Parents of the HS Class of 2024

Have been away for some time due to work and few other things.
We had our first in person 1:1 counselling session with the school counselor. They have to do course selection for 12th grade by end of next week. She has recommended only doing 4 or 5 classes in senior year for first sem due to college apps which are due during this time. She said we can add another course in community college for the second sem when the college apps are done. Son needs only 2 pending courses to meet the graduation requirement but obviously we donā€™t want that less rigor.

We also discussed college preferences and some recommendation. She strongly suggests looking at universities thats other in the school are not looking at. She said that year after majority of kids apply to same list of 25 colleges. She says to look at schools like U of Colorado Denver or Colorado School of Mines, U of Cincinnati and so on since we are interested in engineering with Co-OP or hands on experience as part of the college experience.

We need to discuss more with in the family but he is so busy right now we put it on hold until soccer season is done.

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My cousinā€™s son goes to mines and is very happy

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Good to know. Not a school we considered. The Counsellor said for many years in a row mines has been one of the colleges that tops the list for the best return on Value. I was not aware of that.

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Iā€™m backā€¦itā€™s been a few months so I will re-introduce ā€¦

S24 is my third. He went on all of his sisters college trips (D18). S20 just picked a college due to Covid and is loving it.

S24 is thinking medicine but knows it will be tough so will major in Biology and then decide after undergrad what path he will take.

We are planning on touring colleges over spring break. He also has not taken the ACT yet as our school has all 11th graders take it in school for free so he wanted to wait until that to decide if he wants to study and/or retake. Lol

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Now that things are getting more REAL, Iā€™m starting to get discouraged. We will not qualify for financial aid, but most of the schools weā€™re looking at outside of a few state schools are like 80,000 a year. 360,000 for an undergraduate degree? That isnā€™t from an Ivy? I mean, itā€™s insane. It makes no rational sense. I know thereā€™s merit aid, but you donā€™t know what you will get. And if you ED somewhere, you probably arenā€™t going to get merit aid. Right? Iā€™ve been reading The Price You Pay for College by Jeff Selingo, and itā€™s just so depressing. We have a few good options in state that are competitive, and my kid probably has a good shot at one because my husband is an alumni. But I wanted my kid to have the same kind of experience I hadā€“getting away and exploring the world. And thatā€™s just so different and more difficult now. Iā€™m starting to feel like our local university is the best deal. Itā€™s not ranked that highly, but itā€™s a great location, our kid would probably get in the honors college, and they could even double major because cost is so little a factor. I guess Iā€™m just wondering why I encouraged so much when SO many schools are ā€œreachesā€ and then youā€™re paying an enormous amount of money for the privilege of attending.

We did visit some schools already. One we didnā€™t visit was Reed (I saw it being discussed aboveā€¦), which I think my kid would have liked. But they give NO merit aid, as far as I know. Soā€“75,000 a year for Reed? It just wouldnā€™t make sense! Am I crazy?

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If youā€™d need to take on a lot of debt to pay $360k, even an Ivy isnā€™t worth it.

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I mean, technically, we could afford it. We have one child, and we have put aside a lot of savings. But I assume they will go to graduate school, and I would want to be able to help with that. Iā€™d pay 360,000 for Harvard. But my kid is NOT getting into Harvard. Even the people I know who got into Harvard when I was going to college wouldnā€™t be likely to get into Harvard now!

360,000 for George Washington? Dickinson? Brandeis? Macalester? I donā€™t know the exact costs off the top of my head, but they are all pretty similar. And none of them seem worth it. I know some of those schools give merit aid. But you donā€™t know if they will or how much. So, do you apply to 30 schools and see? Itā€™s just so messed up.
*Iā€™m not saying they arenā€™t good schools. Iā€™m just saying that there are very few schools I think can really justify 360,000 dollars for 4 years.

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You are not crazy!!! The process is crazyā€¦

Cherry picking a few items from your post, look for schools that will encourage exchange programs. Maybe even see if the schools are on this list:
https://www.nse.org/

There are definitely paths to get a fantastic undergraduate experience and education without spending 80K a year. Spending the 80K doesnā€™t even guarantee a great four years, arguably it wonā€™t even increase the chances.

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Well, since I first started posting here, some things have changed. My kid came out as trans. So, being in a liberal area is very important to us. Most colleges are pretty accepting, but I think certain states are out. I was looking for schools for smart kind of quirky kids. But those are generally small privates or maybe big city schools, but those are both expensive kinds of schools. It just feels sort of overwhelming. Why did I push my kid so hard when I donā€™t even think itā€™s going to matter.

I feel like this is the kind of mistake you make with the first kidā€¦but I only have one. Ooops.

This is where it becomes an individual question for each family.

For families where the wish to save money is a strong motivating factor, applying to 15-30 universities is often a chosen path. These families might choose 3-4 high reaches (reaches because of admission chances and/or budget), 2-3 sure safeties (acceptance + in budget), and 10-20 target/LowReach schools.

For families who donā€™t wish to research that many places or who donā€™t have the bandwidth/ability to do so, applying to 4-7 universities might be the path. 2 in-state publics that will be absolutely affordable and sure to accept. And 4-6 reach (acceptance and/or budget) options. It wouldnā€™t be unusual for this path to end with only the affordable in-state publics and the budget-busting privates, but thatā€™s a risk of applying to a short list with a budget.

It will be up to your family to determine the number most appropriate/comfortable for you. Ultimately you may conclude itā€™s worth it for your family specifically.

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I hear you. My wife and I have been saving each month since our kids were born. We had six figures in each kidā€™s 529. But, with the market crashes, they were in the $140s. Nice, but not enough. My wife kept thinking our kids could go to Duke. Soā€¦a few years ago, I took the family on a trip. On the trip we went on a tour of Duke. I still remember my wife choking when the admissions officer blithely mentioned that the total cost then was $70+/year. Now, it is over $80+/year. Duke was out. S22 ended up being a NMF. That was lucky. He is now at Alabama. He considered it and A&M. It came down to money and a guaranteed spot in his major (he is in Computer Science). It was his decision, he went to Bama. So, now we have D24. We have paid for private school for both kids since pre-K. her senior year will be pushing $30k. Soā€¦we could afford it. But, we do want to retire at some point. Both wife and I are facing burnout (she is a doctor and I am a lawyer, COVID has been rough). We had the money talk with our kids a long time ago. They have been reasonable about it. I just cannot justify the cost. Heck, I have never owned a car that cost over $30K. Watching merit scholarships dry up and costs increase as my kids approach their senior year has been one of the saddest and most helpless feelings I have had. Our college guidance counselor (at a private school) is no help. Never asks about budget, and didnā€™t even know about NMF. So, we do it on our own. Our kids have done well on standardized tests (only for that to not matter any more). Our kids have pushed to excel in hard classes (to see grade inflation become an issue). As a parent, I have stopped caring about report cards and grades. I am focusing on the emotional and mental health of my kids. Grades will sort themselves out. What makes them happy and successful? We focus on universities that others tend to forget about, but are in areas that interest our kids. Its working. Its not the answer, but it works for now. The system, however, is broken.

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Dickinson and Macalester give merit aid, not sure about Brandeis and GWU. Check out Selingoā€™s website where he has a chart of colleges and categorizes them as ā€œbuyers or sellers.ā€ All schools that are considered ā€œbuyersā€ will give merit aid to good students, regardless of need; you will pay much less than 80k per year in most cases. They want to attract good students and tuition discount is the way. We would not pay $80 per year for a school like GWU but we do for the HYSPM my D21 attends. D24 will most likely take the merit aid at ā€œlower rankedā€ (50-100) college route. A few of those are great fits for her and this just makes sense to all of us. She is not interested in ranking or prestige, which helps.

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Thanks! I did see that list. It was really helpful!

Yeah. I know things have just changed. I mean, I knew that. But itā€™s just depressing. I have friends who are sort of going both waysā€¦some basically being like itā€™s in state no buts about it and others who have paid the big bucks and donā€™t want to talk about it because I think it makes them kind of sick.

The southern schools are good values, but I think they are kind of out for us because of politics. :frowning:

Dickinson and Macalester do both give merit aid. But how much? You donā€™t know. Right? And you canā€™t ED. Right? Because why would they give you merit if you did. So, I donā€™t know. Like I saidā€”local university is looking better and better and save all that money for grad school!!!

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Agree, and thatā€™s the path many take. Honors colleges at larger state universities seem to provide a smaller community for many. Our flagship is just way too big imo, with capacity constrained majors. Also for a kid who doesnā€™t know what she wants to study at age 17. Ugh.

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It never hurts to ask if a merit based school will do a merit pre-read. Older posters here have had success - especially if it your childā€™s top choice. Yes, schools give merit for ED too.

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@SueLyon

Itā€™s funny how different people read the same information so differently. I read Jeff Selingoā€™s book and found it incredibly helpful and affirming. Iā€™m glad you read it before your childā€™s college search is in full swing, and hope you can take some of the information and use it constructively.

We, too, are a family who would be full pay according to any college aid calculator. We, too, werenā€™t willing to pay full price anywhere. Weā€™ve now gone through this process twice (D20 and D23) and both of them were accepted everywhere they applied and all but one school came in at or under the budget we determined before we started. It can be done, and your child can get an outstanding education at the schools where you can afford to send them.

The first thing to do is figure out the real, specific number you are willing to pay per year for undergrad. Remember to figure in cost of attendance increases of about 3-5% each year of undergrad (yes, the cost continues to rise while they are in college).

Then, start to construct your childā€™s college list from the ground up using your determined budget as the boundary.

We didnā€™t create either of our childrenā€™s college list based upon college names. We asked if child to tell us what they wanted in a school (urban/suburban/rural, distance from home, size of campus, activities offered, whether study abroad was important, if they wanted to go Greek, majors, weather, location amenities, food options, etc. etc.).

Based on those answers, I helped D20 and D23 find schools that fit most or all of their requirements which would also fit our familyā€™s budget. That meant, by and large, letting the idea go of a highly selective school. Reed was on D20ā€™s list, she visited and loved itā€¦it was never going to work financially so it didnā€™t make the final list. We did, though, find schools that had a lot of the same stuff Reed offered that she likedā€¦at a much more reasonable price.

Net Price Calculators are going to be your friend. Many schools, especially outside the Top 50 - often include merit estimates in their NPCs. We found them to be very accurate in how much our children were offered, as long as the information we provided was accurate. The only differential we found was a couple of schools actually offered more than the NPC predicted in merit aid.

Some schools also offer individual financial pre-reads. I think there is a thread on CC that lists many of them, but you can also ask specific schools if they would be willing to give a financial pre-read for merit before applying. The schools know finances are a factors for the majority of applicants, no one will blink at these kinds of questions.

@EconPop is right that this is all going to come down to what strategy you want to pursue once you decide what you are actually willing to pay. Applying broadly can be a successful strategy when pursuing merit aid, as can a more targeted approach. D20 applied to 3 schools, D23 applied to 4. All acceptances and 6/7 were affordable (D23 decided to apply to a financial reach school, it came up about $12k short in merit for it to be affordable). All 7 schools were academic safeties for D20 and D23.

If you are looking for help figuring out colleges that might work for your child, CC is a great place to get more ideas. If you start a thread with your childā€™s requirements/wants and your budget (as well as some basic academic stats) there are tons of experienced posters on this board who can give you recommendations with fairly current merit information.

This will work out - getting to the point you are early enough is a huge accomplishment!

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Yes as we get closer to the college admission process and college selection process especially for a first or only kid it is a hard to swallow both the cost and the also admit rates at some of the colleges.
S24 did not want to rule out any college other than southern colleges (mostly will not fit for him for the political climate and culture) .
We are open to paying higher fee if the college is great fit for him but if the college is good fit or so so fit we dont want to pay. We also have a single kid and can afford to pay but is it a wise decision to pay 360k for undergrad is what we are debating at this.
We have some great public school options in state but they almost feel like a lottery at this point for Asian Male in STEM/Engineering with them going test blind. So we need some backups. We have also started looking in some colleges between 50 to 100 ranking which have good stem programs and give merit or have lower fees.

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S21 is trans and he goes to a school in North Carolina and there have been no issues. There are LGBTQ+ friendly schools in not friendly states. I know I have been part of discussions on other pages but there are definitely schools for smart, quirky LGBTQ+ kids that give merit. One is Sarah Lawrence.

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I know the feeling!

My D21 was accepted to a bunch of really great schools and they were pricey. Because of COVID limitations she didnt get to visit and she wasnā€™t passionate about a specific major, so she ended up taking a merit deal at a very average state school. We told her she could use the money saved for grad school or a house.

My spouse and I have quietly fretted and wondered if it was a mistake, but now Iā€™m very confident itā€™s fine. Donā€™t get me wrong, those fancy schools probably would have been fine too. None of these schools have a monopoly on education, internships, or experiences. I promise my D has done it all plus she has crazy elite summer options already lined up. So do her friends at elite schools.

Itā€™s not the school that matters. Itā€™s what the kid does at the school that matters.

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It is all a LOT. Technically, however, $80k x 4 yrs is $320k , NOT $360ā€¦not so small a difference, in reality. Agree that if one has to take out large loans to cover it then it does not make sense. For full-payers, I am glad it is "only " 320 and not 360. We are 2 years into Duke but do not have any significant travel expenses and donā€™t spend as much on personal as outlined in the COA, spend less on food than the average meal plan, and are just under $160k so far for the 2 yrs. Plus kid chose to have a job to pay for incidentals/clothes above what we think is reasonable.
Our second kid may go in-state engineering which is $46k a year, plus parents there say housing is usually more than the listed amount because they all move off campus. So it may be $50+per year, for a larger campus and different vibe than she wants, so private schools are on the table for her as well, if that is what she chooses. Glad that Duke is ā€œas advertisedā€ costwise, at least.

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