of the best undergrad-med deals.</p>

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<p>I am cracking up at the Rice suggestions, certainly not because of academic reasons!!! It sounds like this talented young lady would like to explore something other than her home state, to the dismay of her mom.</p>

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<p>Rochester- merit aid, fantastic small university, great for neuroscience and english</p>

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<p>Wow, what a treat to log in and find all of this great advice - thank you all so much!</p>

<p>Rice is at the top of MY list for D2, but not hers. :frowning: (Lol at the “tame squirrels as big as your head”, markos.) I’ve been talking up Rice ever since D2 was young (saying that the academics are great and the residential houses sound like Hogwarts houses). She’s mentioned that if she ends up going to school in Texas, she’d rather go to UT (Austin over Houston), where she’d be an auto-admit under the top 10% law, and where she’d try for an honors program like Plan II or Dean’s Scholars. Again, :(</p>

<p>@SpiritManager - $10K merit aid is doable, I think. We need something $10K or more to ease the burden of having two in college and potentially having D2 go on to grad or med school. We’ve run the #s and we don’t qualify for financial aid at all, even with two in college. We’ll look into Bard College, especially its science offerings. Thanks!</p>

<p>@collegeprep11 - Yes, that’s kinda my feeling - not to look at colleges that don’t offer merit aid unless she really, really feels strongly about certain schools. MIT, Stanford, Amherst and Tufts fall into that “feel strongly” category for her right now, and she said if she loves them enough after visiting, she would work on trying to get some outside, independent scholarships.</p>

<p>@fiona - Thanks for the reminder about grade deflation. Frankly, schools like MIT, Mudd and CalTech kinda scare me, not only because of (what I perceive to be) their excruciating workloads, but also their lack of English/writing/liberal arts offerings which are important to her. </p>

<p>@vossron - thanks for going thru Reed point by point. I think Reed sounds just about perfect, but it doesn’t give merit aid, so we’d be paying ~$52,000 sticker price for 4 years. Ouch. (Btw, I should have taken “open curriculum” off of the list.) </p>

<p>@momrath - thanks for the pointer to the Tyng scholarship. You’re right, it’s need-based. But even with a high EFC, the FAFSA spits out $3500 loan of some kind, so I’m not sure if that means $3500 would be the max that she could get if she were to somehow be chosen for Tyng? Anyway, worth investigating - thanks.</p>

<p>@misnomer and breall - no possibility of merit aid from Ivies is the reason. If we qualified for need-based aid, we’d be looking at them. (What is it called when the FAFSA says you can afford to pay, but you really can’t - the “middle class squeeze”?)</p>

<p>@huskem55 - thanks for mentioning Rochester. It sounds super cold, though. However, maybe some of the other schools we’ve put on the list are super-cold, too - I’m just not sure.</p>

<p>Thanks again for your comments, and please keep adding them!</p>