Love that!
I kept a big stack of those around for years, mostly it brought a smile to my face when I thought about where I ended up after these other places I would have been less happy at told me no. Eventually during one of my moves I chucked them in the recycle bin.
@AlmostThere2018 When our older S was applying, and we were searching for merit aid, we used the 75% and above to help pick the schools to apply to. which worked.
But, to just get in, I would think any data point that shows the student in within the schoolâs range should be more helpful than nothing. After all, schools obviously take kids at the 25%.
Iâm concerned that AOâs compare kids from the same school. Do they? I donât know, but assuming they do, if others in your school send the scores and your child doesnât, do they assume itâs lower than their 25-75% range? It could be that the particular applicant was sick or had some other reason so they donât have a test, so I shouldnât assume this as an AO, and IF weâre really TO, I shouldnât care. But then why not be test blind?
@sushiritto same here. We are also N. Calif and all our sites have been cancelled as well. D21 March - Oct tests all cancelled so as of the Oct one that was 5 for her. We are DONE. Nope not trying. She will be TO for everything. Luckily she landed in the top 10% of her class and the UCs usually accept ~top 14% from her all girls school so if she doesnât get into her ED school (which for us is less than our CSUs) she will be fine.
She was accepted to 2 Fly-Ins using TO and one of them is to her ED school so she is very excited about that. Iâll let everyone know how it goes Mid December.
I hope Dâs test from last week ends up being a good score. The problem she has is that her score is 25-50% at most places she is applying. 35 on English (good) 27 Math (bad). We just donât know what to do with it.
If it was just a bit worse, or didnât have the English score, TO is the obvious answer. I think if she was 33 instead of 32 with at least 30 on Math, send is the obvious answer. But she is right in that gray area. Probably some AOâs see it as a positive, others as a negative. I wish I knew which ones were which.
@havenoidea â Right. Or what if a kid doesnât test b/c they donât want to take the risk of COVID b/c they have a vulnerable family member at home? It would be natural for AOs to make intra-school comparisons and favor those with test scores â but I hope they are trained not to.
Interesting point about between 25th and 75th being enough to get in. My Sâs score falls in this range at both his reaches, but when the AO of one of them said during an info session âsubmit the score only if it strengthens your applicationâ my S took from that that a score closer to 25th would not meet that threshold. For this reach we would get the need-based aid we need to be able to afford â so not looking for merit. I would also say his score doesnât fully âmatchâ the rest of his application â 4.0 GPA w/ lots of rigor. Sigh.
Wonât the colleges be concerned with their yield if they only accept the kids that submit scores in the 75th percentile? Iâm talking schools outside of top 20 like the big state schools in the top hundred or so. Wonât they worry that their school is considered a safety with scores so high? And if those kids were lucky enough to test and do well, maybe theyâre hoping to get into their reaches. Iâm thinking that colleges will have to choose some kids with good grades/essays/ECs but no test to protect their yield. Again, this is not relevant to the top schools where everyone has a 1500 or 34+
We were told by the guidance office that if itâs relatively easy to get a sitting that it would be beneficial for our students to take the test and report the scores if they were in range for the school. This was based on the logic that most of the kids from the school would be testing. Thankfully, parents in our community have not had to go to heroic lengths like traveling out of state to secure a spot. If that were the case, weâd have gotten different advice.
I am imagining a nightmare scenario for class of 2022 kids in which only the high scorers from 2021 will submit scores. So for next year the 25% percentile will be a 1500/33. Iâm mostly kidding; it would be a shame for next yearâs class to have to face what appears to be an impossible standard.
We also have received emails addressed to incorrect first names (not from Duke). And got a good chuckle from the random ECs on the UNC mailer.
@2ndthreekids Your child sounds like a very good student! There will be many schools happy to welcome a weighted 4.0, 29 composite, top 25% student. I remember following the 3.0-3.4 GPA thread for my older childâs graduating year. It was very active and I was pleasantly surprised at the schools where a A-/B+ UW student could get in and get prettify generous scholarships too.
@momtogkc We did a similar whirlwind trip a few months ago to VA/NC and saw a few of those same schools, plus a few others. Even without an official tour, it was immensely helpful for my S21 and he was able to rule out 4 of the 6 schools we saw.
Also, you are definitely not the only one feeling behind! My guess is there are quite a few of us, and probably some who read but donât post on this thread. Half the time I find this thread super helpful, the other half of the time it gives me anxiety. S21 still doesnât have a definitive college list, his essay draft is terrible (according to him, but I agree), and he is awaiting scores but they will probably be mediocre since he hardly studied. Heâs just losing motivation quickly after so many changes and cancelations these past 6 months. I keep just reminding myself to breath. He will land where he is meant to be!
FWIW on how schools are handling Test Optional and Test Submitted: On our basically semi private tour last week of the University of Texas at Austin, I lamented to our tour guide that I didnât know how in the world the Admissions folks were going to figure out admissions this year with all the Test Optional business. The tour guide said that the Admissions office figured all that out in the spring when this stuff hit. In a small nutshell, this is how I understood it: He said they researched and analyzed their admissions figures of the High School Classes of 2018 and 2019 to get analytics for who they accepted and made some formula for the stats without the test scores. In this way, they could get the same caliber of students that they were selecting in 2018 and 2019 without test scores. Does that make sense? Kinda like a teacherâs rubric when grading projects; all these components add up to a 100. If she takes out one of the components and adds a few points to each of the remaining components, she will still come up with a 100 points. This is how Iâm imagining the logistics. So if a student submits a test score, they can use their old method; if a student does not, they use this new method. Either way should yield the same caliber of student they are seeking.
I heard the Bates AO on a recent webinar (please donât ask which one because I canât keep track these days!). Anyway, Bates has been TO for years, and they usually have 50% apply TO, 50% submit scores, with acceptances at that same ratio. He said they expect to see closer to 75% TO this year, FWIW. No idea how they came up with the number, but I thought it was interesting.
Our D has gotten emails with the wrong name, but regular mail? With the right address and wrong name? That would be strange!
@AlmostThere2018, what if a kid does take the test, takes the risk of Covid-19 even though she does have a vulnerable family member, because the reading proficiency rate of her high school, as stated on the school profile is only at 34%? My kid NEEDS to send her very high ERW even if her math score drags her down to average. For her and other students not at prestigious high schools, test blind schools are a little unfair. The closest thing my D had to a rock-solid safety that she truly likes has just gone test blind and now I feel a little shaky about that (even though I still think sheâll get in). Maybe test blind is just great for kids at competitive high schools but not exactly fair for others. Itâs like she has to pay the price for her Dadâs decision to teach at a university in an outlier town even though Dad, himself, got to have an elite education at a city magnet school and a tippy-top university.
@ChillyCow interesting. My son is applying to UMass Amherst and they have a similar quantitative/historical approach
âHistorically, UMass Amherst has relied on the applicantâs GPA and tests scores for the quantitative assessment of the review process. Obviously, with test optional, the evaluation will rely primarily on the applicantâs GPA. For students who have or will submit test scores, your test scores will not work against you. We will use your submitted scores to determine if they are greater than the predicted value produced by the analysis of the past three years of UMass Amherst applicant data. If your test scores are greater, they will be considered as part of the quantitative review. If not, they wonât factor into the consideration.â
I guess I have to take this at face value, though since Sâs current score is lopsided Iâm not sure if that would be factored in or not for the major.
@inthegarden â As I said before, context is important, and your Dâs decision to submit a score makes sense to me. Sending a hug right now â the uncertainties are hard!
This from Cornell: They wonât even look at scores for applicants to: CALS, Arch, Dyson AEM, Hotel. They are âscore free.â
These schools are âTOâ: CAS, Engineering, HumEc, and ILR.
Interesting. Wonder how they decided which is which. Seems to imply they want to see scores for the 2d group.
@momandslp I think ED would definitely help his odds for Northeastern. They are need aware, so if you are full pay I think that helps. Also, in the US News rankings they fell quite a few spots, from what I have read it is because US News change their methodology to add test optional schools as well as student loans. For good or bad Northeastern has been very focused on their rankings and I would think ED would be a good for them to lock in kids. When S19 applied they told us they did not admit by major, I know it is very easy to switch majors, but not sure if it helps for admissions. For Covid concerns NUin Dublin was the only one I know of that is happening this fall. I can see your concern for next year no know what it will be like. I think on the applications you say if you would be interested in NUin, so if they only offer NUin in ED it may not be binding.
The decision to send a more average composite score does not make sense if the majority of students from more competitive high schools send only 75%+ scores. That would undo any effort on her part to level the field.
@NateandAllisMom â wow, I wish all colleges were as transparent as UMass. Other than the few places that have said they are test blind, thatâs the most detailed explanation of how a college is using test scores as Iâve seen! Good on them!
More of that would save a lot of kids (and parents) angst this Fall!
@inthegarden â the key word in your last post is âif.â No one knows what scores students are submitting. And we donât know how most colleges will use (or not use) test scores this year. We can all hypothesize, but we truly are flying blind. College admissions has always been murky; itâs just more so this year.
I think itâs fair game for students to directly ask the colleges to which they are applying for their advice. Might be something your D would consider?
@homerdog I have no clue if the kids will get anything out of the trip but I am hoping at least seeing the campus and surrounding areas may help. For example Elon (one of the two Iâve seen before)- my oldest decided it was too remote and there were not enough places she could walk off campus but maybe D21 will be ok with that once she sees it? She has also said she does not want a school smaller than her 3,500 person high school, but maybe seeing 3,000 kids at URichmond will change her mind?
I looked into flying to/from Charlotte but our only option was American and they are still packing the flights so I opted for the long drive.
@eb23282 We did the same with college rejection letters in boarding school!
@flyawayx2 Thanks for the reminder that lots of us are far from being ready to send in applications! I just feel like I was so much farther ahead at this point with D19 (helped that her test scores were set by then.) I also have to remember even though she was done with some things early she still didnât submit her applications until about 11:55pm the night they were due. ?
@dadof4kids We were in a similar position with D19 although you may be looking at some more competitive schools and we had no TO option. D had a 32 ACT with very lopsided scores, she tried one more time and the math finally went up but another went down so she still had a 32.
Her original breakdown was 34 English, 26 Math, 36 Reading and 34 Science. She was accepted to all of her schools- Tulane, BC, Richmond, U Miami, UF, FSU, Fordham, Clemson and Elon. Not sure if this helps at all but with such similar scores I thought Iâd throw it out there.
@AOP1925 Thank you for the info that Northeastern may not admit by major. S21 thought it would be easier to get in as Undecided than Engineering, and he still might want to go in Undecided there even though he wants to start in Engineering if he goes to Pitt. There is a Northeastern virtual admissions visit at his school Monday, so he should ask. Also, I think you might be right that ED is not binding if a candidate only gets in through NUin. Another question S21 should ask. I still think he will not want to go ED, but at least he can make an informed decision.
FWIW S21 is definitely on the lower side of the middle 50th percentile of SAT scores for Northeastern (composite), but his math score is high and he he thinks wants to do something in the sciences. I am inclined to send his score because math is important to those majors. He is an A- student at a competitive private high school that does not have honors or AP classes, but they do have Advanced Physics, which he is taking. Perhaps I am making a mistake, but I feel like treating his math score like a subject test. His verbal score is OK.