<blockquote>
<p>A recommendation that emphasizes that a student is unfailingly courteous is likely to result in an adcoms assuming the student is a brown noser with nothing else going for themselves. Harvard is not a finishing school. Adcoms are far more interested in a student's intelligence, interests and leadership ability than their manners.<<</p>
</blockquote>
<br>
<p>Based on the level of discourtesy shown by some of the disappointed deferred posters on this thread, I'd say that Harvard looks for at least SOME minimum level of good manners in its accepted students. The school appears to be weeding out those who are lacking.</p>
<p>"Based on the level of discourtesy shown by some of the disappointed deferred posters on this thread, I'd say that Harvard looks for at least SOME minimum level of good manners in its accepted students. The school appears to be weeding out those who are lacking."</p>
<p>You are very right. Despite the myth that Harvard students are rude, arrogant and snobbish, Harvard does not try to admit students like that. When I see Harvard wannabees posting rude comments on CC or making fun of people whom they regard as less intelligent, I think to myself that such students are unlikely to gain acceptance.</p>
<p>In fact, I think that's one purpose of the interview: To weed out the obnoxious, arrogant and rude types. I also know that Harvard adcoms will call GCs and ask questions about students' personalities including whether the students are arrogant. </p>
<p>My post was designed to emphasize that a recommendation that basically said that a student was polite and followed the Bible would not get a student into Harvard , though it could open the door at other types of institutions.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>I visited Yale for an hour or so today, as I was in New Haven. I haven't been in a couple of years and I was a bit struck--it's a beautiful campus! <<
My son felt exactly like you when he visited...he thought the campus was incredible, but then something didn't click the way it did at H.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Stats:[ul]
[<em>] SAT I: 750 Verbal, 800 Math, 800 Writing
[</em>] SAT IIs: 800 Math II, 780 US History, 760 Chemistry
[<em>] ACT
[</em>] GPA: 93 average
[<em>] Rank: 3/53
[</em>] Other stats: President of two diversity clubs, Student Government rep, Debate team captain. 5's on four APs.
[/ul]Subjective:[ul]
[<em>] Essays: Personal one was good, wrote the supplemental one about how I struggled with my identity
[</em>] Teacher Recs: Both good, written by English and Physics teachers, both male around 40 years of age, funny, both Ph.Ds
[<em>] Counselor Rec: Good, she was a Senior Admissions Officer at Harvard until two years ago.
[</em>] Hook (if any):
[/ul]Location/Person:[ul]
[<em>] State or Country: NYC
[</em>] School Type: Small, private
[<em>] Ethnicity: Asian American
[</em>] Gender: M
[<em>] Perceived Strengths/Weaknesses: I have nothing particularly special; I guess my school makes up for it (entire high school population is 213, but we currently have 24 alums at Harvard, and we average 4 each to Harvard and Princeton a year, as well as sending 40% of graduating class to Ivy League or comparable school).
[</em>] Why you think you were accepted/deferred/denied:
[/ul]Other Factors: General Comments/Congratulations/Venting/Commiserations,etc:</p>
<p>Stats:[ul]
[<em>] SAT I: M:660, V:730, W:680
[</em>] SAT IIs: Lit:700, Bio:630, MathI:710
[<em>] ACT:N/A
[</em>] GPA:3.85
[<em>] Rank:13/207
[</em>] Other stats:5 on AP English Lang/Comp., 4s on AP Euro and U.S., 3 on AP Bio
[/ul]Subjective:[ul]
[<em>] Essays:Excellent (supplement and required)
[</em>] Teacher Recs:Very, very good (one from AP Bio teacher:glowing, other from AP Eng teacher also v.good)
[<em>] Counselor Rec:good
[</em>] Hook (if any):Lacrosse player (recruited for the team)
[/ul]Location/Person:[ul]
[<em>] State or Country:MD
[</em>] School Type:Private Catholic
[<em>] Ethnicity:White
[</em>] Gender:Female
[<em>] Perceived Strengths/Weaknesses: Definite leader, gifted writer, extremely devoted to lacrosse
[</em>] Why you think you were accepted/deferred/denied: Showed that I was a "real" person.
[/ul]Other Factors: I know there is a stereotype against athletes, but I know that the athletes at Harvard are academically qualified and deserve to be there. Athletes are given the "dumb jock" label by those who simply don't know. **
**General Comments/Congratulations/Venting/Commiserations,etc:</p>
<p>Well I'm pretty surprised that some of the Canadian IMO team members / RSI / SWC kids didn't get in... hopefully many of them will RD.</p>
<p>I was personally lucky enough to be accepted but am also too lazy to copy the required code...</p>
<p>SAT: 2400
SATII: 800, 800, 800, 790 (math, bio, phys, chem)
APs: 10 x 5's
IB diploma
I am a science/math guy: usamo, usapho, usabo, usaco semifinalists; davidson fellow, swc semi, isef finalist, etc etc
But I did do some xtra stuff: all-state clarinet/principal in excellent youth symphony, state champ track team, lead clubs/comm service </p>
<p>So...maybe Harvard just wants a little bit more balance? I'm not sure. But I am sure in saying that almost all the applicants whether accepted or not are really quite amazing so best of luck to everybody! Hopefully we'll hang out next year and party it up whooo!</p>
<p>I've read this thread with great interest, mainly because, for some reason I haven't figured out yet, I receive email everytime there is a new post. :-) </p>
<p>I understand completely what NSM is saying and as a mainline Christian I am not offended at all. I think most colleges, not just Harvard, would be wary of a student who is too 'indoctrinated' in any area, including, but not limited to, religion. I would think a premium would be placed on those applicants who convey a mind open to different ideas and free discussion; and who acknowledge they have much to learn, and who have a willingness to make the most of the college experience is gaining new perspectives.</p>
<p>I also believe that colleges such as Harvard would have qualms about admitting students who want Harvard just because it's Harvard or students who view the college admissions process as another way to compete. We have counseled our D to look at selecting a college as a a venture where both parties have to bring something to the table. Not every college is perfect for every student....even Harvard. And the goal should be to find that perfect match regardless of where it takes you. D sat on the fence for months about Harvard and after hours studying their website, looking over their academic departments and course catalog, she decided (last week!), she would make application. (What she found in her careful research was a program that blended biology, anthropology and public health policy...and that sealed the deal for her.)</p>
<p>Finally, to the deferred kids. You are brilliant, passionate and well spoken. Make the most of those attributes and don't give up if you sincerely feel Harvard is that perfect match.</p>
<p>ldmom06, if you want to stop the emails from coming, click on the "My Control Panel" link in the top left corner, click "list subscriptions" on the left, mark the check box to the right of "notification", click on the little menu thing at the bottom that says "Move to folder..." and select "No email notification". Then click go.</p>
<p>lol...trying to get rid of me? (JK...thanks sincerely...I'd also like to get rid of a ridiculous thread started by some poster named HotIvy...lol!)</p>
<p>Okay, I never got to properly congratulate everyone who was accepted. I was a little upset and focused on how I was going to break to everyone that I was deferred. Anywho, CONGRATULATIONS!</p>
<p>And, to everyone who was deferred: just review your app copies (hoping that you kept copies) and see what was wrong. Improve on them. Make yourself on those few pieces of paper. Use it, don't let it use you!</p>
<p>"It's important to remember that most students at Harvard are avid volunteers. They do this not to dress up their resumes, but because Harvard deliberately selects students with demonstrated sincere interests in making a difference somehow in the world."</p>
<p>With all due respect, anybody who has been an informed student at Harvard within the past 10 years will tell you that that statement is simply ridiculous. Take a quick glance at the hoards of "Phillips Brooks House" volunteers -- all biology or biochemistry majors, all interested in applying for medical school, most simply wanting to "serve the local community" as a means to that end.</p>
<p>Then again, most of them get rejected from the top medical schools despite the Harvard degree.</p>
<p>kingduke: A bit cynical, aren't you? Life is about giving and taking. People volunteer because it makes them "feel good" about doing it. Likewise, pre-med people who volunteer give their services and their talents to a population that otherwise would not receive any help from anyone. In return, they get to put it on their medical school application. Sure, the intention may not be noble for some (and of course these are the ones that get weeded out in med school admissions), but in the end, Harvard students do it because they want to do it.</p>
<p>On a side note, 91% of Harvard students get accepted to at least one medical school compared to the nationwide average of 50%. You also have to know that Harvard does not place restrictions on who gets to apply. Furthermore, in the OCS (Office of Career Services)' medical school admissions data, the vast majority of the 91% go to a top-20 medical school from HMS to Case Western.</p>
<p>Stats:[ul]
[<em>] SAT I: M: 760 V: 770 W: 760
[</em>] SAT IIs: MathIIC: 780 French: 790 Lit: 760
[<em>] ACT: --
[</em>] GPA: 3.98 unweighted
[<em>] Rank: unsure, around top 5-10%
[</em>] Other stats: 5's on AP French Lang, French Lit, English Lang, AP World; 4's on AP US Hist & NSL; National Merit Semifinalist, Maryland Distinguished Scholar Semifinalist, bunch of other awards; martial arts student + artist
[/ul]Subjective:[ul]
[<em>] Essays: "best they've read all year"
[</em>] Teacher Recs: 1 from Engl. teacher (amazing), 1 from math teacher (v. good), 1 from boss (extra character rec)
[<em>] Counselor Rec: pretty darn good
[</em>] Hook (if any): immigrant - 4.5 years in the US
[/ul]Location/Person:[ul]
[<em>] State or Country: MD
[</em>] School Type: Public
[<em>] Ethnicity: Eastern European
[</em>] Gender: Female
[<em>] Perceived Strengths/Weaknesses: str - fluent in four languages, academic recognition in school and outside of it; weak: high school courses and activities didn't really focus on intended major (and ambition in life...) as much as I do independently
[</em>] Why you think you were accepted/deferred/denied: interview - was late and a bit out of it (went right after a sleepless week spent at the Nat'l Youth Leadership Forum, stupid idea)
[/ul]Other Factors: -- General Comments/Congratulations/Venting/Commiserations,etc: Dunno. There's still Hopkins : \ Congrats to people who got in, though : )</p>
<p>In case anyone is still reading this, I've come up with my own hypothesis concerning the RSI/Siemens deferrals. I think that Harvard still cares significantly about pure math/science, but that it doesn't value Siemens and RSI as highly as some might imagine.</p>
<p>What's the basis for this? Well, I have a few friends who have been accepted almost solely on a math/science basis. They did both go to RSI, but I doubt that was their main qualification (since we have seen so many deferred). Rather, they were both top 12 in USAMO. It's still possible to be accepted with no significant leadership or accomplishment outside math/science, at least for people who are spectacularly talented (like them).</p>
<p>So why the USAMO admits, but not admits based on Siemens/RSI? I would speculate that Harvard views the USAMO as a more valid indicator of extreme talent, and (to be quite honest) I would agree with them.</p>
<p>And, since I know that someone will bring this up: there have been people who have performed spectacularly well in math and science olympiads yet been rejected. But it's also quite possible that these people have had some additional baggage (very poor essays, interviews, etc.) that made them difficult to admit. Pure math/science admissions are still very much alive.</p>