<p>i am really confused about the differences between these two professions. the only difference i can see regarding limitations of a pa's is that they dont have full autonomy, which isnt that big a deal to me. can u guys give me a better explanation about pa's? Like do PA's have way better hours than doctors? can/do student that want to become pa's take pre-med? is choosing the path of becoming a pa the easy way for people that want to do what doctors do but dont want to take the horrific path to becoming a doctor? it seems to me that there's no point in going through the process of becoming a doctor if u can jus go to 2 yrs of pa school and be able to do most of what doctors can do... i guess im hoping that somebody here will point out the huge differences between the two that will help me feel better about my goal to become a doctor.</p>
<p>well Doctors get payed much better then P.A's
Doctors get way more respect
P.A's have to check in with Doctors.
Usually P.A is a plan B for pre- med people. </p>
<p>however </p>
<p>P.A do get better hours
They get payed really good. $100 hour
after experience they are as good as doctors. </p>
<p>when I volunteered at the hospital doctors asked our P.A for advise because he was a surgery P.A and he knew more about surgery and all then some doctors. </p>
<p>P.A's have there own patients and every thing.
P.A's don't get sued, Doctors do but that means that Doctors are boss of P.As and in the end if a doctor wants some thing done no matter what the P.A doctors says counts</p>
<p>Net salary is higher for physicians, but I suspect lifetime total earnings are higher (discounted for time) for PA's. I haven't done (and don't plan to do) the math, but I'd be surprised if this didn't work out as such.</p>
<p>Yes, hours are usually better, but it depends on the office/group/department a PA is working for. Some Docs allow their PA's a lot more freedom than others.</p>
<p>Docs get paid more, docs do more, and in the end, docs have the ultimate responsibility.</p>
<p>I've been in offices and departments where PA's function as little more than glorified medical students, others where they are equal to 3rd or 4th year residents (ie checking up on interns and medical students) and others where they are fairly autonomous in a number of things. </p>
<p>The office where the PA had the most autonomy for clinical visits though was a surgeon's office and while I was there, in the OR, I had greater "seniority" in the doctor's eyes than his PA did even though I was only in between my M1 and M2 years...</p>
<p>And while you may look at it and say, "why not take the shorter path and get to do most of it?"; I personally look at it the other way and think that it would annoy me tremendously to have a title with the word "Assistant" in it and not be able to do ALL of it... The hours and the other things probably wouldn't be a good enough incentive to have my ego bruised. But that's just me (and I can be pretty frickin' arrogant sometimes), and I know a ton of great people who are in school to be PA's and I know that they are going to be phenomenal at it and that it's the perfect job for them, not because they couldn't handle being a doctor, but because the differences make sense for them and the type of life they want to live. And when I'm finally in a position to make hiring decisions, I'll be right there to hire them.</p>
<p>Finally if you are reluctant about deciding between the two, remember you have time. PA school and Med school both require bachelor's degrees so no one is forcing you to make a decision at this exact moment. Find some docs to follow, find some PA's to shadow and you'll figure it out.</p>
<p>P.A's are like nurse practitioners.
every thing has to be run by doctors. in the end its only 2 more years of school for doctors but advantages are too many
besides if you have a doctors office you might have better hours then P.A</p>
<p>Advantages are too many? The advantage is independence. That matters to me, but the OP has said it doesn't matter to him.</p>
<p>It's two more years of school plus a residency.</p>
<p>Some doctors have better hours than some PA's. That's true, but irrelevant. The best comparison would happen at the mean, and I don't think there's any question that PA's have better hours.</p>
<p>I was not a student with a plan B or whatever you hear on these types of forums. I never took an MCAT. I always wanted to be a PA. Some people think it is settling, but some of the surgeries I have done most PA's and MD's will never do. I am consulted as a STUDENT on many cases. I have saved 3 people because of my clinical acumen. </p>
<p>IF YOU ARE GOING FOR A TITLE, RESPECT OR MONEY, then DON'T LOOK DOWN ON THOSE WHO REALLY CARE. Being good in Chem or Calc will never make you a good clinician. Can you make the clinical call? Can you stand alert in surgery for 8 hours. Do you have the power and knowledge to correct someone of any title? </p>
<p>Doctors, Nurses and PAs come in all types. Some stink and some are great. Bottom line is know your stuff and forget the titles and heirarchy! A dying patient does not care and neither does his or her family!!!</p>
<p>Become what you want and be the best. Many PAs in my state work by themselves in a practice where a doc may come by once a month. One PA "hired" 4 doctors who rotate through and he opened his own place. He delivered my doctor's children.
A great teacher (MD) at my school did not get into pa school here about 40 years ago. Yes 40 years ago. He went to MD school and loved our school so much he came back to teach here. </p>
<p>Good luck to you all. And you better study hard if you are going to ever see me!</p>
<p>Advanced Clinical Skills
Applied Therapeutics I (PAST-610-01)
Applied Therapeutics II (PAST-640-01)
Cardiovascular Diseases (PAST-601-01)
Clinical Diagnostic Procedures 550.01-550.03 Lab
Clinical Diagnostic Procedures 550.02
Clinical Nutrition (PAST-624-01)
Clinical Problem Solving I (PAST-605-02)
Clinical Problem Solving II (PAST-635-04)
Dermatology (PAST-680-01)
Diagnostic Imaging (PAST-650-01)
Gastrointestinal Diseases (PAST-631-01)
History Taking
Intro to Clinical Practice I (PAST-615-01)
Intro to Clinical Practice II (PAST-641-01)
Pharmacology
Neuro/Hematology/Oncology (PAST-661-01)
Obstetrics and Gynecology (PAST-620-01)
Orthopedics (PAST-603-01)
Pathophysiology
Public Health and Comm Med
Pulmonary&Infectious Diseases (PAST-602-01)
Renal/Genitourinary Diseases (PAST-632-01)
Surgery (PAST-645-01)
Statistics and Research Methods
Clinical Problem Solving III
Applied Theraputics III
Psychiatry
Pediactrics
Endrocrinology/Rheumatology
Emergency Medicine
Pediactrics</p>
<p>The worst diagnosis is the one you do not know about or make- so it is very challenging. </p>
<p>O.R. / E.R. Procedures:</p>
<p>Proximal humeral arthroplasty</p>
<p>TLIF (translumbar interbody fusion) I snapped off all involved spinous processes and retracted the spinal cord for 4 hours by hand, stitched the thoracolumbar fascia back together, all as a STUDENT, got offered a job right after by a very accomplished neurosurgeon </p>
<p>Sphincterotomy + fissurectomy</p>
<p>Incision and drainage of cyst</p>
<p>Suturing - both hand and instrument ties</p>
<p>Stapling</p>
<p>Gluing</p>
<p>Colostomy takedown (no more bag for the pt!)</p>
<p>Indirect inguinal hernia repair</p>
<p>Umbilical hernia repair</p>
<p>Injections, I.M., I.V.</p>
<p>Blood draws, many PA and MD/DO do not perform these adequately</p>
<p>Diagnoses:</p>
<p>Emesis secondary to concussion - missed by all but me on physical exam. Pt did not know about massive hematoma on back of skull</p>
<p>Ludwig's angina! my best call to date </p>
<p>Simple arrythmias by pulse, verified by 12 lead EKG</p>
<p>Various murmurs mostly 2/6 systolic</p>
<p>Brain cancer... bad one</p>
<p>Non ST elevation MI (heart attack w/o EKG findings dismissed by other "clinician")</p>
<p>Cardiac Ischemia (obese female NIDDM, presenting in church to me with emesis and vague numbness - heart attack until proven otherwise). Family was happy!</p>
<p>It is a tough decision for those still weighing the pros and cons. And it all boils down to what type of personality you have and what type of life you want to live.</p>
<p>If you are okay with not being the ‘boss’~ enjoy having a mentor~ enjoy having flexibility~ than you may have the personality to be a PA…</p>
<p>If you want complete independence~ ultimately want to be the boss and not have anyone telling you what to do~ and want to specialize and stick with that specialty~ then you would not be happy as a PA.</p>
<p>Also, when choosing to be a PA I looked at it as a lifestyle choice. I gain 2 years plus a residency (which you would work 80 hrs a week) of my life~ I can practice medicine, work the hours I want to work, make great money, travel frequently, start a family~ be a young mom, hang out with friends…just enjoy life… and start it earlier.</p>
<p>It just really depends on the individual and what they want to get out of their life.</p>
<p>And to clear up some misconceptions posted- PA’s can be sued, they have malpractice just like doctors do. PA’s definitely don’t work longer hours than MD’s. The level of autonomy depends on the practice/specialty. For instance, a family practice PA can be completely independent other than the supervising doc signing off on charts every so often. A surgical PA obviously assists the surgeon, rounds on pts in the hospital independently or with the surgeon, writes scripts for nurses, and makes notes in charts that are later reviewed by the surgeon. A PA in dermatology would be very autonomous~ and it is true that some practices are set up to have PAs seeing certain pts, like acne counsels and mole removal, whereas the Dermatologist may only see cancer pts (and more serious/complicated conditions).</p>
<p>It’s really like any field~ there are people with Master’s degrees and people with doctorates. It all depends on the amount of time and energy you want to devote to school and your career. I don’t think a lot of people have to make this decision. Usually it is crystal clear from the beginning. But please be advised, do not attempt to become either if you don’t plan to work your butt off.</p>
<p>Practice rules entirely depend on the state - in NC, which has some of the most liberal practice rules, MDs do not have to “sign off on charts every so often.” The PA only has to check in with the supervising physician once every 6 months.</p>
<p>Hours are all over the map, and it entirely depends on what specialty you end up in as to what your hours will be. </p>
<p>I will be attending PA school this summer, and the biggest impetus for me was having the flexibility to work in multiple fields without having to return to school or do another residency. I have interests in peds, ortho, and FP, so I will be able to work in all three of those fields throughout my career if I decide to do so.</p>
<p>Also, I think your level of autonomy as a PA is largely up to you and your relationship with your supervising physician. I know PAs that are on both ends of the spectrum - ones that are pretty much running rural family practices by themselves, and ones that are basically doing the stuff that the SP doesn’t want to do.</p>