We’re not so much worried about tuition costs so don’t make that a factor in your suggestions - thanks.
Has anyone done any Ohio tours? We are thinking about a long weekend to took at the following: Ohio State, Denison (not really on our list but on the way to next stop), Ohio U, Xavier, U of Cincinnati, Miami, Dayton, Butler and Indiana.
Flying in to Columbus and out of Indianapolis.
@DCNatFan - we have visited Otterbein and OU (theater-oriented). They are quite different but both charming campii.
OU has special discover days, at least for Scripps (journalism/communications) and theater, that are very well-done tours. They are happy to set up departmental visits to complement a regular tour. The town is a cute, vibrant college town, but in the middle of a rural area, kind of the same area as WVU - coal country, Appalachian hills, red state feel, not upscale. That may or may not affect your perspective – it doesn’t to me, but I thought I’d mention it.
Otterbein is in a suburb of Columbus and is gorgeous but much smaller. I’d be thrilled to send my kid to either. Both offer decent OOS merit.
Denison and Bowling Green and UC are on our list but I don’t know that we’ll make it for tours.
Anyone else have serious testing concerns? According to SAT/ACT conversion to GPA charts found on some popular college prep blogs, a GPA of 3.4 is roughly equivalent to about 1000 SAT or 21 ACT. These test scores seem extremely low to me given that they are the National average scores, but I think of a 3.4 as being quite above average. Am I wrong in this? Also, those are close to my D19’s ‘no-prep’ scores and it is upsetting to see that they fall well below the 25th % even for schools that are called A+ schools for B students. We will be doing lots of test-prep over the summer!
@Acersaccharum I would not pay any attention to a GPA to ACT/SAT conversion chart. Two entirely different things.
My S17, who ended up getting his GPA up to a 3.49 by the end of senior year started out with a 18 ACT no prep score and was able to get it up to a 24 (25 superscore. I felt for him the test score maybe lined up with his gpa.
He was accepted to 7/7. S19 on the other hand has a lower gpa but significantly higher test score. In his case the test score shows what his gpa could/should be lol.
I also wouldn’t get too hung up on the A Schools for B students list, it’s just one data point.
Has she tested yet at all?
My S17 just got his March SAT in and if you converted it to GPA using one of those charts, he would have a 4.0. Which, of course, he does not. I don’t think you can accurately convert a test, which is a snapshot of a single moment in time, into GPA which is the photo album, if you will. Find a great prep place. There are so many to choose from but I asked our GC for a personalized recommendation for S. GC pointed us to a local place that works with students more individually because S had multiple LDs. I was very, very happy with that recommendation when test scores came in on Friday.
Thanks, @eandesmom , I’m am really hoping she can improve. First try SAT 1050, ACT 22. We have found a good prep place and plan to study over the summer like it’s a job!
@fwtxmom , great snapshot-photo album analogy! She is applying to some test optional schools, but of course we are hoping for merit and test scores appear to be ver important for that reason.
The very best test prep is taking practice tests. Our prep place offered unlimited practice tests after completion of the 14 hours of test prep curriculum they require. They urged doing at least 5 full practice tests because kids really click on the structure of the test and how to take it after that amount of experience with it. They advised us that 5 practice tests usually produced a significant bump in score. The prep place also required attending a 2 hour test review after each practice to help students correct mistakes before they could schedule another practice exam. We followed their advice and S’s score went up 290 points between his 10th grade PSAT and the SAT he took March 10 (which was his second SAT.)
@fwtxmom that is exactly right. Do a practice test in real time. Go back the next day and seek to understand every wrong answer. Maybe study those topics a little on Kahn or in a prep book and then go back again to another test. It’s a pain and it’s hard to find time but it works. S19 had a 1340 sophomore year SAT but got a 1540 in Aug of junior year after studying and then a 221 PSAT…but he worked hard for it.
I agree, practice test practice test practice test! I’d stick with the ACT as her baseline is higher and opportunity for improvement is higher and the chances for improvement are greater if you focus on just one, not both. Magoosh and Kahn are good online resources for back up. That said, I’d be careful of test optional. My S17 applied to several that allowed for that and we sent scores. For him (3.47 at application time, medium rigor, and 25 superscore) I did not think his GPA and other factors were compelling enough to leave out the tests.
Different school value different things. We were also on the merit hunt and it’s hard for this group of kids. Getting in is one thing, but merit $$ is another. For S17 the ones that were test score heavy on merit, did not give him the larger offers. Ones that liked the whole package, proportionally, offered much nicer ones. If she takes the prep seriously over the summer she will improve. How much is hard to say and varies by kid that is for sure!
For my S17, he really needed some 1:1 work to keep him on track for prep, we’d wanted to take it one more time but he broke his wrist. For my S19 he needed to know the strategies and then test out those strategies on practice tests.
What schools are on her list?
Yes, test-optional is a bit of a double edge sword. We certainly don’t want to submit any scores that don’t make her look like a stronger applicant. It’s tough to dramatically improve junior year GPA at this time of year, but it seems possible to spend the summer studying hard for tests. We will focus on ACT, as she did a little better and liked the format considerably more. The plan is to take a practice, spend a week in intensive class, take the real ACT, and then spend the rest of the summer fine-tuning her knowledge/skills and taking again in September. I was not aware that schools superscore the ACT, but she will take it 2 more times, so hopefully that works to our advantage.
The tales of improvement here are heartening!
Favorite schools so far: Ithaca College, Willamette, U Maine. D19 is also an athlete, so finding the right team- fit is making this a little trickier. Schools in her academic tier don’t offer much admission help to recruited athletes, so she has to rely on her GPA and test scores.
@Acersaccharum that is quite the variety of schools! Each school handles superscoring differently so check each website. If they don’t say one way or the other, email admissions and they will let you know. S17 applied to Ithaca, their offers will vary by major so factor that in as the more competitive majors (Park) will have more competition for merit. Their offer was not as generous as others, it was the once school (out of the 7) that we never visited as a result. I believe Ithaca did superscore and we sent both of his scores. Willamette is more likely to be generous whereas UMaine has the auto OOS offer so I’m not sure they’d offer more than that but it’s a good deal.
I will also say that a strong junior year, even though it may not improve the overall gpa dramatically, shows really really well on applications. Rigor is a factor though so for example if rigor was less but grades better it won’t have the same impact as equal or more difficult rigor with same or better grades.
@eandesmom
I am REALLY struggling to get D to add schools to her list. These 3 are sort of like “category headings” for the possibilities of combining athletic divisions, team competitiveness and academic majors.
She’s so in love with Ithaca that she would stop looking if I let her (she is interested in health sciences and nutrition). But I gather their merit is unpredictable. If her academic stats were higher, she would have so many more choices.
Maine is probably a lock, as her stats would get her that attractive OOS offer, but she has not visited nor contacted the coach. It’s Division 1, so she needs to do that ASAP. Our whole family loved so much about Willamette, but she would sacrifice team competitiveness for it.
As for rigor, she will graduate with 2AP’s, 4 IB HL, and advanced math track (but no calculus). Generally, I am very hopeful, but wanting to nail the standardized tests so we can rest easy!
Thanks so much for the thoughts and guidance.
@Acersaccharum Ithaca’s merit tops out, I think, at 20. They are a PROFILE school and do not meet full need and are, as you say, not known for being great with merit. If it helps at all, my S applied as an Environmental Science major and they offered him 17k. His close friend who was accepted into the Park School for Communications and had a better GPA, similar rigor and I think a better ACT (but not sure) was offered 15. No additional FA was offered (to us, no clue about the friend) and we did have a gap based on our EFC.
So I’d factor that in depending on your budget. Both boys loved a lot about Ithaca and were disappointed that the offers just made it not work for either family. His friend is at Muhlenberg and mine is at UVM so it all worked out.
What is her sport? It seems a bit late to be contacting coaches but my only experience is soccer. For soccer, practically speaking, all of our D14’s cohort either had likely’s by now or were in conversation and had been seen or were planning to be seen over the summer. Especially D1.
Swimming is her sport, so submitting times is easy. If she really wants D1 (low) or D2 she is behind on contacting coaches, but not too late. She’s really better D3 material and I think it’s a much better fit, so for schools that don’t do heavy recruiting, she’s still in plenty of time to initiate contact, but the sooner the better. Only the top-schools tend to offer admissions favorability to athletes and she is not in the running for high D3 academics. Also, that means no athletic money.
We have a high EFC, but want our D to have some “skin in the game”, so we gave her a college budget and will allow her to meet it with merit, athletic $, or through working.
I love Burlington and am trying to get UVM on her list - but the team is women only and she thinks she’ll never meet anyone (like any college student has never done that - lol, and major eye roll!)
@Acersaccharum she thinks she will never meet anyone at UVM? Why just because swimming is women only? My S17 may not be the best example as he is an extrovert on steroids but he’s had zero issues meeting people.
We are a high EFC skin in the game family as well so I can relate. I found UVM, for him, to be more holistic than many in terms of merit as his stats were definitely not in their upper tiers, he squeaked into the middle 50 on test score but was in the bottom quadrant (barely but still) for GPA. We thought it was a low reach at the time but after seeing the freshman profile (and admissions rates for men in particular) I think it was more of a reach than we realized at the time.
It’s been an amazing fit for him.
When looking at a school like UVM that has a women’s team but doesn’t have a men’s team in a big sport like swimming, it’s important to figure out why. Is there some big men’s sport (football?) that they need to offset with a women’s sport? For UVM, there is no football team so why no men’s swimming team?
I think that’s important because of budgets. Is the athletic director fully behind the women’s teams or just putting up with them. Is there another team or student group to share the costs of the facilities, fields, equipment, repairs or is that all going against this team?
My daughter does date a guy from the opposite team, but that isn’t always the easiest. When one team is playing at home, the other is traveling. The guys who showed up the most were the football players because they play opposite season. Many athletes do hang out together, but it isn’t limited to one sport.
UVM is all about…hockey. And hockey. And hockey.!
@eandesmom Ridiculous, I know! I should post that on the “Silliest reasons your child rejected a school” threads!
But UVM has women’s hockey too, so the scholarships would balance out.
The two teams UVM has for women and not for men are field hockey and swimming. To balance, it might be that more women attend UVM than men (I don’t know if that’s true) or that fewer scholarships are offered to women in sports that they do offer to both (18 men’s hockey scholarships but only 15 women’s).