<p>Thanks, bclintonk. I didn’t think Penn State was in the Philadelphia area, but when someone suggested Dad II visit, I thought maybe I was mistaken. Not sure whether it will make D’s list or not. It’s a much bigger school than she’s interested in attending - but I thought we’d take a look if it was possible on that trip.</p>
<p>I’ve done the first part of your trip, Pgh to Phila a zillion times. We live in South Jersey and our oldest is a Carnegie Mellon grad. </p>
<p>Pitt might not be on the list, but you’ll go right through the lower Pitt campus when you exit 376 for Forbes Ave/Oakland, so you’ll have no choice but to take a look…you can’t miss the Cathedral of Learning that you’re driving straight toward.</p>
<p>I’d say 4 1/2 hr trip is about right.Traffic moves along at least that speed (70) the whole way. My concern for you is to watch your weather. We’ve hit it all, short of a typhoon. About 100 miles of the drive is through the Appalachians, so snow in late March is possible. Fog believe it or not is also a frequent problem, though more in the fall.</p>
<p>Harrisburg is 2/3 of the way to Philly…at the very least try to make it there. Lots of motels at Harrisburg East. All exits have places to stay. I agree with trying to make it to King of Prussia. Villanova btw is only 10 min from K of P, if that interests you besides the others.</p>
<p>Penn State, although in central Pa, is too far north from PA Tpk…it would add hours to the drive. We actually did that on our first visit to CMU…PSU really isn’t ‘on the way’ betw the two cities.</p>
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<p>I don’t quite get this comment. What’s wrong with Haverford? Dad II said they want to look at CMU. Haverford is a very different kind of school but it’s at least as good a school as CMU: identical entering class SAT scores, identical PA ratings, Haverford with a slightly lower acceptance rate than CMU as well as better freshman retention and graduation rates and smaller classes. I’d say if anything Haverford has an edge on the prestige scale, except probably for engineering.</p>
<p>^ I think what MofWC meant was that Haverford is a boutique-type school, much like Sarah Lawrence. It’s a very good school, but it’s also very small. Meaning no disrespect, but Swarthmore is the small school with the BIG rep.</p>
<p>Or that Haverford is not on the list for reasons not related to academics.</p>
<p>I thought that it could have been something like Engineering as well.</p>
<p>There are so many different parameters that go into choosing a college list, I try to not second-guess.</p>
<p>I’m glad I’m done with it. If I were helping a son shop colleges in 2009, the number one thing I would be doing is reading the financial statements and cost-cutting plans of each college very, very closely. All colleges and universities are going to be cutting bone and muscle over the next four years, but some are clearly better positioned to do so than others. The cost-cutting is going to have real impact on students over the next few years, whether it’s increasing enrollment, cutting faculty, reducing student services, etc.</p>
<p>Dad II is very much about prestige and I don’t think Haverford makes the cut. I, personally, love the place and grew up very close to it.</p>
<p>Wow, thank you all so much for all these nice suggestions. </p>
<p>DS is taking AP econ and really likes it. So, as of right now, we are looking for school with a good econ program. Since our flagship state U ranks very well nationally in econ and DS has the status for their honor college, we are not really looking for other safety for the time being. DS is a little different than DD, he would not mind that much to my suggestions. He has not developed any strong opinion about “dream” school yet.</p>
<p>CMU, I believe, has an unique program where econ program is jointly support by the business school and CAS, I read somewhere. Swat is very well known for its econ. I believe it is the second strongest program there. In one of my threads, I was told that Swat likes demonstrated love. That is main reason we are going, plus some exposure to LAC. I may want to write a book one day about these experiences.</p>
<p>Based on your detailed suggestions, I think we will stop about 2 hours from CMU on day 1. Going to Princeton in Day 2; and stay near Swat that afternoon. Maybe even walk around teh campus that evening. The focus is Swat on day 3. If we have time, we will take the public transportation to UPenn for a quick visit. </p>
<p>Looks like we may need day 4. We will do some research on other LAC such as Haverford etc. </p>
<p>Thank you all again.</p>
<p>Swarthmore’s spring break ends March 16th. After that, everyone should be around. It would be very easy to sit in on an Economics class if you like. Holler when you get your days figured out and I can point you to class schedules and other activities.</p>
<p>There are a ton of motel options along I-476, including the afforementioned King of Prussia area. In the immediate Swarthmore vicitinity, the recently renovated Howard Johnsons is the value option. New, clean rooms, good TVs, for $89 to $99 a night. We stayed there for the last two years after the renovation. Just a mile and a half from campus.</p>
<p>[Google</a> Maps](<a href=“http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=108559171071462350817.00044ef22f4e1ded2d98e&z=13]Google”>http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=108559171071462350817.00044ef22f4e1ded2d98e&z=13)</p>
<p>What has worked well with both our kids is that they do the campus tour and then head off to classes/departments while the accompanying parent does the info session (since after a while they all sound the same…).</p>
<p>We are still trying to winnow down the list of 17 schools we have at the moment to something a bit more sane. At that point we’ll see what we can do about return visits. Due to fall sports and IB, though, S2’s return visits before apps are due will be few.</p>
<p>I wouldn’t recommend that approach at Swarthmore. If I’m not mistaken, the info sessions are often conducted by an admissions officer **and **a current student. They really take a strong attitude that college is for the student to figure out and that parents should be supportive, but largely invisible. It’s not that they don’t appreciate parents, but rather that the school, institutionally, expects students to participate as adult “peers” in the campus community.</p>
<p>Just remember that MOST students switch majors at least a couple of times during college. SO…if economics is on the list now…it might not be a semester from now…or a year from now. Majoring in economics in college (I’m told) is very different from loving one or two courses in high school. So…look beyond just that one major.</p>
<p>Just my humble opinion.</p>
<p>interesteddad,
S felt that sitting in on a class in his intended major was far more important than the info session in evaluating whether he was interested in the school – esp. since he already had picked up 90% of the relevant info from the info session on the website. Our time was limited – so we took the divide-and-conquer approach. When he goes back for a subsequent visit, it’ll be more in-depth.</p>
<p>T1, thanks for the reminder and I am with you there. That is one of the reason we are only looking at top tier schools who offer a broader range of excellent majors. </p>
<p>After seeing how DD is doing at her school, I have a firm believe that it is the internal motivation and personal drive that make a student success. School provides an environment for that development thus is an important part. </p>
<p>DS is someone who just wants to do enough at this time. On his mid term report card, 6 of 7 subjects are A- and he is satisfied. I think the peer group at the school will have a much larger effect on him. He might need some push with a group of excellent students at begining. </p>
<p>Flagship State U will definitely have a group of the best student. But, one might have to seek them out. Of course I am not saying this from any fact or experiences. At DD’s school, you could basically close your eyes grabing someone and you will be amazed by their status, for lack of a better word. </p>
<p>please don’t turn this thread into one debating which is better or is it worth $$. I really appreciate the discussions and very generours supports from all the parents here.</p>
<p>As our son will be the very first male in our family to attend a 4 year college in US, we are still learning.</p>
<p>My first kid had a strong, strong, strong interest in a particular major. Sitting in on classes in that major (and talking to students in that major) was invaluable.</p>
<p>Second kid may well go in undecided; sitting in on classes during his college visits may not be as important.</p>
<p>I don’t know. I just do not value sitting in a classroom that much. </p>
<p>DD was placed in a very high level class because of her master of the subject. She earned an A+ in the subject but strongly dislike the way the class was taught. </p>
<p>In other words, one class does not represent the school.</p>
<p>I’m all for sitting in on a class, but I would not miss the opportunity for face-time with an admissions rep at Swarthmore. When the accepted students arrive for the accepted students days in the spring, they are amazed when they chat with an admissions rep and say, I’m from such-and-such and the adcoms say, “oh you must be Jeremey? Math team? Right? Did summer research at the state university?”</p>
<p>The whole goal of college admissions is to help the admissions office put the face of a real teenager with the name on the application.</p>
<p>I agree that the info sessions can be repetitive, but you’ve got to size up the admissions game at each college. An opportunity to meet an admissions rep at Swarthmore and introduce yourself as a first generation college applicant? Priceless. The admissions game is too hard to leave arrows in the quiver.</p>
<p>DadII,</p>
<p>I think part of the process here is to help our high school kids start picturing themselves at college. That may be the real value of sitting in a on a class.</p>
<p>My daughter e-mailed a professor for a Russian novel class to see if it was OK to sit in. The prof e-mailed her back and gave her the reading assignment for that class (a Doestoevsky novel). She read the novel, followed the class discussion, met with the professor after class, and came away from the experience with confidence that she could handle and enjoy the academics at a very rigorous college. </p>
<p>She e-mail the chairman of the Chem department to sit in on one of his classes. He e-mailed back that the particular class - an honors seminar – would be so far over her head that it wouldn’t be a good choice. He proposed several better alternatives. When the scheduling didn’t work out, he invited her to stop by his office instead. They chatted for fifteen minutes and then he set her up with a senior majoring in the department to walk her around, show her the labs, and talk about being a Chem major at Swarthmore.</p>
<p>Both experiences were productive and useful in finding out about college, learning about a specific college, and laying the groundwork for a strong “demonstrated interest” application. They were also valuable just in terms of the process of e-mailing a “letter of introduction” and setting up a meeting.</p>
<p>I have to say we didn’t get anything out of info session, tour or sitting in a classroom. All of that we could have seen on most school’s website or video. Our D was looking for a liberal arts education focusing on math or econ, so we knew most of schools she was interested in had those programs. What we found to be invaluable was to just sit at school’s cafeteria or student union. We were able to observe the type of students attending the school, whether there was racial tension, and if students were happy. My theory is if people couldn’t be happy when they are eating then they must be miserable most of the time. I actually talked my daughter out of going to one school because on a bright sunny day no one was playing frisbee or hanging out on the lawn.</p>
<p>[Hotels</a> Near Philadelphia ? Doubletree Philadelphia West Hotel PA](<a href=“http://doubletree1.hilton.com/en_US/dt/hotel/PHLGHDT-Doubletree-Guest-Suites-Philadelphia-West-Pennsylvania/index.do]Hotels”>http://doubletree1.hilton.com/en_US/dt/hotel/PHLGHDT-Doubletree-Guest-Suites-Philadelphia-West-Pennsylvania/index.do)</p>
<p>This hotel is at the crossroads of the PA turnpike and 476 and a popular choice for people who want a central location within the region. It puts you within striking distance of Princeton (east on PA turnpike), Swarthmore (south on 476) and Penn. </p>
<p>Keep in mind that staying two hours from Pittsburgh on night one will still put you three and a half hours away from Princeton the next morning. If you are done in Pittsburgh by the mid or late afternoon, it may make sense to try to get a bit further.</p>