Official College Visit

Parent Cafe
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<p>I like cmbmom's advice about being honest (if asked) about making a couple of other visits before final decision. Isn't that the best path for all concerned? Doesn't the coach have a stake in making sure the athletes he chooses actually like the school/town/trip from home/weather/TEAM and so on? I would think a coach with an ounce of humanity would understand and appreciate this logic. One who doesn't might be raising a big red flag.</p>

<p>This thread is reading my mind. Thank you so much.</p>

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<p>I agree riverrunner about being honest. My daughter is planning on telling coach "A" that she has another visit if she asks, but is afraid that the coach might move on down her list of recruits. She loves both schools (we went for unofficial visits in the summer) and could be happy at either. She is hoping to figure out which team is a better "fit" for her.</p>

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<p>The message we got loud and clear from one coach (at S's dream school) was that he wanted my son to play for him. He was ready for my son to commit. We'd just been out to see another top program that was waffling (i.e. we expect to figure it out in 3 weeks). This was mid-July.</p>

<p>Coach 1 said quite plainly: I want you and I want to take your folder to admissions ASAP. When you give me a verbal committment, I won't recruit anyone else for your spot until admissions gives me a yea or a nay. In the meantime, you need to waffle with any other schools. I don't want you to burn your bridges until I know we have something solid here for you.</p>

<p>He did get a positive read from admissions in mid August -- and two days later Coach 2 called and asked him to commit to them. Just a bit late!</p>

<p>Now, if my S had waffled with Coach 1 -- he might or might not have evenutally had a slot -- but the coaches are pretty clear that they need to get their ducks in a row and they aren't going to wait forever for a recruit to have six offers on the table and play them off against each other.</p>

<p>I am quite sure that this all varies by sport, league, school, and division -- so your mileage will vary!</p>

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<p>Thanks cnp55!</p>

<p>While this recuiting process is all very exciting, the uncertainity is so stressful. I wish I had a crystal ball right now!</p>

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<p>To the OP lot of great advice given so far. </p>

<p>I also suggest you go to <a href="http://www.ncaa.org%5B/url%5D"&gt;www.ncaa.org&lt;/a> and read the recruiting rules for the sport and division in which your child is interested. For example, there is a limit of how many official recruiting visits your child can accept ... so you may want to "budget" these to schools of high interest. Recruits can make as many "unofficial" visits as they want ... the difference between official and unofficial can include who pays and what activities are allowed. The IVY league has it's own restrictions that make life a little different also ... for example, the IVY league does not have national letter of intent (nli) so for a school without ED the best a student (EA) or a school (likely letter) can do is not a firm commitment like many DI schools/athletes can make with NLIs.</p>

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<p>Even a signed NLI is NOT a firm commitment that the D-1 school will take you even if you meet NCAA standards. Every year a few players get dinged at the last minute. Steve Spurrier went nuts when some of his recruits were dinged by SC.</p>

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<p>While this article is over a year old, still might make interesting reading for all the posters here who seem to be getting ready to send recruited athletes to Ivy League schools for official visits.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.thecrimson.harvard.edu/article.aspx?ref=512914%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.thecrimson.harvard.edu/article.aspx?ref=512914&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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<p>Thanks dogwood, very enlightening!</p>

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<p>Daughter's first official seemed to go OK this past weekend. Three more to go.</p>

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<p>zoid - Was your daughter told where she stood? Was she asked to commit?</p>

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<p>No. She was not asked directly at the visit but we do expect a follow up call or e-mail this week just to ask her how she felt about the visit. Most officials will end after the first week of October so we found with the first child that this was the time that coaches will push for commitment. Right now they are just bringing everyone in over the next three weeks.</p>

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<p>Thanks zoid, I'm just trying to get an idea of what we might expect when my daughter goes on her first official visit this weekend!</p>

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<p>This is a complex area. Let me commend to your reading an in-depth series published in the New York Times two years back (Fall 2005) on the recruiting process, under the heading The Athletes Edge. It focused on Haverford College, and had multi-month tracks of various athletes through the process, and deep dive interviews with several coaches. It is on their premium service now, but probably well worth the price. Good tales of the surprises from both sides - students and coaches - as they worked through the admissions process.</p>

<p>There is a major asymmetry of information in this process: The coaches understand the dance and do it many times over the years they serve. For athletes it is all new, one-time learning, and not much better for parents. There is also an extensive, and sometimes very carefully coded language used by the coaches. Here, for example, is quote from Mike Murphy, the mens lacrosse coach at Haverford:
Most high school athletes have instead learned to ask each coach how much playing time they will get. It is a way to measure the coach's interest -- if you understand the code.</p>

<p>''I listen to everything coaches say to me carefully,'' said Elizabeth Sugden, a 17-year-old volleyball player from suburban Chicago, who attended Haverford's recruiting event. Sugden is considering a handful of colleges, including Washington University in St. Louis and the University of Chicago. ''There are clues to where you stand.''</p>

<p>Murphy, the lacrosse coach, agreed. When it comes to the playing time question, he says he answers truthfully.</p>

<p>''To some kids I will say, 'You can help us,''' Murphy said. ''Unfortunately, some kids will hear that and envision playing as a freshman and scoring 30 goals. But what I mean is that I think they can play, but probably not in a leading role.</p>

<p>''For the next level of recruit, I will tell them, 'You can start for us.' Which means they can start eventually. Next, I'll say, 'You can start early for us.' And the next step would be, 'You're a potential all-conference player.' The last response is, 'You're a potential all-American and will start as a freshman.' I pass the same assessment on to the admissions department.'' </p>

<p>One more thought: Coaches can evaporate with no warning - they can get fired, tired, or move to a better job. I follow lacrosse closely, and the uniform advice for athletes there - especially at the more volatile DII and DIII levels - is "Pick the school because you want to go there even without the sport - not for the coach. The coach can leave you high and dry - but you'll still be at the school". </p>

<p>Good luck to all this process.</p>

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<p>Child went on first official visit last week and also had a great time, would go there in a second. All coach did was ask where else we have visits scheduled, and when, and hinted he would call right after the next visit this week. I think that's when the pressure will start, but I guess that's a good problem. Since then we've scheduled another visit in a couple weeks. We'd like the chance to see schools #2 and 3 but the big risk in all of this is if the coach has a set number of slots, do we risk him moving on to someone else willing to commit rather than wait for us? By the way, on our visit, they went to a couple of on-campus parties which included the usual college stuff so your kid should be prepared for that. Mine had a great time, uh oh.</p>

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<p>As I said before, it is a giant poker game. By this point, your child should have a sense of their #1, 2 and 3 just like the coaches know their top recruits. You should be quick to respond if #1 offers and stale a bit if #2 comes first. That will give you time to get back to #1. That is how the game is played.</p>

<p>As for parties, it is college after all. My sense is the team is trying to make it very desirable to be there. Besides it is the beginning of the school year. Things settle down as you get deeper into the semester.</p>

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<p>Ct-Woods:</p>

<p>I know that your view reflects the standard wisdom, but I disagree. The problem is that prospective students may think that they will love a school, no applicant--athlete or not--really knows if he is going to like a school until he has been there for a while. On the other hand, by asking around and forming his own impressions, he can get a pretty good sense of the coach, the perosn who will be the most important adult in his life. yes, the coach may leave, but the crapshoot which follows is really noworse than making a college choice based on a short visit generally.</p>

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<p>I think Zoid has given very good advice. The recruited athlete has to make commitments earlier than other students. At this point, going on official visits, a student should have a pretty good idea which school is number one on his clipboard and be ready to make a commitment. It's not easy, especially when non-recruited classmates are still making up their lists.</p>

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<p>Re NCAA Clearinghouse site: be sure to fill out the "Amateurism Questionnaire" when you register your athlete on the site. I think you have to have to be registered prior to making official visits. </p>

<p>The site is a bit unclear - it makes reference to "signing" this questionaire but does not provide an opportunity to do so. I called them and they said there was a lot of confusion over this and that they plan to put something up on the website to explain it. Apparently, the questionaire gets filled out now but the athlete does not sign it until next April.</p>

<p>Yes, five visits are the maximum allowed. I don't think Division III coaches offer "official" visits, but I could be wrong on that one.</p>

<p>I DO believe that coaches speak with one another. I don't have proof, but I have a hard time believing that the coaches in the same conference don't talk when they are frequently recruiting the same pool of athletes. </p>

<p>We have advised our S's to be very honest with coaches as to where they are visiting, and to get back quickly to coaches as to whether they are going to accept a trip. It's common courtesy, really. It's tempting to stall when an athlete is waiting to see who might offer a trip, but if you're holding out for something better, that coach deserves to know he is not on YOUR top list.</p>

<p>Your athlete will likely see the other coaches at games or meets, so being on the up-and-up is always a good choice.</p>

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<p>I don't think that coaches exchange lists but they do know who is on each other's list. For example, it is safe to assume that anyone on Harvard's list will also be on Yale and Princeton's list. That goes the same with other similar groupings of schools. Yes! honesty is the best possible when it comes to this process. Coaches are trying to deal with recruits, an admission's office, their needs, other schools trying to lure their recruits, etc. Not an easy thing to do.</p>

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<p>My son was offered at least one official visit at a DIII school, but not one which was highly selective.</p>