<p>
[quote]
need based aid is determined by how much money your parents can actually pay towards your school (FAFSA). PSU is a great school, and if the money is close between PSU and another school id suggest PSU. If you can get through your first year with a good GPA, youll have a great oppurtunity at scholarships.
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I don't really care about the money. I dont really mind getting out of PSU undergrad/grad with 250k debt, but my parents do. SUNY-Buffalo will most likely cost me nothing or close to nothing, because my friend is a freshman going there for free with worse stats and higher income. When I choose a college, I focus mainly on the value of its degree and how much knowledge I would gain from attending. PSU's engineering is probably better than SUNY-Buffalo's [at least that's what I think [and hope]], specifically aerospace engineering.</p>
<p>That's why I chose PSU with 250k debt instead of SUNY-Bufffalo with 0 debt. But that's just my opinion. If you guys were in my situation, which would you choose: PSU with 250k or SUNY-Buffalo with 0 debt?</p>
<p>I dont really know if any school is worth that kind of debt....but im pretty cheap :P. I mean PSU is a great school...many great companies like lockheed and Boeing come to the career fair....but I mean it is a lot of money.</p>
<p>If it were me I would have to go with SUNY becuz I am of low income (reason I almost went to Case Western instead of PSU last year)</p>
<p>But I mean I just think that that is a lot of debt. Anyway whered you get the figure 250k from?</p>
<p>OOS engineering is ~23000 per year plus another 9000-10000max room and board = 33000 times 4 years is $132,000. I think he is looking at some 5 year coop plan but even so I don't see where the 250,000 is either.</p>
<p>I would wait til all the finaid offers come in before making any decisions.</p>
<p>
[quote]
OOS engineering is ~23000 per year plus another 9000-10000max room and board = 33000 times 4 years is $132,000. I think he is looking at some 5 year coop plan but even so I don't see where the 250,000 is either.</p>
<p>I would wait til all the finaid offers come in before making any decisions.
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Yeah. I'm looking at the coop plan which does include summer sessions. That adds a few 10,000's into that number. Plus, i'm going to go there for grad school. Now that adds a few more 10,000's. Then I just rounded it up to 250k to make it even.</p>
<p>yes but the semesters you are working you don't have to pay full tuition...also there are many opportunities to get money for grad school...but that is a long time away...</p>
<p>I really believe that rankings like US News are ruining prospective students. I had a friend who chose Cornell mainly for the fact that is was highly ranked. He spent a year there and hated it. He ended up transferring to a local college closer to home, and he's a senior there now and loving it. He got a great education and is looking at top grad schools. It's all about the environment. Obviously, you want a good school academically, but for two schools that are as academically similar as Pitt and Penn State, it is no use fretting over "rank" and "prestige."</p>
<p>The only reason PSU's more prestigious than Pitt is because of its strong athletics. Academically, they're both overall the same (although each have their individual strengths and weaknesses).</p>
<p>And I wouldn't even say that it is more prestigious. It is just more well-known because of football. I think prestige has to do mostly with the student body, and Pitt's admission standards are microscopically higher than Penn State's. It all comes back to city vs. town.</p>
<p>Got to agree. These ranking publications and methods would be a joke if it weren't for so many people both within and outside the university community giving them more credance than they merit. Yes, there are elements of the ranking stuff that do lend potentially meaningful insight to a collegiate forecast. But that said, anyone who selects one school over another on that basis may be deluded and grasping for assurance. Those will reveal little or nothing about the individual experience one might project ... or the consequences, i.e. job, grad school, life partner, friends, etc. </p>
<p>Pat, I know Pitt's stats are improvinb, but they don't approach PSU admission stuff ... if you compare Oakland to U. Park. They've a long way to go to catch up after so many moons of academic mediocrity. While there is some advantage in attracting professional couples to the 'Burgh vs. SC, that is substantially muted by the fact that PSU is now a legitimate Big 10 U academically as well as athletically. I'll give Pitt the nod with its med complex, but there is virtually no interaction of any consequence between the undergrad programs and UPMC. That is the tail that wags the dog. Or should I say kitty kat? </p>
<p>And the law school, too. Until PSU gets its law school to either State College ... or Harrisburg, it'll be minor league.</p>
<p>Just my opinion, of course. </p>
<p>The PSU degree is far more prestigious and recognized than Pitt's. But coming back to the original point, what difference does that make for any given individual? Virtually none.</p>
<p>I hate to sound like a jerk, Whistle Pig, but you are wrong. </p>
<p>The one good thing about these rankings sites is the facts that they offer. According to Princetonreview.com, here are last year's "Freshmen Academic Profiles" of Pitt and Penn State (main campuses only):</p>
<p>University of Pittsburgh-Pittsburgh Campus
Average SAT: 1234
SAT - Verbal Range (25-75%): 560-660
SAT - Math Range (25-75%): 570-670
TPR Projected Range SAT Writing: 620-690
Average Verbal SAT: 612
Average Math SAT: 622
ACT Composite Range (25-75%): 24-29
Average ACT: 26
Students in top 10% of HS class: 43%
Students in top 50% of HS class: 98% </p>
<p>Penn State--University Park
Average SAT: 1210
SAT - Verbal Range (25-75%): 530-630
SAT - Math Range (25-75%): 570-670
TPR Projected Range SAT Writing: 590-670
Average Verbal SAT: 593
Average Math SAT: 617
Average ACT: Not Reported
Average High School GPA: 3.54
Students in top 10% of HS class: 40%
Students in top 50% of HS class: 98%</p>
<p>Like I said before, Pitt's standards are slightly higher, but again, the difference is so slim that it is negligable. I just want to make sure everyone has the facts straight. Pitt does aproach PSU's admission standards, and actually surpasses them. And I checked a couple other places, and these are the correct numbers.</p>
<p>I will concede the fact that Penn State does offer a larger numbers of degrees, and I'm sure that the Penn State name is better known around the country (I won't say the world, because Pitt is known for its international studies.) I think this mostly has to do to with the sheer size of Penn State, and its past football success, not with its superior academic reputation.</p>
<p>So really, this debate is pointless. I think College ******* is the most accurate college guide out there, and it gives both Pitt and Penn State a "B" for academic rating. I come back to a statement I have made many times- the only true difference is the environment. And if one school offers you money, I'd take it. (For the record- Pitt offers MUCH better financial aide.)</p>
<p>The schools offer strengths in different areas.
Pitt - Med, Nursing, Pharmacy, basketball, broader activities due to urban environment
PSU- Eng, Business, Meteorology, Music/Fine Arts, Sciences, Top Honors College (this IS harder to get into than Pitt's), football, more "school spirit"</p>
<p>No, this is not an all inclusive list. I see them a roughly equivalent although Penn State seems to have more name recognition (and certainly more alumni).
It just comes down to fit and program/major. Rankings mean nothing. Penn and Pitt are good schools with excellent opportunities. Students at both schools should be proud.</p>
<p>You are completely contradicting yourself by saying rankings mean nothing, but go on to list the best programs. How do you know which school has a stronger program? By rankings.</p>
<p>Obviously Pitt is better in the medical field because of the UPMC system, and obviously PSU is better for meterorology because of their facilities, but other than that, all of the other programs are basically on par with one another, including the honors colleges. Again, the numbers indicate that admission is equally difficult, and the programs are quite different. At Pitt, the Honors College is not as separated from the main school as it is at PSU. </p>
<p>As far as sciences/engineering/business, I would say that both schools are relatively equal. I can personally attest to engineering, having spent two years in the PSU program and three at Pitt. For music and fine arts, PSU has more course options, but Pittsburgh offer more opportunities. I really am sick of people trying to rank and rate every tiny aspect of every school. For grad school, yes, I want a school that is strong and highly regarded in a specific field. But for undergrads, you spend so much time in classes outside of you major and outside of class altogether, that specific department ranks mean even less than overall school rank.</p>
<p>Pat - you're sounding a bit defensive here. I actually don't know the rankings for these programs. I DO know students in each of these majors at both schools. I also have talked with guidance counselors (maybe they are influenced by the rankings -- not sure). I also know a number of top students who have rejected from Schreyer at our local high school. I do know that Schreyer has a rigourous application process - not just an automatic invite and focus on the numbers. I also know that PSU offers around 250 honors courses and is funded by 2 grants totaling over 58 million in the last five years. So, I think it's fair to call the honors college a "strength". I don't think you would find many guidance couneslors in PA who would disagree with that.
Pitt program gets great students too - and offers more merit money.
In any case, in the overall scheme of things, I said both schools were good. And we are all entitled to our opinions regarding the strengths of each school.
This is getting boring... how bout Eagles vs Steelers? GO EAGLES!!!!</p>
<p>I apologize for the defensive position, as it appears we are mostly in agreement.</p>
<p>The Iggles (as the locals say) looked good against the Giants today. I'd love to see them finally win the Super Bowl. And hopefully the Stillers can find a good coach and come back next year.</p>
<p>you guys can shelve the debate about PSU and Pitt. (Full disclosure, my son applied to both and got into both.)</p>
<p>THis is off-thread a bit, but many of these conversations in these threads (not just this one) talk about schools as entities unto themselves, and only rarely does the issue of whether THE KID IS RIGHT FOR THE SCHOOL come into the conversation. Pitt and PSU are what they are. There REAL trick is to match the kid to the school. </p>
<p>I encourage any kid applying to college to try to cut through the hype and find a situation that feels "right", as that will have as much or more to do with his/her success as what is says on your diploma. </p>
<p>I'm 48 and went to Lehigh. After the first 5 years of work or so nobody is terribly interested where you went to college, unless you're going into a very pedigree intensive field like medicine, law, consulting, etc. </p>
<p>The world is full of gazillionaires who never finished college. And the world is also full of people with 1560 SATs who can't seem to get along in the post-college world. I have interviewed MBAs who can't write a coherent paragraph. </p>
<p>Make your decision, run with it, have confidence in it and - most of all - enjoy. It looks like my son is going to PSU. If he comes home on Thansgiving and says he loves it, we'll know we did the right thing.</p>