<p>Which is more competitive and selective, West Point or Annapolis Naval?</p>
<p>You're going to start a war with a question like that. I would say that they are approximately equal. #'s of applications fluctuate year to year. This past one was odd - there seemed to be an Iraq War effect - applications were down at USMA, USNA and USAFA. What was odd was that USMA saw the smallest drop in applications but its graduates, as combat infantry leaders, are most at risk in the war (Seals and Marines excepted). SAT scores are all very close for Academies. By the way, competition, on a percentage basis, is also very steep for USCGA and USMMA.</p>
<p>lol i like the irony</p>
<p>"you're going to start a war with a question like that"</p>
<p>lmao</p>
<p>If you search the archives of each service academy board, you'll find several discussion threads on this topic from last year's addmissions season. oib is right - they are all very, very competitive. It's an honor to receive an appointment to any one of these institutions. What you really need to do is learn about each academy's mission, what career options will be available to you, and where your heart lies. Then you will know where to focus your energies and make yourself the most competitive candidate possible. </p>
<p>Good luck.</p>
<p>biomaster: </p>
<p>It doesn't really matter which is more competive or selective.</p>
<p>The important point is that both academies provide the best military leadership training for their respective service branches.</p>
<p>Like momoftwins suggests, if you're trying to decide which to attend, you should look at the various officer carreer paths of academy graduates and decide which you prefer - not which academy is more difficult to get into.</p>
<p>The academies are about duty, honor and country - not status.</p>
<p>If you're seeking status, you're looking in the wrong place.
If you're seeking service, you've come to the right spot.</p>
<p>Good luck with your choice.</p>
<p>Yeah dude, im going back to the berkeley boards. These guys are too serious. Kill some charlie for me, okay?</p>
<p>Too bad for Berkeley.</p>
<p>Actually when you factor in the entire admissions process, Annapolis and West Point by their very nature, are both more selective than Berkeley. The "whole person" is a tough grade to make.</p>
<p>I would venture to say annapolis is a bit more concerned with your academic history than West Point is....USAFA too. Not that West Point isn't, but West Point really really goes for the Whole Person thing.</p>
<p>If you look back far enough, you will realize that the number of applicants has gone back to the pre 9/11 days. What many view as a drop in applicants attributed to the Iraq war, is more likely a return to "normalcy" from the heightened number of applicants all service academies experienced following the attacks on the World Trade Center.
CM</p>
<p>Any suggestion that USMA is "inferior" academically to Navy or Air Force is, as suggested above, an artifact of their somewhat greater commitment to the "whole person" admissions concept. For more information on this, you might consult the September 2003 GAO Report on Military Education (<a href="http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d031000.pdf)%5B/url%5D">http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d031000.pdf)</a>.</p>
<p>Any questions about the relative quality of the education provided, though, should take into account something the GAO did not address: Rhodes and similar scholarships won. </p>
<p>Rhodes Scholarships
USMA began competing in 1923, a couple decades after Harvard, etc.
Harvard 287
Yale 190
Princeton 164
USMA 84
Stanford 70
::
::
USNA 36
USAFA 33 -- impressive since USFA was only founded in the 1950s</p>
<p>Marshall Scholarships
Competition began in 1982
Harvard 97
Princeton 54
Stanford 46
Yale 42
MIT 35
Brown 30
USMA 27
USNA 15
::
::
USAFA 8</p>
<p>Hertz Scholarships
Competition began in 1969
MIT 99
Stanford 62
Princeton 40
USMA 37
Harvard 36
USAFA 28
::
::
Yale 14
USNA 9</p>
<p>Truman Scholarships
Competition began in 1992
Harvard 30
Yale 27
USMA 24
Duke 24
Stanford 23
Brown 19
Princeton 16
::
::
USAFA 13
USNA 12</p>
<p>Except for MIT, every other college on these lists has been significantly larger than the three service academies over the years, and until the late 1960s Navy was significantly larger than West Point. </p>
<p>I personally think that all three major service academies, and especially West Point, may be the last American colleges that deliver a true liberal arts education ... as traditionally understood ... to every graduate. Where else but West Point is every graduate, regardless of major, required to master at least the rudiments of all the major areas of knowledge? Where else are humanities majors expected to develop at least a working knowledge of higher order math, chemistry, physics, information technology, engineering, and physical geography/geology/environment? Where else are engineering, hard science, and math majors required to develop working knowledge of English composition and literature, history, economics, psychology, political science, human geography/cultural anthropology, a foreign language, etc.? </p>
<p>I once heard the previous Academic Dean, BG Kaufman, say that the goal is to provide each graduate a full set of problem solving tools ... linguistic, scientific, psychological, mathematical, historical, engineering, anthropological, topographical, environmental, etc., ... so that when confronted with a unique and unanticipated situation they will be able to synthesize an appropriate solution. As an example, he sited a former WP history major, now a 1LT infantry platoon leader in Iraq. Functioning as de facto mayor of a village, the LT has to settle domestic disputes and tribal conflicts, rebuild infrastructure including a bombed bridge and polluted well, find jobs for villagers, distribute food aid, clear land mines from the village's farm fields, and organize and lead a defense against insurgents bent on killing any villagers who cooperated with him and his platoon. Dean Kaufman read an email from the LT thanking him for the breadth of his academic preparation, citing how different courses gave him insights on how to approach the myriad challenges he faced every day. He thanked the West Point system of overloading cadets for preparing him to accomplish more different tasks every day than he ever could have imagined.</p>
<p>That, of course, brings up the down side of the "West Point Experience." The very breadth of the required core curriculum, plus the demands of a major, make for an academic load for every cadet approached at regular colleges only by the most ardent engineering or premed majors. Then add on the other daily rigors cadets and midshipmen must endure ... the West Point system makes sure every cadet always has more on his/her plate than s/he believes s/he has time to handle. The same overload system is in place at the other service academies. Thus, four years at West Point, Annapolis, or Air Force is an unmatched challenge. </p>
<p>For those who master that challenge, though, the rewards are also unmatched ... lifelong friendships forged in the crucible of the "cooperate and graduate" ethic, awareness of previously unsuspected capabilities and capacity, and the tools and confidence to take on and master challenges way beyond what other new college grads face. </p>
<p>Though I was skeptical about West Point when my sons told me of their interest, I am now a total convert, especially after talking with their high school friends who went to the colleges they might have attended. Cadets and midshipmen simply seem to be more mature than their peers at other colleges, and the difference is even more apparent during the first years after graduation. </p>
<p>The service academies are not for everyone -- as current and former cadets and mids are the first to say -- but for the right kid, they offer unmatched opportunity and growth.</p>
<p>Very well said. Trying to compare the acadamies is somewhat like trying to compare apples and oranges.
Both are very good and, yet, they each taste different; its imossible to say which is better.</p>
<p>You choose the fruit depending upon what you are seeking to accomplish: dry and crisp or wet and juicy.</p>
<p>Our young Biomaster Padawan [or whatever the heck they are called], you will come to appreciate that such questions are only for Jedi to discuss and, even then, no agreement they will make.</p>
<p>I inadvertently included a closing parenthesis in the link. It should have been:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d031000.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d031000.pdf</a></p>
<p>Great Post LAXDAD!</p>