In looking at the recent 2022-23 Common Data Set submissions for UC Berkeley and UCLA, the average unweighted GPAs for freshman admits at the two schools are virtually the same (3.90 Cal vs. 3.93 UCLA, respectively). And although UCs no longer consider standardized test scores, looking back at the 2020-21 CDS submissions, Berkeley’s middle-50% interquartile range for SAT scores was 1300-1520 compared to UCLA’s mid-50% range of 1290-1510. Again, virtually identical. By all accounts, the academic profile of the student bodies at the 2 schools are practically inseparable.
And yet, when I hear high schoolers (and even college graduate friends) describe the two schools, it’s clear that the perception of these institutions are starkly different. UC Berkeley is most often described as an academic powerhouse with highly regarded programs across the board, ranging from engineering to the hard sciences, and from business to the humanities/social sciences. But it is also described as a place where the students can be competitive, and the academics are seen as a real grind. Meanwhile, UCLA is described as having good academics, often with the addendum “on par with Berkeley,” almost as though there’s some perception that UCB edges UCLA on the academic front. But where UCLA seems to take the cake is the student perception that it has the best balance of academics + social life + shiny happy students. Other than the warmer, sunnier weather, and the “Westwood / LA scene” vs. the “grittiness” (a.k.a. sketchiness) and “Sixties vibe” of Berkeley, I’m not sure that the schools are really as different as these lingering perceptions would seem to indicate.
I’m curious why the two schools, seemingly more similar than dissimilar in terms of their respective student bodies and institutional structure, have such distinct perceptions in the “public eye.” Hopefully some insiders from both schools can weigh in. For the record, I have a kid who’s trying to weigh the pros and cons of each school, which is what motivated this post.
Even relatively recent perceptions regarding comparative student profiles may be based on information from several years ago. For example, this analysis based on standardized scoring placed UCB 37th nationally and UCLA 74th:
I agree that the academics and students are similar. Plenty of pre-professional gunners at both campuses.
I attribute the difference to school spirit: UCLA’s Admin embraces its sports programs while Cal Admin tolerates them. Plenty of school spirt at Cal, but IMO, there is more at UCLA. UCLA also has more housing on campus which facilitates meeting more people and educational interactions.
Cannot speak to the academic differences having only attended one. My only experience at UCB was touring the campus where, I kid you not, I was hit by an unhoused person riding a bicycle near the famous UCB tower that I can’t recall the name of.
And let’s face it – UCLA has a pretty active social scene. More likely than not, you will have to put in effort NOT to attend parties rather than seek them out. Same goes with alcohol – you will most definitely be around it and will have to proactively keep yourself and friends accountable. Everyone is just happy, often for no particular reason (a weird concept coming from the PNW). Sports are huge – everyone will be wearing UCLA gear just out on campus, and most people will be following basketball and football games. These aspects could really be positive or negative, depending on your personality.
Sure, there will be people of all types – studious, nerdy, introverted – but UCLA’s culture as a whole is for bright students who like to play hard. This has been the perception I got from others about UCLA before attending, and as a student, I can confirm at least in part that the stereotypes are accurate.
Back in the late 90’s, I recall Berkeley was consistently ranked a couple spots higher than UCLA. My perception (perhaps dubiously based on USNWR) as a UCLA student at that time was that Berkeley was a just a smidgeon more prestigious. As someone who had a lot of friends at Berkeley, I also would have opined that UCLA’s social life was a smidgeon better than Berkeley’s, but Berkeley students can have a lot of fun too. They are both so big that whatever tribe you prefer, you’ll find it at either school.
Honestly, then and probably now, the differences are so small that they’re not worth basing any decision on.
There could be some differences that are significant to a specific student looking at a specific major, but which are not significant to other students. Preference for a semester (UCB) or quarter (UCLA) academic calendar could matter to some students but not others.
It could just be the logn tail of history. When I attended UCLA in the late '80s and early '90s, there is no question everyone had an agreed ranked order to the academic prestige of the schools and Berkely was #1 and UCLA #2 among the UC’s. UCB was also considered harder to get into. UCB is also the original UC and many of the others including UCLA started as satellite campuses (thus why UCLA’s mascot is the baby bear and why its colors include baby blue).
Since then UCLA has become more and more popular and caught up in its academic perception.
In terms of rep, at least in my day some of that was because people seemed to associate undergrads as more STEM-heavy focused at UCB and more diverse in major across academic disciplines at UCLA. And then there’s location, both in terms of being in La La land in general and being bordered by Bel Air and some of the wealthiest real estate in LA vs being bordered by Oakland and its shocking crime rate.
Two likely reasons: 1) the perception is likely colored by their respective locations SFO/Bay Area vs SoCal/Los Angeles, 2) Cal’s graduate programs have multiple subjects that are top 5 in the country. This helps UCB’s reputation.
For undergraduate degree, I think they are similar but culturally they are very different. Both are fantastic places to study.
Used to be Nobel Laureate prestige had more influence than it probably does now, giving Cal a big edge. And research opportunities at LBL was/is a huge benefit for Berkeley undergrads, but an even bigger deal for graduate students.
Oh for sure. My point was the differences in popular perception (OP’s “public eye” query) aren’t meaningful. But there are plenty of valid reasons why a student might chose one over the other. For me, it was as simple as I was from the Bay Area and wanted to get away.
When my older kids got into both in 2018, it was surprising to many people that S chose UCLA over UCB, as historically the few people with a choice had always chosen Berkeley. Five years later the preferred choice at our NorCal public HS is UCLA, if you can get in, unless you want to study CS.
Kids like to get away from home and the consistent feedback that you’ll be happier at UCLA, with better food and accommodation, plus better weather and sports, as well as it being seen as higher ranked and harder to get into, makes UCLA a much easier choice nowadays.
Thanks everyone for the thoughtful and helpful replies here. For a little levity, my kid came home from practice yesterday evening and declared that Berkeley’s on-campus football stadium is preferable to UCLA having to play in the off-campus Rose Bowl stadium. Given that my kid is not a college football player, I thought that was one of the more hilarious Cal vs. UCLA comments I’ve ever heard! But it goes to show what impulses travel across the synapses of the 18-year brain!
On a more serious note, the semester vs. quarter calendar was a great point, as UCLA’s faster-paced quarter calendar could appeal to some students, whereas Berkeley’s semester calendar is more in line with the traditional high school calendar in our school district.