Online Only Masters to Brick and Mortar Ph.D

Graduate School
1

<p>I've got an interesting dilemma.</p>

<p>I recently looked into American Military University, and it seems to have really great reviews from students. It's regionally accredited and offers programs in exactly what I'm looking for.</p>

<p>Getting my Masters online would save me money and time, and also solve the problem my fiancee and I are having of where we need to move (she's about to go back to undergrad). In short, I'm excited about it. Also, since many of the professors there work in their fields, it seems a bit more practical career-wise.</p>

<p>HOWEVER</p>

<p>Will it kill my chances at getting into a Ph.D program at a good school later on?</p>

<p>I have good grades and I worked hard in undergrad, but I have yet to find a program that is really what I want. Some are close, but the time commitment and money (not to mention hassle of applying) make me leery. I can get a degree from AMU in 18 months. I could, theoretically, get into a pretty decent grad school if I wanted to, but like I said, none of the ones I've found are flexible enough or offer exactly what I'm looking for.</p>

<p>So, if I go to AMU, get good grades, will it affect my chances of getting into a "real" university (say, University of Kentucky for example) for my Ph.D?</p>

<p>Oh, and I'd obviously be studying history or military history for my Master's. </p>

<p>Any help would be appreciated.</p>

2

<p>Yes it would hurt your chances for the PhD. One of the MOST important aspects for the PhD application is the letter of recommendation. PhD programs do expect some from the MA-level, not just UG-level. The online professors won’t know who you are as a person.</p>

<p>You need to be a bit more flexible in terms of what you want to get out of your MA program. Military history isn’t huge but professors who specialize in the area or time period will be happy to work with you anyway. You will find that papers for your seminars are going to be pretty flexible and you can tie your military history interests right into the seminar topics. It’s a nice way to stretch your mind.</p>

3

<p>Well, what about modifying my sitaution this way:</p>

<p>I am re-evaluating whether it’d be worth going for my Ph.D in history anyway. It’d be great for the ego, but with only 25% of the 9 or so accepted history ph.d students graduating, it’s a risk. Also, I can get the same jobs with an MA and some certificates, or teach at a university and go for my Ph.D later.</p>

<p>As for letters of recommendation, if I can’t work closely with a professor at an online university, I could always get letters of recommendation from professional work done in a historical setting, correct? After my Masters if I find good historical work, those recommendations would be just as valid from my understanding. </p>

<p>Or is it absolutely essential for me to get a Ph.D in history to do anything?</p>

<p>Also, I worry that I worked so hard to get good grades in my undergrad year that by goign to an online university I am sacrificing my ability to say I’m “elite.” But it would be so much more convenient to do an online university. And I could always make up for it in quality of my work. I would hope.</p>

<p>Does any of this sound plausible?</p>

4

<p>What are you looking to do with a graduate degree in history? If just for the fun of it, do those online Us and you can do what you want.</p>

<p>There are many reasons why people drop out of PhD programs. They get burned out. They wind up with family obligations. They failed their comprehensive exams. Their dissertation projects fall apart. There are more things that you can do with a PhD in history than you think. The price you’ll have to pay is giving up your independence as a researcher and research based on someone else’s agenda.</p>

<p>You cannot get the same jobs as people with MAs nowadays. Community colleges are hiring PhDs now over MAs (used to be you could apply with a MA). Most historian jobs prefer PhD over MA. So by getting a PhD, you are increasing your chances of landing a good job as a historian, if that’s what you basically want to be.
LORs from… other historians in museums and public archives are okay but definitely do not replace those from professors who hold PhDs. I think this question might be best answered by Professor X…</p>

<p>Your time in undergraduate was never wasted. You worked hard because you wanted to give yourself opportunities. Convenient? I think you’ll be in for a big shock when I tell you this: In order to get your PhD and get a job that you want/need, you NEED to be flexible and be willing to move ANYWHERE. Otherwise, you’ll be at dead-end. You need to chase after them, it doesn’t chase after you.</p>

<p>Hence, why I don’t think online universities are good idea. Having a MA from there sends bad signals. I know of MAs in my school are making sacrifices, especially the part-timers. One even did a LDR for the whole time he was here.</p>

5

<p>TMP is correct. An online MA will certainly not be helpful to anyone looking to pursue a PhD.</p>

<p>Her suggestion to examine your goals and then chart a rational path to achieving those goals is spot-on. An online degree in history will never lead one to a career in academia.</p>

<p>You may also wish to rethink military history as a subfield. No one hires in military history except the military academies. That is a frightfully limited market for a PhD seeking employment.</p>

6

<p>Well, my goals aren’t to teach at a college, but I’d love to do research work for think tanks, historical organizations, (I’ll have a BS in Political Science as well), that type of work. I understand the flexibility and need to chase down jobs and move, I fully planned on doing that anyway. My thinking is, if I do it online I can start looking for work now, get some practical experience, get it done cheaply and easily (rather than being locked into a physical university in the middle of nowhere for the next years of my life), cut down on my debt, and also more easily pursue post-masters certificates in specialist areas. </p>

<p>Not to mention save hundreds on GREs, visits and application fees, along with all the time to wrangle professors to right my letters of recommendations and the limbo of not knowing who will accept me until later.</p>

<p>From the two of you, I get the impression that a Ph.D is really only good for work in academia. Well, like I said, I’m not interested in teaching at a university, and military history remains the most popular main-stream form of history. If I want to do research or consulting or anything like that, it seems military history would be the way to go.</p>

<p>Of course, it does have it’s limitations, and I originally planned on doing diplomatic history but the few programs out there are both expensive and hard to get into, even with my good grades. You see, I never got to really know a professor in my undergrad years, so my letters of recommendations will only be so-so I think.</p>

<p>Appreciate the responses!</p>

7

<p>If I’m doing the hiring between two equally qualified applicants, outside of academia, I’m hiring the one with the traditional MA over the online MA. Online degrees are fine in some fields, but not history.</p>

8

<p>Why do you need a master’s degree to meet your career goals? Do you know of job openings that require a MA?</p>

<p>I know of one top LAC grad who got a job in a university archives right out of college. It didn’t pay much, but he loved it.</p>

9

<p>Well, to get any job related to hsitory you have to have a minimum of a Masters, really.</p>

10

<p>Or job experience, I suppose. I’m not looking to get rich, either. Just to make enough to pay off my loans and be happy working.</p>

<p>I suppose you could get any of these jobs without an MA, but it’s a serious uphill battle. </p>

<p>I don’t understand the prejudice against an accredited online university, but I understand it’s out there. The only difference is in one, you sit in a class. Technology has come far enough to where an online class is virtually the same. There are no limits to discussion, lecture, or any other interactivity.</p>

<p>I have started looking for online MA’s related to brick and mortar schools, though, like Sam Houston State University and so forth. Not many of them for history yet, though.</p>

11

<p>Here’s something to consider: apply to a PhD program in history, and hope that you get funding. Most universities will award an MA if you’re ABD (all but dissertation). Does your fiancee’s undergrad institution offer a PhD in history? If not, are there other universities nearby?</p>

12

<p>Given your goals, you might wish to consider Public History. There are a few reputable MA programs in Public History offered through actual brick-and-mortar universities. Most students in these types of programs are employed, and have tuition paid or reimbursed by their employers. If you can find a job that offers these benefits, that clearly would be the best route to take.</p>

13

<p>You know, that’s worth looking into. The only part that worries me is that I really like doing research and writing. I suppose I could still do that with a public history masters, I suppose. And at least I could probably find a job with it. Can you work in archives with a public history degree? I really have no interest working with collections, but I like archives and of course I’d love the aspect of doing history consulting work and media work.</p>

14

<p>Archives are indeed public history… but public history may require a course or two on collections so be prepared! Also collections work IS part of the whole archives job… so you better like collections or you may not find working in archives as interesting…</p>

15

<p>I am actually enrolled in American Military University because I love the type of courses that they offer. I am enrolled in the Asymmetrical Warfare program, and I felt this would be great because I want to study African Military History. I don’t know if I am making the right decision though. I would love to teach “Contemporary African Military History” at a college one day, but I have not found any graduate programs in History that give me the fraction of interest that AMU’s programs give me. Hell, I don’t know if teaching this field is possible. I don’t know what to do. Please help someone. I graduated with a 3.5 GPA from undergrad in Political Science with minors in History and African Studies. I haven’t taken the GRE yet.</p>

16

<p>^would you be interested in a program like this?</p>

<p>African Studies (Master of Arts) and Master of Library Science</p>

<p>“Academic programs in African Studies continue to grow, with a corresponding need for librarians who have knowledge and research experience in both the humanities and social science aspects of this field. The dual MA/MLS program requires completion of a minimum of 56 credit hours of graduate course work, rather than the 66 credit hours required if the two degrees are earned separately. Students must apply for admission to the masters programs of both the School of Library and Information Science and the African Studies Program and meet the admissions criteria established for each. The two degrees must be awarded simultaneously.”</p>

<p>[African</a> Studies (MA) and MLS](<a href=“Department of Information & Library Science: Indiana University Bloomington”>Department of Information & Library Science: Indiana University Bloomington)</p>

<p>Earn two masters at one time. I don’t have any first hand info about the program. I came across it when I googled African Studies graduate programs.</p>

17

<p>MV,</p>

<p>Is there any particular reason you want to get your Masters first then get the PhD? Most graduate schools will allow you to get a PhD with just a BS–in fact the PhD fast-track program skips the masters and shaves a year or two off your time.</p>

18

<p>Well, quite frankly I’m not sure if a Ph.D would be worth it at this point.</p>

<p>Here’s the situation I am in:</p>

<p>In my state (Michigan) only two universities offer terminal Masters programs in History. Central and Western Michigan. Central is my undergrad, and I live nearby so this is the brick and mortar school I am considering. WMU’s program is aimed more at medeival history.</p>

<p>Now, moneywise, I’d rather have my Masters first, then figure out if I need a Ph.D further down the line. I feel confident I can grab a job somewhere with a Masters.</p>

<p>American Military University (from my research) is by far the most respectable, and really the only online masters program that comes highly recommended. All the others are, like you all said, inferior for sure.</p>

<p>So to make things easier, these are my options due to me being dirt-poor, having only a low paying part time job and a lot of credit card debt (thus preventing me from relocating to another city or state at this time). </p>

<p>I can either go to CMU for my Masters or American Military University.</p>

<p>Tuition wise, CMU is about $100 per credit hour more than AMU.
I love CMU, but I get the impression that a lot of the history professors there aren’t the most rigorous out there. CMU has a good reputation, but as far as their history program goes, I’m not sure if it’d be really any better than AMU’s faculty.</p>

<p>Due to various financial concerns I am graduating about a year later than I should have (December this year), and so I’m eager to get my Masters started and finished as soon as possible. AMU offers a much more flexible program (I can just keep going without months off in between courses).</p>

<p>Faculty: Again, I really like CMU and I have great professors, but only a few are actively researching and even fewer have really rigorous courses. From what I hear about AMU the faculty are all actually working in the fields they teach (i.e. not always academic, but government positions, etc.)</p>

<p>I would like someday to work in the government, I’ve been particularly interested in one day becoming a civilian historian for the military as I’ve seen these jobs posted frequently.</p>

<p>So, CMU, which has a reputation as an excellent teaching college, would probably give me a lot of preparation for teaching. In fact, my professors always focus on the education aspect and orient their classes accordingly.</p>

<p>AMU, however, being an online course, would orient their classes to the researching and writing aspect, which I absolutely love and would find most useful for my career.</p>

<p>CMU doesn’t require the GRE for entrance, neither does AMU. CMU requires a single letter of recommendation, AMU doesn’t require any, so the acceptance hoops to jump through aren’t all that different. </p>

<p>Some other factors I’ve considered: I already have a small relationship with local museums. I’ve got a letter of recommendation for one for volunteer work I did for them. If I were one day to pursue a job with them I doubt they’d hold an online degree against me, and that could give me some more professional experience to help offset any bias against an online degree, right?</p>

<p>If I did my Masters at AMU, the hardest part as far as prejudice would go would probably be the first job, correct? After three years or so I hear your choice of school doesn’t matter as much as your professional experience. So really I’m looking at a 3 year window in which having an online degree might hold me back. If I can get that first job I could theoretically erase any bias, correct?</p>

<p>Right now I’m really leaning towards AMU, all these things considered. Aside from simply being more flexible at AMU, I don’t see a whole lot (on paper) to make me think AMU is any way inferior. </p>

<p>It seems professional prejudice is the only thing that I have to fear, and I can erase that by doing well at a related job, correct? </p>

<p>I appreciate all the input I’ve been given here, but considering these facts, can anyone still argue that I should go to CMU instead?</p>

19

<p>CMU faculty will know you much more personally, given the face-to-face time, and it counts for LOR if you decide to pursue for your PhD.</p>

20

<p>I’m interested in this question as well. I’m wondering if an MA from AMU could be used toward transferring coursework when going for the Ph.D (I’m guessing not?)</p>