<p>Whoa- I never mentioned HYPS- I was thinking more along the lines of DC schools (suspect GT would be a reach, but she is studying French and Russian), Barnard, Tufts levels (and I realize these have gotten very tough). Ballet does not have the kind of competitions that one sees for eg gymnastics. Yes, there are some (Moscow, Varna, Jackson), but comparatively few participate for a variety of reasons- much $ for coaching, devotion of too much time to learning specific solos rather than concentrating on technique. So the "national awards" etc really doesn't apply. Very, very few 17 yos enter a company- most go into a traineeship post HS and then try to get one of the very few jobs available.</p>
<p>Dufay:</p>
<p>One young woman I know who spent much of her high school years doing ballet is now a Tufts student. She also had some Russian, though I don't know if she's pursued it in college.</p>
<p>Dufay--yeah, I tried to point out above that the Harvardocentric bent here did not seem warranted by your first post.</p>
<p>I'm not an expert, but it seems to me that her high level of ballet shoudl be a fine EC for the level of school you mention. neither of my kids came near that depth of commitment in one activity, let alone more than one, and both got into very good schools (not Harvard :))</p>
<p>Dufay, Garland's post reminds me that Wesleyan might be a school to check out. It has a strong performing arts program, including dance.</p>
<p>Yes Marite I understand that the conventional wisdom is that a more diverse intellectual class makes for a better community. I am not always sure that the conventional wisdom is correct as those rowers I mentioned will likely spend the bulk of their time associating and living with other rowers and the longer their rowing career in college continues the more likely that their academic work and their rowing will occupy almost all of their time. Does this situation improve the overall community in terms of student interaction across the student body? I am not so sure. theoretically I think your point is well taken, but what actually happens on any given campus that has this type of situation?</p>
<p>Good point, Marite--Wes would be an excellent school for her to look at (not that we're biased :))</p>
<p>I don't know about rowers specifically, although we all enjoy seeing them practice on the Charles :). There are different ways of enriching the community and interacting with others; performing is certainly one of them., whether on the river of on a stage.
As Cambridge residents, we have attended many concerts given by Harvard students (some of them free) as well as other kinds of performances. And several years ago, my S took a Saturday class from an MIT undergrad who was passionate about cartoons, er, graphic arts.</p>
<p>Garland, please understand that the mention of Harvard was just in response to Northstarmom's original comment that essentially said that a focus on just one EC puts you out of the running for "very top schools" (so, my point was that if it's good enough for Harvard and Yale---where I knew of an example, and where Northstarmom is an alumnus/interviewer--that being Harvard, it's likely that outstanding accomplishments in a singular activity is fine for many other highly selective schools as well.) I did not use that example, as it may have seemed, because I presumed that the OP was interested in HYP, or any other specific elite college.</p>
<p>I think that we are all sort of ignoring the most challenging aspect of the OP's question: Her daughter intends to give up ballet if she cannot dance professionally. While any number of schools would be happy to have a talented, passionate dancer who would participate in their dance program, I am not certain how many want a talented dancer who says she no longer wants to dance.</p>
<p>Obviously, the girl doesn't HAVE to say that, necessarily, although ethically she probably should. There is still a strong argument that her pre-college dance career displays her capacity for focus, discipline, work, and achievement, and that she will be able to translate those qualities to other pursuits. But I think different people could have very different attitudes towards her.</p>
<p>Many years ago, a relative was on the admissions committee of the medical school of a famous university whose name begins with H when they admitted an Olympic figure skating medalist whose academic credentials were acceptable but short of stellar. Their unanimous attitude was "This kid knows what it takes to be world class, and has achieved everything possible in his field. Of course we want him." But. That kid had truly demonstrated a unique ability and work ethic over 15 years, including setting himself up to apply to medical school, and he was going out on top with no regrets. </p>
<p>I don't know that the same attitude would apply to a 17-year-old who was letting go of a dream. And, in all honesty, some adcomms might have the ambivalence I have -- I have seen several kids in this type of situation have a lot of the air go out of them and really get lost for a few years before winding up OK. Not all, but enough to think that a high-achievement kid with a unique passion who is giving it up is a mixed blessing.</p>
<p>dufay, all I can say to you is "relax." My d refused to do many things just to get into top colleges. She said to me, "If a school doesn't want me the way I am, and who I am, then I don't want to go there." She dances because she wants to, not because it may look good to an admissions counselor. If your daughter presents herself to colleges the way she is, including her singular passion (which may have played itself out), she'll be fine. There will be a top school that wants her.</p>
<p>(And besides, there isn't much you can do about it now anyway!)</p>
<p>The word "passion" is overused on CC. Very few people have real "passions" - and virtually none have multiple "passions".</p>
<p>dufay, my strong feeling is that your daughter's singular focus on ballet won't be seen as a drawback among the sort of schools you're talking about. My daughters have been involved in ballet for many years, and I think I have an idea of how very accomplished your d must be simply to have achieved admission to a pre-professional school. I hope you're planning to have her submit a brief dance CD as a supplement to her apps.</p>
<p>The kids I know with a profile similar to your daughter's (dance as their sole EC, excellent GPA, demanding curriculum) are at Vassar, Barnard, Bryn Mawr, and SU's Newhouse School. If your daughter performs well on the SATs, I don't see how her obvious passion for dance could be a drawback. In fact, it sounds as if she'd be a viable candidate at Columbia (since she's interested in NYC). You mention that she cyberschools - whom will she ask to write her recommendations? </p>
<p>
[quote]
I don't know that the same attitude would apply to a 17-year-old who was letting go of a dream. And, in all honesty, some adcomms might have the ambivalence I have
[/quote]
JHS, in my opinion the OP's daughter is only showing how bright/mature she truly is by deciding not to pursue ballet if she isn't accepted into a company after high school. The career path for a ballerina almost always goes: pre-pro school, apprenticeship, company member. It's uncommon for a ballet student to make it into a company if she's put her career on hold for college (even to study dance), though a few may. She might be able to take college classes part-time if accepted into a company, but she couldn't do both on a full-time basis. I would hope an adcom wouldn't see a student's recognition of the harsh realities of the ballet world as "letting go of a dream."</p>
<p>I am curious about how completely she'll give up dancing, though. Will she still take classes occasionally, teach younger kids, something else? I think an adcom might want to see this aspect addressed somewhere in the application.</p>
<p>Thanks all for comments. Unfortunately, the "letting go of a dream" would be based on the very tough realities of the arts world right now. She doesn't want to be supported either (at least while dancing- sure in college!), although I could support her for a couple of years if she did get a poorly paying appenticeship. I think she would miss dance- it has totally consumed her- so in reality I would think she would have a hard time going "cold turkey".</p>
<p>Dufay:</p>
<p>The D of friends of mine was passionate about ballet and skipped college to be in the corps de ballet of a prestigious company. After several years, however, she decided to go to college after all, and she quit cold turkey. She felt that if she could not devote all her energies to dancing, she'd rather stop dancing entirely.</p>
<p>OP - What year is your D? Where has she done her summer intensives?</p>
<p>Here is our experience. D danced ballet from age 7-18. At the time when she applied to college she was still dancing, and had just done a summer intensive at ABT's New York session. That is not quite at the level of SAB, PNB, or San Francisco, but is at the top of the next tier. D was also an excellent student at a good private high school in the Bay Area - SAT Is of 1470 from one sitting, SAT IIs of 800, 800, 800 etc. and GPA of never got anything but an A except in PE due to a ballet injury and took the hardest possible curriculum with a total of 6 or 7 APs.</p>
<p>So academically she could at least apply to HPYS with the blessing of the college counselor. Additionally, she was the co-editor-in-chief of the school newspaper, and had a couple of lead/large roles in the school theater. Also she did all kinds of other stuff like organize a dance club, teach the dance club, Mock Trials, Play-in-a-Day, Outdoors Club, school retreats to Taos, NM to volunteer on reservations, taught kids in summer school from disadvantaged neighborhoods, etc. Also managed to convince her teachers she was a great person and had great recs. As her mom, of course, I knew she was just as annoying as any other teenager but that is another story:).</p>
<p>Anyway, the point of this litany is that GIVEN that D had the credentials for a top school, I am firmly convinced that her ballet was one of the tipping factors in her acceptances. We sent a CD of her dancing in to Princeton and to Stanford - the two places where she was accepted. Now, I am a legacy at P and have a father who taught at S, so I can't guarantee that the dancing was the tipping factor but I remain convinced that it helped. </p>
<p>Here's my theory. First of all, both Princeton and Stanford have well-developed dance programs, so they know what it takes to be a serious dancer. Second, when they see a kid dance they see who that kid is. My D's being was really communicated in her dancing. I am sure that would be true for your D as well.</p>
<p>Fast forward to the end of the story. By the time senior year rolled around it was clear my D would not be dancing seriously any more due to a host of injuries. As of now, end of freshman year at Princeton, she is not dancing any more at all. But she has taken the same focus and drive she put to ballet and used it for school and for the newspaper at Princeton. So, I also believe that kids who have the academic background and capabilities who are good and dedicated dancers will be an asset to any college - whether they dance or not.</p>
<p>I've been gone a couple of weeks but this thread hits a number of my D's experiences and aims, so I'll weigh in, both point and counterpoint.</p>
<p>As has been noted, unlike gymnastics, there is no meaningful "national ranking" for ballet dancers to use to boost their chances. The top summer intensive programs--SAB, PNB, San Francisco--count for something but beyond that they seem to count for virtually nil. D's essay for her EA app to Yale was about a pas de deux class (not a "my big performance" essay) and I thought it conveyed her passion for dance very well...a line about "guy sweat" dripping on her still sticks in my mind. However, a former admissions officer for another top school told me that the passion for ballet and that essay would have got her app stuck into the "another dancer" stack of apps early on and that the essay about handling a Roman coin at a Renaissance Faire was far stronger for the purposes of standing out. Go figure. </p>
<p>Except on that level, ballet dancers are a dime a hundred. Dufay, my D was similar to yours in terms of commitment, dancing 18-23 hrs/week during junior and senior years. She didn't make the top summer intensives but went to Jillana (Taos, New Mexico), which isn't very competitive but is Balanchine oriented, which is where my D lives. </p>
<p>She went to an extremely competitive pre-professional school (<a href="http://www.westsideballet.com%5B/url%5D">www.westsideballet.com</a>) that combined Balanchine and RAD in its instruction. They routinely place dancers into professional ranks, as a glance at its alumni pages show...there names that balletomanes will recognize. My D was "the worst of the best" in this league, a mid-level soloist. Her penchees are still regarded as among the best the director has seen among students in the past several years; contrariwise, her pirouettes were...adequate. D was very much a lyrical, as opposed to an athletic dancer. </p>
<p>In terms of college, she made peace with herself during the course of her junior year in high school, in a very private and painful process, that she was not going to make it as a pro. She might have stood a better if still small chance if she had not had a moderately severe ankle sprain that put her back for several months as a sophomore and if both and she and we had been willing to entertain the notion of homeschooling to facilitate concentration on ballet--many of the highest-caliber dancers at Westside have done so but we weren't willing to go that direction.</p>
<p>Still, access to high-level ballet was a non-negotiable criterion in her college search, whether via regular classes (Barnard, Smith, Skidmore), via strong schools in the local community (Yale [across the street], Georgetown [up Wisconsin Ave.], or strong college-based EC companies (Stanford, Harvard). Note: Stanford's Cardinal Ballet has collaborated with one of the local regional companies (San Jose? Silicon Valley?) and I know that Colleen Neary of the Balanchine Trust has set Balanchine pieces for them (Serenade?). </p>
<p>My D's demand for high-level academics, another non-negotiable, eliminated some very strong dance programs from consideration, including Indiana, Butler, and Utah. ('sokay, geographical preferences would have killed them all anyway.) </p>
<p>A number of schools she looked at, George Washington comes to mind, offer ballet but only Beginning and Intermediate. In contrast, a few, like Skidmore, which became D's Safety, offer an honest-to-God separate pas de deux class.</p>
<p>She was rejected at Harvard/Yale/Stanford, accepted at Smith/Wellesley/Barnard/Skidmore. Top 5 percent class rank, near-perfect SAT's & SAT II's.</p>
<p>D's passion for ballet was such that she was determined to keep dancing in college and so far she has, both taking classes and participating in student choreography projects which have gobbled a fair amount of time in rehearsal, far more than the actual class time. She has gotten involved in some modern performances as well as ballet.</p>
<p>D broke her foot at home last August in an adult ballet class (snapped a fifth-metatarsal going up on a jump) and took last Fall off, took the Spring at the Intermediate level while she regained strength.</p>
<p>She's off-campus junior year but has already told us to expect to get a call or e-mail asking to have her ballet bag shipped to her when she gets more settled in.</p>
<p>Sorry if this post is a little incoherent...I've had several phone calls while writing it and need to hit "Post" now.</p>
<p>Only thing I would add TheDad is that we found Harvard's ballet/dance program to be pretty thin, and there's no dance for credit at all as I understand it. Princeton's is much better. Stanford, and the Cardinal Ballet, are run by Kristine Elliot (sp?) an extremely good teacher who comes from ABT.</p>