We are an Asian-American family (so no URM), no first-gen, from the Northwest Region. Tier-2 private school. No hooks.
Our first child (19) attends Brown. No other Ivy acceptance.
Second child (20) attends a HYP. One A-, 30 to 40% A+, 1540 SAT. Second child got into 6 Ivies, Duke, full-merit scholarships from Vanderbilt, USC Trustee etc. We got the opportunity to read the reports from AOs. Both raved about essays and the amazing reference letters from teachers. They were really good. I am pretty sure my first child would not have received such glowing references. The second child is also materially different from the first child. More diligent, process-driven while the first one is happy-go-lucky, and a little lazy
If she likes project management, have her look into getting her PMP certification. I make a nice living as a project manager, and I do not have a graduate degree.
My kids sound very similar to yours. Oldest is at UCLA. Second kid (2022) has superior stats, superior letters of rec, objectively better essays, superior extra curriculars, works harder. Got shut out of almost all her choices. We didnāt get the same result as you sadly. Itās been a heartbreaking admissions season for us.
My D18 got accepted everywhere she applied except for Yale. Brown, Columbia (dual degree program that has higher acceptance rate, though), Stanford, Berkeley GMP with direct entry to HAAS and invited for Regents, Georgetown and several international schoold including Oxford.
She was and still is an exceptional writer, naturally gifted. Got multiple writing awards both in journalism and creative writing, some of which national. Was published in several publications including a young writer anthology. Leadrship at the school level (was EIC of the newspaper in our large, public, very competitive and prestigious HS) and at city level. Also very good in foreign languages with some national awards in those. Genuinely passionate for her ECs which were coherent around her talents and this was reflected throughout her apllication, including the essays. Excellent everything else (4.0, 35 ACT, NMF).
I have no idea if she would get different results today. Probably, would still be accepted to Oxford which is not holistic. Still, the impact and level of recognition of the ECs is important. I feel that national awards in prestigious competitions would get you far.
Hopping over from the HS Class of 2024 group to chime in and sayā¦let me know if your D wants to chat over the phone about project management. Iāve been doing IT project mgmt for several years. No tech degreeā¦my bachelorās is in psychology of all things. Iād be happy to give her some pointers, advice, answer whatever questions she might have.
My sonās dream school has always been UCLA even when he didnāt know what he wanted to major in. One place he was sure he didnāt want to go was Berkeley, he had heard so much about the competitive nature of the place and it being too close to home didnāt help either. But he didnāt think he stood any chance of getting into either of these, as we have watched UC admissions become unbelievably competitive with every passing year.
While researching different colleges to make his list, he really liked Georgia Tech and CMU. He was fortunate enough to get into all of those, and guess where he is finally going - UC Berkeley!!!
We visited admitted student days at both UCLA and Berkeley. UCLA campus was very impressive. Itās a beautifully integrated campus, with amazing dining options, set in a very nice area of LA. Thereās nothing to not like! But when we went on the Berkeley campus tour, something clicked. He could really see himself there. He loved everything about it, the campus, the tour guide, the vibe, even the surrounding area of the city didnāt bother him. He came home and contacted kids he knew from his high school who are at Berkeley right now, asked them a bunch of questions. I had never seen him so invested in a school even when he was applying to colleges! He is very sure this is where he wants to go.
Momson2, I envy your sonās clarity. My son has been agonizing over the choice between Case Western and CMU. On one hand, you have one of the best, most prestigious engineering schools in the country with great outcomes, an amazing alumni network (I have friends from CMU who are on their fourth start-up who routinely return to campus to hire engineering and CompSci majors), but limited student support and a reputation as a grind. On the other hand, he has a less prestigious, but still strong engineering school that is much more student friendly, provides more student support and is more flexible on majors. Frankly, I think in his mind it is a choice between doing well at CWRU and struggling, or even failing, at CMU. After calling both schools to answer last minute questions and building a matrix of outcomes, he has said that he will likely choose Case.
As parents, we want him to go somewhere he will succeed and we think he is making the right choice. At some level, it pains us that he got into CMU but is choosing a lesser school. There are many students who would give their left eye to get into The Nerd Farm. It makes sense for a student to turn down CMU to attend MIT or even GA Tech, but Case Western? Still, I think he is making the right choice and he is more likely to be successful at CWRU than CMU.
I can guess. I know a really great story true of someone in my family who overcame a crippling disease and yet went on to become a nationally ranked athlete. That could move the needle. But less so than in years past.
IMO, itās more about tapping into current societal thinking/persuasion (for some AOās) Things like climate change, thing of the moment etc would resonate and if itās tied back into ECās and I want to be change the world by being X when I grow up that might work.
Would be interesting to hear from some of the people whose kids got into multiple schools what the topic was. My guess is the bent is on identity, politics and tying it back into what I want to be. But Iām guessing like everyone else.
I can totally relate to the pain of turning down the more prestigious schools. My D22 committed to the least prestigious school she applied to. Even though I know itās the best fit for her especially given her career goals and her personality, itās still a bit hard knowing she could go to a T25 if she wanted to. Thankfully she is not conflicted at all and thatās what matters. Best of luck to your son!
On the other hand, it may be better to avoid tapping into the ācurrent thingā. Iām sure that the vast number of essays will try to tap into same topics. Essay readers have probably read the āsameā essay on climate change so many times that something new would be refreshing.
All of S16 essays were about āhimā in various settings reinforcing a handful of characteristics- curiosity, compassion, and intellect.
I think it may make sense in a longer run. Did you happen to visit CMU campus and have him experience it or is it a hearsay?
More than prestige, fit matters. Prestige do definitely bring calls when heās applying for work but if he can thrive well at Case and go above and beyond, nothing stops him. We know a girl from our school who turned down MIT for USC and another friend of my daughter who turned down CMU and UofM COE for USC. They felt they liked the vibe there compared to others they got admitted into. To each their own.
Your sonās essays sound compelling. And I do agree that the current thing would be quite boring to read 50,000 times.
Our kids write their own essays. I didnāt even read '22ās essays. But friends and family who have hired a consultant have told us that the essay gets woven into the presentation. One said they had three words for the kid and developed everything around that. Whatever that means.
Fit is important. My son toured CMU on Tuesday. He also has a friend who is a freshman who showed him around and gave him feedback. My son has decided CMU is a university version of his current high school,a high school that wears its āpressure cookerā label with pride. Students want to take every class they can and join as many clubs as possible. He has a different attitude. My son wants to ease into the first semester and we fully support that. He has been looking at classes he may take along with the estimating the hours in the workload. He is used to about 4 hours of homework a night now. Of course, he and we know CMU homework will likely take longer than estimated at least at first. But he thinks the school is a fit and something he he has grown used to over the last four years. Fortunately he has a friend from school who is also accepting a place and they hoped to room together. And he brought home a lot of merch from his trip. Good luck to your son at Case.
Yes on the three words. The best apps tell a clear story. You canāt be all over the place. Are you the student body president who is a state champion tennis player and bakes? Or the chemistry research student who also raised $100,000 for a favorite charity and works on a local political campaign? Or maybe something more simple like takes care of extended family, works part time, and manages impressive class schedule.
Iāve heard that AOs need to be able to describe a student quickly in a few words, especially if they have to talk about them in committee. The essay, recommendations, ECs, classwork, etc. should all roll up into a cohesive story. Essays can help tie up loose ends to make it more clear who the student is.
While I think this is true. Itās also sad. A lot of kids donāt know this. And a lot of kids donāt want to do this. They want to stay multi-dimensional. It hurts them, IMO.
The other thing I will never understand is the boost kids seem to get for " knowing" what they want to study and be when they grow up. How many actually end up there? The idea of going to school and finding out what interests you is almost gone. Itās hard. Some kids canāt take an econ, neuroscience, physics, psy, finance, etc course in high school but find they really enjoy a specific subject once taken in college. Weāve seen our younger family members go to college in more of a predetermined fashion. None have changed course. None have found their thing in college. More pre-professional then my generation for sure.
My kid loves everything. And is strong in both STEM and humanities. Hard for a kid like that these days getting in. But I think down the road people who have lots of interests often find themselves a great career.
I donāt think kids get a boost if they know what they want to do. Our son in particular wasnāt pointy at all and was definitely an undecided type. Didnāt hurt him in admissions. I think it actually shows some maturity to admit that you still need to experiment a bit. Heās like your son. Ended up a math and physics double major with a minor in religious studies but honestly was open to almost every major when he got to school.
Well our kid applied to several schools with a very specific focus and 100% positive results. Some of the programs are really stellar. Then another bunch of schools (of equal calibre) and fuzzy majors ( might want to combine this and that) results were much lower. And the third group of schools were programs that were established think like UPenn M&T type (and again better results).
For THIS cycle, I believe based on our experience and the experiences of my kids friends that being specifically focused is helpful esp when applying to a major ( read large U). For smaller LACās I think they are more open to liberal arts kids figuring it out.
āSeems obvious that they also have another hook ( legacy, URM, athlete, low income/low performing schoo, first gen etc). Some have the stats and two hooks maybe those are the ones with multiple optionsā
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Maybe in some cases, butā¦just in our HS these are 2 recent(different years but in the last 3 yrs) VALS, both NON URM males (This private test-in HS typically has about 5% of each class matriculate at Top10s):
Both with SAT mid 1500s single sitting, rank 1, max number of AP/honors including the hard ones, lots of unique community service and/or research, both with at least one sport with conference-level recognition but not recruited level, both got school-wide academic awards(very few given out each year);
ONE got into FOUR top10s( 2 of HYPMS (one with a likely letter) and 2 other top 10s, the other kid got āshut outāārejected from the 5 top-10s applied to, accepted to a T20ish so clearly had great success just not at the super highly-rejectives.
What is the difference? If you met the two , it would be clear one has true genius-level intellect, and also has a slight but noticeable edge with regard to social interaction in the classroom etc, so I would bet LORs were slightly more passionate about his candidacy. Both are amazing well above āaverage excellentā students, but one is truly an outlier and multiple tippy top schools saw that. No hooks for either.
I think one has to be careful not to just assume multiple top acceptances means a hookāit does not. Some kids really do just stand out above and beyond stats, more than others.
The harsh truth may be that kids either have this extra āITā factor or they donāt. And I think there is no way for parents or even kids themselves to really know if they have it, and certainly we cannot tell on CC.
