<p>^^wow, that’s perhaps the first moderate post that muertea’s ever written. well done. Are the raging hormones dying down?</p>
<p>I’m a moderate at heart, cerberus. I only become a raging queen ***** when my honor or school is attacked.</p>
<p>nj_azn.</p>
<p>Wharton does not blow Columbia out of the water, we are comparing apples to apples here - Columbia is not rotten or bad, it just is not quite as prestigious nor is it as specialized. Being next tier doesn’t mean that you went from being kings to paupers. Yes CU is not quite as reputable, but if you look at the faculty they are cut of the same cloth. And as previously mentioned - this doesn’t have anything really to do with ugrads. It is more things to feel good about.</p>
<p>Making hyperbolic statements like that when you talk about schools that really on the same plane is just pretty idiotic. HYPSM is a question of prestige and not academic superiority. Because by almost all measures or questions they are relatively equal with their own strengths, but one or another is not significantly better academically.</p>
<p>Where they differ is around questions of academic curriculum and focus, student life and culture, city life and resources. Each university is strong in a lot of areas, but I think we can say that there are things that Columbia prioritizes that Penn does not. There are aspects of life at Penn that you cannot replicate verbatim at Columbia. The OP and any student choosing between the two ought to figure it out for themselves - and then jump in head first and enjoy their college experience…at Columbia ;)</p>
<p>I haven’t met one stereotypical socially inept nerd since I’ve been at Columbia. Seriously. Most of the students here are smart but also very fun-loving and social.</p>
<p>But to address those points:</p>
<p>Core vs. academic freedom: The existence of a core curriculum does not preclude academic freedom. Students at schools who have a core curriculum or common classes that students must take have voiced opinions that the curriculum ties together their education for the rest of their time at Columbia and that it enriches their studies immeasurably. Most Columbia students like the Core or are ambivalent about it; very few absolutely hate it.</p>
<p>Safety: safety is not a “huge concern” at Columbia, I know that much. People assume that it is because it is in a large city and particularly close to Harlem. I would like to note that Morningside Heights is VERY different from Harlem, and that campus security is particularly great. I have never felt unsafe on Columbia’s campus, even very late at night or early in the morning. Matter of fact, I live in the Washington Heights community in northern Manhattan near the medical center, and I don’t feel unsafe here late at night either.</p>
<p>Cost: the entire Northeast is more expensive, especially large cities like Philly and NYC. There are ways to be cost-effective at Columbia – how do you think so many grad students survive here! Your Columbia ID gets you discounts at many restaurants, cafes, and stores, and free admission to many museums in the city. Also, I love Philadelphia so much but there are WAY more internship opportunities in New York.</p>
<p>Columbia does not have a lot of “rich city people.” Almost half the student body identifies themselves as students of color and few of the students here are even from NYC (some, not all and definitely not most). The campus community here is pretty strong – I have no comparison to Penn, but the students here are pretty close-knit. And like Cerberus08 says, there is always something going on at Columbia…I can’t keep up…</p>
<p>Also, muerteapablo posts the rankings for graduate programs, which have very little to do with the quality of undergraduate education in those majors at the school.</p>
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<p>Actually, in general the quality of the professors are definitely related to the strength of their departments, I don’t think this is a stretch at all.</p>
<p>pablo - we are splitting hairs at this point.</p>
<p>1) USNews Ranks perception of the department or subspeciality. NRC ranks the quality of doctoral education usually in part looking at outcomes, perception and quality of professors.
2) We could then infer that it is in fact a relation to the quality of professors (though Penn’s higher rank may be because of the students and not the professors).
3) And we could finally infer it might tell us something about the quality of the department as a whole, but it wont tell us to what degree the department values graduates v. undergraduates.
4) Ultimately we could infer how this might affect undergraduates.</p>
<p>Though it is certainly feasible to logically derive all this, it is more a thought exercise than something you could actually mathematically prove. I do think it is a stretch, and that is why using graduate school rankings to judge undergrad is bad.</p>
<p>Cal for example sweeps so many of these top spots or near top spots for graduate, but it is not necessarily a better undergraduate experience.</p>
<p>Cal (Berkeley) is a great undergraduate experience; but it isn’t nearly as selective as any Ivy League school. That’s the only real difference between it and a place like Penn or Columbia.</p>
<p>a completely different ugrad experience. one that is less personal, a bit more about Cal sports, and though you will be fine going through it, it is far more of a wonder place for grad students than undergrads (yes there is spillage), but read what jameschen has said and the usual perception of big state schools and their troubles.</p>
<p>i am not saying it isn’t a great option, but you really gotta want it.</p>
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Yessiree! Though I would come to the conclusion that the best undergrad econ choice is Penn CAS, not Columbia College ;)</p>
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<p>This is a bit extreme…I mean I didn’t want to go to Columbia for undergrad, but I certainly didn’t DETEST the place (if anything I thought the Core is an admirable effort to pass down the knowledge and wisdom of Western Civilization, and I wish more schools had it for the future well-being of our republic).</p>
<p>Save the REAL detesting for Princeton ;)</p>
<p>PS muertepablo is a girl??</p>
<p>Yes, indeed.
[curtsy]</p>