<p>OK that sounded pretty harsh let's try it a different way. I've attended 3 elite schools (undergrad, engineering masters, and B-school) and all 3 times ended up with GPAs of about 3.6 when I worked hard. I didn't kill myself but I was a serious student ... and I just could not get to a 4.0. Why? I was pretty average for the schools ... I worked hard (points for me) ... other students were good and worked hard (not so good for my grades but great for my classroom experience) ... while I was good at some things (technical courses) other students were better than I at other topics (more liberal arts type stuff) and I got a lot of Bs in those courses ... when I took courses outside my safe zone again with excellent students in the class I often got Bs (and please take lots of courses outside your safe zone) ... ect. One of the best things about elite schools is the concentration of top students ... it's also the reason why some Bs are inevitable unless you're a top-top student ... and that is a totally good thing IMO.</p>
<p>I want a reasonable grade so I can get into Harvard Law school.
I am majoring in sociology so it wont be overwelming.</p>
<p>race,
I'm more than a little surprised that you are seriously considering Stanford and yet don't know anything about Palo Alto, eg, you thought that this was an urban scene. If an urban scene is what you're after, then Stanford would not be the right choice for you. </p>
<p>As for your HLS aspirations, the top three feeder colleges are Harvard undergrad (by far the highest numbers come from here), Yale…and Stanford. Look at the matriculation data on the HLS website.</p>
<p>I can't believe it. I completely agree with hawkette on this!</p>
<p>You DO realize that HLS (along with all serious law schools) considers what your major is when they look at your GPA...and unless you get published or something extraordinary, sociology is only slightly above basket-weaving and women's studies...</p>
<p>Michelle Obama majored in sociology in princeton and got in.
Alot did</p>
<p>bumpbumpbump</p>
<p>Consider Dartmouth College for a bit more relaxed atmosphere, but it is in a rural location.</p>
<p>Affirmative Action, anyone?</p>
<p>(Having gone to Columbia) it has far from an active social life. If you want social top schools, you don't want city schools. The best social life among the top 15 schools is: Dartmouth, Penn, Stanford, Northwestern, Duke, and maybe Brown. I would say Columbia is the worst, next to Harvard. Also remember that four of these more "fun"
schools statistically get higher percent into HLS than Columbia (Brow, Duke, Dartmouth, Stanford all have higher percentages).</p>
<p>
So, ummmm, Penn is not a city school? :confused:</p>
<p>Coulda fooled me! ;)</p>
<p>There's a reason why many people believe that Penn offers the best of both worlds: nice self-contained campus with great social life, smack dab in the middle of a large city with world-class cultural, historic, and entertainment attractions. :)</p>
<p>And if you ask me, it's a fair price to pay for a marginally lower rate of going to HLS.</p>
<p>Also, Slipper, is that rate based on #of students attending over # of students at the school, or #of students attending over # of students who apply? Because if it is the former, I would say Penn's numbers are skewed unfavorably by the swaths of undergrads in the preprofessional schools (Wharton, Nursing) who count as a Penn student but are not in the pre-law market...</p>
<p>And it's not like we don't get in :P My friend and fellow IR major got into Harvard Law, Stanford Law, and Penn Law.</p>
<p>bumpbumpbump</p>
<p>Ow, my head.</p>
<p>Anyway I still say Penn > Stanford > Columbia from a holistic point of view. And I am always right, which is a nice bonus ;)</p>
<p>I assume ILovebagels was implying that MObama got to HLS b/c of AA? What an ignorant POS you are! Anyway, I suppose you think Obama got there too after graduating Columbia. He did graduate Magna from HLS, so I suppose he didn't need AA.</p>
<p>Anyway, most people wouldn't really seriously consider Penn over the other two, unless they are going to Wharton.</p>
<p>Get serious!</p>
<p>Of course Michelle and Barack got in in large part thanks to affirmative action. Wake up.</p>
<p>As for the OP, I don't think he/she has done much/any research thus far, and so I don't think discussing it is going to be all that helpful. I'm sure they are all good for different reasons. I'm a senior at Columbia, and that said, I see no reason to choose Penn over Columbia. NYC>>>Philly. I probably would have been happier at Stanford, but I don't know if I would have grown up at much as a person without living in NYC.</p>
<p>penn has more of an actual campus, and socially it's much closer-knit than columbia. that's a possible reason for choosing Penn over Columbia(not saying that either school is better)</p>
<p>That's right, Porsche 06, I'm "ignorant." You showed me! Well at least you didn't go for explicitly calling me racist. How far as a society we have come!</p>
<p>Plenty of people do pick Penn over Columbia and Stanford, and with good reason. Plenty of people pick Columbia over Penn and Stanford, and with good reason. Plenty of people pick Stanford over Penn and Columbia, and with good reason.</p>
<p>The caliber of undergrad academics (outside of engineering, where Stanford unquestionably dominates) are identical at all three of these schools (they all pulled in 1 Rhodes Scholar apiece this year). Where they differ is in their wildly different social scenes and locations.</p>
<p>
[quote]
NYC>>>Philly
[/quote]
I would absolutely agree with you there. NYC is without question bigger, richer (well, maybe not anymore), more interesting, better governed, more dynamic, more important, etc. But that's precisely why I would never want to go to college there. With the world's greatest city at your doorstep, the temptation to abandon campus is irresistible. You have your whole life (and grad school) to do the New York thing (and I highly recommend that you do at some point). But college, that most wondrous and transformative time of your life, is but 4 fleeting years, and you only get one shot at it.</p>
<p>Rather than concentrate of location, why don't you focus more on academics? eVen if you go to college in the city, how often do you think you will not be working have time to actually go out into the city. Do you want a core curriculum like at Columbia?</p>
<p>Actually pretty much every weekend. College isn't THAT hard. Columbia IMO ts not that much fun. Just my two cents.</p>