I should say, before I’m completely misunderstood, that I know big schools can have good academics but it takes a very confident freshman to seek help and D wouldn’t just be seeking help for class but would like guidance on how to decide on a major. It’s just a more independent existence at a bigger school. She advocates for herself well here but I don’t think it would go as well next year at a big school. If we had business or engineering majors on our hands, we’d be all over bigger schools!
As I said there are plenty of other reasons we picked UMich.
UCLA and Cal, the top 2 UC’s have student-to-teacher ratios of 19 and 20 to 1. UMich is 15:1.
The UC’s have trouble paying their GSI’s. There’s no labor strife that I’m aware of at UMich.
Other than Markley, which is scheduled to be replaced, just about every other dorm on Central Campus and The Hill has been remodeled.
UMich has 40+ departments in LSA that are Top 10 departments and others like Math, which are like #12 ish. Then there’s also Ross, Nursing, Kinesiology, Dance/Theater and the CoE.
Registration, access to professors and advisors, etc. has been relatively easy the 1st two years.
Central Campus is very small and rectangular and easy to navigate. UMich has a small campus feel to us.
Ann Arbor is a great little town. I’ve run the town already, parks, arboretum, neighborhoods, etc. I’ve run 3-5 miles (and back) in every direction. The YMCA is relatively new and beautiful. And close to campus. Of course, the students have access to the IM buildings.
There’s a mall 3 miles from Campus with an Apple store. There’s also a Whole Foods, Farmers Market, etc.
Plenty of off-campus housing, new and old, much cheaper (and close) than Berkeley, Westwood, Irvine, San Diego, Santa Cruz, etc.
D18 had little interest in a religious school. So ND was ultimately ruled out.
For my S21, the appeal of big seems similar to what others have said – the energy on campus, school spirit, lots of new people to meet, lots of activities. He went to a very small HS for freshman year and hated it and was so happy to transfer to his 2500 student HS.
He’s not scared off by some large classes and at the schools he’s considering, his major (statistics) would be fairly small so I he’ll have the benefits of small classes and close faculty relationship in his major while having the big-campus experience.
I think it also just fits his ideal of what college looks like since he has visited Cal Poly SLO with me many times over the years (I went there and have close friends who still live in the area). If we lived in CA he’d want to go there. Since we’re in VA, his top choices are VT, JMU, UDel and UVA.
@JESmom yes! Big school is what “college looks like”. I totally get that.
@sushiritto i know not one person who doesn’t love Ann Arbor if they go to Michigan. My H doesn’t see why D would go to Mich over UIUC and, since we prepaid tuition for Illinois when she was a baby, Illinois would only cost us room and board. I think we paid something like $30k for all four years back in 2004 and now that investment would pay for all four years of tuition. Too bad neither of our kids wants to go there!!
@homerdog – I personally was drawn to big schools back in the day b/c of the social aspect. I was attracted to all the different social groups on a big campus and seemingly limitless social possibilities. And in fact, I ‘tried on’ a couple different personas, in some ways, while in college. My friends my junior and senior years were totally different from my freshmen social group.
I felt like in high school everyone was very pigeon-holed and I for one needed that big school environment to give me the space to learn more about myself.
Just wanted to follow up on this quote. They’ve updated their website with the supplemental material options - You submit either an ACT/SAT test score, 3 AP/IB scores or a written, graded paper. My daughter was thrilled - she thought it was going to involve more essays.
My D21 wants big (and also urban apparently). I don’t think it’s even about sports or school spirit necessarily. I think she is afraid a small school will be too much like high school part 2. She wants more…more people, more clubs, more majors, more classes to choose from, more excitement…bigger, better etc.
My mom heart would like to see her go small because I think they hold your hand more, guide you and take care of you but as someone who went to a large state flagship, I wanted the same as her. I didn’t care about having my hand held or being a big fish in a little pond. I wanted anonimity and freedom and lots of different, unique people. I liked that they had a club for absolutely everything. I liked the big school spirit. I liked that I could take ice skating or hungarian folk dancing for my gym requirement. I didn’t mind that classes were big in the beginning because all of them were not that way and by the time you were into your major, they were smaller. The only downside I noticed is that you really do need to keep on top of things and yourself because no one else is.
@sushiritto Dumb question but what does it mean when a department is top ten? Wouldn’t that be more about the research being done in the department? Not necessarily the teaching?
The weird thing is that I think both of our kids are kids who are highly self aware and have good self control - both of which would serve them well at a big school. I just think they aren’t ready for that at age 18. They like cozy. Well, S19 definitely does. I read somewhere, when choosing the type of school that’s best for you, where do you want to be when you feel stressed? (Because college is stressful.) Do you want to be in the hustle and bustle and anonymous? Are you energized or annoyed by all of the action?Or would you rather be in nature, somewhere peaceful? For S19, there was really no question. He’s an outdoor kid who loves running and hiking. D21 would say definitely not urban. Cute suburban would be fine. And a beach? Sign her up.
I get concerned about huge classes for S21. I think he would do best in smaller classes, but he also loves big time sports and school spirit.
Yeah I get a little ruffled when people say kids at small schools are the kind of kids who need small classes. These aren’t kids who need hand holding. They want smaller classes for the engagement aspect. Just like most kids had to make remote learning work last spring, lots of kids at LACs could make big classes work but they would be less inspired.
I think the big classes thing can also be overstated as an issue at big schools. My college was around 15K students. I only had a handful of classes in big lecture halls. Generally my classes were more like 30 people.
My daughter is all over the map when it comes to size. She wants to have a career in Biomedical research. So, wherever she thinks she can have good opportunities for research is what she has on the list.
UT Austin, A&M , ASU Barrett Honors college large public universities.
Rensselear and Case Western - target
Rice (Ha!) -reach
Wellesley, Swarthmore and Bryn Mawr- LACs (and also very small.)
I have a teacher rec issue / question.
My S has had one of his teachers recs ‘sewn up’ since early this year – a history teacher who is a rock star and with whom my S has a great relationship.
He also needs a math/science rec b/c he’s applying to engineering. It’s a bit of an issue b/c his math teacher (who he had for 1.5 years) left, and moved away, this past January. He had a long term sub and then a new teacher who he, of course, barely knows b/c of remote learning starting right after she started. So she’s out. He didn’t take science as a Junior (odd, I know, but it was a scheduling thing) and is instead doubling up this year with Physics and APES. He wouldn’t have much time to get to know them b4 they’d have to submit a rec, right?
So, this leaves his pre-engineering teacher whom my S has a great relationship with, and he’s the advisor to the robotics team that my S is very involved with. They are very close. He’s not ‘core’ science but given the options, I think it’s his best bet. WELL, we just found out he’s retiring and won’t be back this year!
My S asked him last week to do the rec and he said yes – Is it okay to used a retired teacher? The letters are submitted through Naviance – I assume a retired teacher can still submit it-- perhaps the GC will have to upload or something, right?
TIA!
@AlmostThere2018 - I would think a retired teacher is fine as long as he can upload to the system. My kids are both using a teacher that is not returning this year and our college counseling office said that is a nonissue. Having a teacher that also knows your son through a club is awesome! Sounds like a winner 
UCIC is a great school and it’s mostly prepaid. That’s a fantastic option. Although UMich’s tuition is much more expensive than a UC here in CA, campus and off-campus housing is cheaper, as is the food, gas, etc. Also, we thought UMich was very generous with their AP credit, so my D18 is nearing senior standing. We may be able to knock off a semester’s (+) worth of tuition even though D added two minors.
And UC’s admit by major, while UMich, every LSA student arrives undeclared. We just saw too many positives over a UC or SLO. And of course, sports mean more in the B1G than the Pac-12.
Sorry, I should have provided a link to my post. I assume it’s all inter-related.
That was my exactly my experience at a 16,000 undergrad school.
@sushiritto I am watching the latest season of “Last Chance U”, they are in Oakland at Laney Community College. It is not near as interesting or compelling as when they were at Independence, Kansas or Scooba, MS. I get what you say about where football is a big deal and where it is not.
@Homerdog…That’s a great deal for staying in IL.
Here in FL we actually got an even better deal though, lol: When our S was born we immediately bought into FL Prepaid for him. $10,000 total for ALL four years of tuition.
And…Bc of his GPA and ACT, S21 will qualify for Florida Bright Futures scholarship. FBF pays for 100% tuition. So bc he already has FL Prepaid he can use the FBF monies to cover books, fees, labs. (And I believe then he can use remainder for housing, etc.)
With UF and FSU on the table it makes it hard to look OOS but S much prefers to do so.
When options (hopefully plural!) come in March/April then we will be comparing costs for sure…especially depending on the status of online versus B&M classes.