@lisabees, what did you think of McDaniel? Our son originally turned his nose up at the Division III sports, but when I told him that they had the only electric bass ensemble south of NYC he got excited. My wife and I think it could be a good match for him, and not just because of the automatic 25K per year for kids of educators. He’s also had issues with anxiety, which hurt his grades for a couple of semesters. Taking out that stretch he’s been a solid 3.4-3.5 student. He got a 1320 on the SAT, which he’s happy with (his goal was 1300). He’s got the AP Lang exam coming up soon, but seems pretty confident. His brother made a D in the class 2 years ago, but got a 4 on the exam.
Electric Bass ensemble? Whaaaat? Awesome.
Honestly, the only thing I remember about McDaniel is that we knew it wasn’t a good fit. Something was missing for us - we both felt it at the same time and cut the tour short. Our tour guide didn’t talk about academics much. Intellectually, it didn’t seem as vibrant as the other schools. It was one of our last tours, though. We may have just reached our limit.
I just looked for an old trip report from me. Apparently, I was not active on CC for that son! He knew which school he wanted and applied ED. That was Susquehanna. And he has been thrilled with his choice.
Two other schools he and I visited were Moravian and Elizabethtown. I LOVED Elizabethtown. He started out wanting to play baseball in college, but decided during all of the interviews with coaches that he was sick of baseball. In his own words, he wanted to know what else there was in him. He started playing club rugby and is involved on campus in many other ways. I cannot say enough good things about his experiences at Susquehanna.
@mstomper Since I am new to this board, I am not sure about what kind of requirements you have, but your son - with his SAT score - can certainly reach for many schools. I sure understand the need for an “emotionally safe” fit, though!
S16 is bright, but has never cared much for school (like his dad and older brother). I’ve thought he might like Susquehanna as well. While he could probably get into “better” schools, we’re not sure he would like being in an intense academic environment. He’s a big sports fan, and likes the idea of a big time sports school. Being close to a city with pro sports would probably work for him, though. We live in the DC area, so visiting McDaniel wouldn’t be much of a time commitment. His S16 brother ended up at Temple. Older brother had a stratospheric SAT but his grades weren’t great. He was one of the few NMSF who didn’t advance to finalist.
@lisabees , I appreciate that you mentioned so many of the colleges I have thought about for D18 and then said you l LOVED Elizabethtown, since my oldest is there. She’s had an absolutely amazing education. I have graduate degrees but her education as an undergrad exceeds anything I’ve ever did, at nationally ranked flagships at that. I will probably have D18 apply to Etown and see how merit shakes out. I still want to visit some of those other LACs.
Over break, we went to some NJ publics instead of sticking to the PA LACs as I originally planned. They were more appealing than I expected and the costs are good as well with low starting costs and merit for average stats.
But I did miss that intellectual vibe. At one school, our group was gawked at like we were aliens as we walked through the food court. I heard a kid say, “Why are they with their parents?” Ummmm.
At the other school, D and I heard a current student say, as he was walking along a sidewalk, “I didn’t know I could get higher grades by having s*x!” D started cracking up and I said, “Welcome to college!”
@mstomper Ah, sports! I am not a sports person, but would places like Towson,U of D, West Chester be worthwhile? S at Susquehanna definitely needed athletic kids with a lot of school spirit, so I understand.
A lot of PA LACs have that feel, but the kids have higher stats and merit is basically nil.
@MACmiracle I am so glad to know that your D is happy there! It was number two on S’s list.
Love the stories about the NJ public students. Well, not.
@AnxietyMom the best solution I’ve found for test anxiety is repetition-take it again and again and again until you know it so well that the fear of the unknown is gone. For us this includes a lot of practice tests, and I anticipate she’ll take the ACT 3 times and the SAT 3 times.
Some people are like oh my goodness that’s awful, but she sort of shrugs and says “it’s four hours out of my day, I can do that”. Framing it like that also helps to reduce anxiety-if you look at it like that rather than “this horrible test I have to take”, it makes a difference in not activating the fear parts of your brain that short-circuit short term memory.
@MotherOfDragons Thanks for the advice. She is taking practice tests as part of her self-prep. This will be her first time sitting for the SAT, and she will sit for ACT next month. Whichever test with which she feels more confident/scores better, she will prep over the summer and retake in early fall/late summer (depending on the test). I’ll likely look into getting her a tutor once her preference is identified to really hep her pinpoint her weak spots and drill them so she is less anxious about it. Oddly, she seems less nervous about the standardized tests then regular class tests/mid-terms/finals. She knows she needs to do well in order to have the schools she likes in her reach, but seems less anxious then I would have expected (which is good). I’m trying hard not to pressure her to study more and remind her of the importance - now that she’s getting excited about colleges, she is more self motivated and I want her to own the process.
Speaking of Jersey Publics and working hard to raise your SAT… Stockton offers very good money for SAT/ACT
performance
Freshman Awards** SAT ACT Class Rank Annual Award
Provost’s Scholarship 1310+ 28+ Top 10% $9,000-$11,000 per year
Dean’s Scholarship 1220+ 25+ Top 15% $5,000-$7,000 per year
That’s a nice percentage of tuition…
Tuition & Fees in state $13,077 out of state $19,861
a smart Jersey kid who coasted through high school can earn half tuition by doing some practice tests and getting lucky on a few guesses. I know a few who did 
When are your kids finding the time to prep? Between end-of-year homework, softball and that gosh-darned IB art journal, I just don’t see her cracking the ol’ SAT book.
@JerseyParents Just took a look at Stockton. Had never heard of it – of course! Looks good in terms of majors offered, diversity, cost. It gets pretty decent grades on Niche. Can you tell me more about it?
With the new SAT so similar to ACT, do people still say that a kid is likely to do better on one than the other? DD has been studying for SAT, but would like to try ACT. My oldest - five years ago - did quite better with ACT, but he is quick at processing etc. She is SLOW in everything she does and is not strong in math. She is always the last done with a test in any class. I don’t want her time wasted on ACT prep, if it seems like a bad choice for her.
@lisabees I have exactly the same concerns about my D with the math weakness and speed. My plan was to give her an ACT at home and see how she did before signing her up and having to pay for it. The big problem has been setting aside the time to actually do it. She’s been struggling to find time to prep as the end of the year gets closer and life is just busy.
@Kardinalschnitt , You will definitely find diversity in NJ publics. I recently posted about our visits to Stockton and Rowan over spring break in another thread. I’ll try to find it and link or copy it.
D wasn’t interested at all in either before going but really liked both very much.
I complain about the lack of an intellectual vibe but I think it must be there if you look for it because there seems to be something for everyone.
The merit is very good for publics. Both are growing and building. Rowan is very obviously developing new programs all the time to meet the needs of the community it serves. Stockton probably is, too, but because we just had a tour and not an admission information session, I didn’t learn as much about their programs.
I think of Stockton has having a natural sciences/ health sciences strength and Rowan engineering and education.
@MACmiracle That’s why I wondered whether ACT is worth it. She took a Kaplan SAT prep class (waste of money) and she has done the SAT once. Should she just plow forward with SAT or would ACT prep be worth the time, when she barely has any?! I feel your pain!
Here’s the other post:
Just as an FYI, we visited Stockton and D really liked it. I wasn’t as impressed, but it was a rainy day and I think that didn’t help.
D liked the wooded surroundings and the freshman-only housing area. She admitted the housing wasn’t especially remarkable but she found it cozy, especially compared to the new freshman housing we had seen at Rowan. Floors are divided into male and female, and the opposite sex needs to be let in by someone on the floor as their key will not let them in. Just mentioning this because it’s a contrast to much of what we’ve seen.
D didn’t get such a good sense about the academics as she did with the Rowan info session (not much of an info session there, just a tour) but there are the same small classes with no TAs teaching. Science seems to be an area of strength with a much higher percentage of science-related majors than other NJ colleges.
One point about academic life that I liked was that a student is paired with a faculty advisor who they meet with once a semester. The university does not hold classes on that day so the entire day is set aside for that purpose. If the student does not jibe with the advisor they are matched with, switching appears to be encouraged until the right match is found.
While D saw the woods, my attention was taken by the massive parking lot in front of the main buildings. It felt depressing to me, especially since we still had to wait for a space to open up. I was relieved to learn there are plans to transform the parking lot into a grassy quad once construction of surrounding buildings is completed.
Overall, it seems there’s a lot of growth happening, even without any talk of the new Atlantic City campus.
The food options we saw were limited to a food court, but I think there is a more traditional dining option somewhere on campus. Otherwise, it could seem like I was eating at a shopping mall.
OOS direct costs seem to be around $31K and scholarships are generous, at least comparable to Rowan if not better, I think.
About Rowan:
Rowan reallly impressed dd today. She said compared to other visits we’ve made–not a lot and some for her older sister–it is where she has felt the most “at home.” And this the kid who has been saying she doesn’t want to go there. 180 degree turn. She was interested in small LACs, but with classes averaging 22 students and maxing out at 35, with only professors teaching, it seems like the best of both worlds. Tons of stuff going on. Weekly buses to Philly for nights out. On campus events Thurs-Sat nights. Lots of sports options. Skateboard friendly sidewalks.
D18 tries to study for at least 30 minutes or so each night for SAT. It doesn’t always happen, depending on assignments/studying for class, guitar lessons, working on the dogs training, etc… She’s not in any sports or current activities that have a large time commitment outside the house during the week, so she doesn’t have that struggle.
We have heard that the time limits are what make the ACT challenging but the material covered is somewhat easier than the SAT - math specifically, but math also counts for less of the overall exam, which can be good if your child is better at reading and interpreting and their scores in english, writing and science will keep the composite higher. I’ve heard a fair number of kids struggle with the science section just because they aren’t used to it. It’s more reading/interpreting the technical charts/data and finding the answer quickly than actual science knowledge.
My dd hasn’t taken either yet so we this is all from what we’ve read and heard. I’ll pass along her thoughts once she actually sits for the tests.
@lisabees D’s GC seemed against D taking an ACT before prepping for and taking one more SAT and seeing the scores. She is the one to give us the fee waivers for the tests so I try to be cooperative. And she’s been great to us.
If I follow her suggestion D can take the SAT again in June and based in that, I can decide if I want her to take the ACT and then we have the summer to do more prep. I don’t think I would have her do too much ACT specific prep in any case. I’d just coast on the SAT prep and maybe have her work through a couple of ACT tests.
According to D’s last score report, there are things that I saw which made me think she might so well on the ACT. Her reading and writing scores were great and she’s never spent any time prepping for those at all. There are more subtest related to those strengths in the ACT. In math, her big area of strength was the data analysis part and she is a science lover, so I think she might do ok in the ACT science section. It’s really the math that could bring it all down, like it did on the SAT. She’s really lopsided.
The other questions I need to think about are: would it change things for her to really improve her score? Would it put her into a higher merit category or enable her to be invited to scholarship competitions are much less selective schools? Would a much less selective private college be better that an in-state public anyway since she does have an intellectual bent?
And my new question after using Hamilton College’s NPC yesterday and getting a result of less than $10K: if her math score would jump, could she ever become competitive for a more selective school that offers generous need-based aid? If so, would the stress of attending make her unhappy or sick?
@AnxietyMom , Thanks for that description of the ACT.
@MACmiracle Oh boy can I relate to your post - in so many ways. This week, I have a kid trying to decide which school to commit to. It has been awful to watch. If he chooses one of the schools, most people will tell him he missed a once in a lifetime opportunity. I think of every possible consequence of each school - happiness, well-roundedness, stress, opportunity, finances.
I think I will follow your lead. D is planning to take the SAT again in June. Then, we will decide. But, of course, she is not doing any prep work, so I am not sure why her score will improve.