Please Read

<p>Reading the posts on this forum and interacting with other pre-meds at my university, I am saddened to see that so many students are so obsessed with their pre-med courses and getting into medical school that they forget why they wanted to be doctors in the first place. I know it's sometimes difficult to grasp, especially when you feel overwhelmed by your classes and life in general, but being a doctor is not about what undergraduate school you went to, what your major was, or getting a B instead of an A in a biology lab. In fact, it's not about you at all. It's about other people, the future, and wanting to make a contribution to society, one life at a time. The last thing anyone should be in this world is selfish. Having the ability to make a difference in someone's life should be an incredible reward in itself. I urge many of you to reevaluate what you really want and why you want it, whether that be medicine or not.</p>

<p>I agree with what you are saying, but...</p>

<p>this board is about medical school admissions, so the posts in it are going to be of that nature. The board is heavily concentrated with the things that you mention in your post, but that's only because that is the nature of the board. Just because someone posts one question does not mean s/he is absolutely neurotic. Please don't judge us all.</p>

<p>Premeds are neurotic and selfish? No way!</p>

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Reading the posts on this forum and interacting with other pre-meds at my university, I am saddened to see that so many students are so obsessed with their pre-med courses and getting into medical school that they forget why they wanted to be doctors in the first place.

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<p>The neuroticism is a result of the difficulty in getting into medical school - the admissions process itself can be pretty kooky. If it were less hard, there'd be less hysteria. That being said, a quick sweep of any of the general boards here at CC reveals that no matter how easy it is to get into a decent state school for a BA/BS, someone will always be hysterical. So there's a certain amount of warranted neuroticism along with the unwarranted hysteria.</p>

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being a doctor is [...] not about you at all. It's about other people, the future, and wanting to make a contribution to society, one life at a time.

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<p>People have lots of motives for going into medicine. I suppose that in someone's "ideal" world, all would-be pre-meds would be motivated by atruism. That being said, no amount of wishing is going to make it so.</p>

<p>I'm beginning to wonder if going into medicine for other reasons such as desiring the personal challenge of excellence or to uphold a longstanding family tradition of service is really as bad as you make it out to be. As I see it, good medicine is at least partially about serving everyone equally, and I don't think that's possible if you begin by making moral judgments about the motivations of your future coworkers. Who's to say that being self-serving is always bad?</p>

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The last thing anyone should be in this world is selfish.

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<p>Howard Roark would like to have a word with you, sah!</p>

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Having the ability to make a difference in someone's life should be an incredible reward in itself. I urge many of you to reevaluate what you really want and why you want it, whether that be medicine or not.

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<p>Serving others should be an incredible reward, but frankly, a lot of the time it's not. "Service to others" shouldn't be your only reason for being a doctor - after all, one can serve others in other professions. It's more complicated than self-sacrifice.</p>

<p>As a note, if I don't make any sense, it's because I have an anatomy midterm on Friday and visions of the nerves innervating the pelvis are dancing through my head. That and I'm feeling contrary. >:O</p>

<p>Let me tell you. If patients were as appreciative as you seem to think they are, it might be a little easier to do medicine with "making a difference in someone's life" as your number one source of satisfaction. I promise you, though, patients are rarely ever truly grateful. I don't mean to sound cynical, because we do have patients (or in my case at the moment because I'm on Peds - parents) who are truly appreciative of what we've done, parents like little 9 month old Abe's who I got to discharge this morning after 2 days in the hospital for respiratory distress. But then I also have plenty of patients and parents who despite my best medical intentions, and those of my intern, my supervising resident and my attending, are ****ed off that they are in the hospital despite the fact they would die without our help. </p>

<p>All that said, I agree that pre-meds often lose sight of the ultimate goal. One of my frequent sayings is "I want to be a doctor not a med student". That's easy for me to say at this point, because I am a med student, and I'm well on my way, barring any major mishaps, to becoming a doctor. But the competitiveness of med school admissions makes looking at the ultimate goal impractical. Getting in is such a huge, huge hurdle, that pre-meds have a right to be slightly neurotic. You must be focused on doing those things necessary to get in, so that you can be a doctor at the end. Certainly many pre-meds are WAY too neurotic, and they would be best served to tone it down a little, but some focus and determination is needed, and must be aimed squarely at the major hurdle that stands in the way.</p>

<p>I often use the metaphor of climbing a mountain to describe getting into medical school. The summit is getting accepted. I truly believe that (as much as I hated the first two years or studying for Step 1). The majority of your effort has to be expended there. Certainly there are chances coming down the backside (1st two years, Step 1, Step 2) to screw up and not reach the promised land of having those letters behind your name, but they are not near as significant of hurdles as simply trying to get in.</p>

<p>you can be the kindest soul who wants to help people feel better, but if your gpa is horribly screwed up, then you won't be a doctor (but may be a nurse or pharmacist).
On the other hand, you can be a complete ass, but a smart ass nonetheless, and still get into med school (if you play your cards right at the interview).
Not everyone who wants to be a doctor makes it in (data confirms this), so if you got to muscle your way to get a high gpa, then do it.</p>

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but if your gpa is horribly screwed up, then you won't be a doctor (but may be a nurse or pharmacist).

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Right...because we all know it's a joke to get into pharmacy school.</p>

<p>I should mention that a great number of premeds do manage to spend several years without being compulsive. They have clinical service because of course you'd want to spend time volunteering with sick people. They do well because they're smart kids. They interview well because they're just themselves. They go to good schools because they're pursuing an excellent education.</p>

<p>Of course, you have to be compulsive about the application process itself. But that's a one-year process.</p>

<p>^ITA. Additionally, premeds in guaranteed programs don't really have a reason to be neurotic provided they can maintain their minimum GPA. The program I'm in doesn't require the MCAT, so it's one less stress for me. I've already interviewed and such, so that's also not a stress.</p>

<p>


And I would urge you to hang on tight. You are pretty high up on that horse. Thanks for riding by. ;) (Your tone was just a little too condescending to take any point you may have had seriously. But as always, JMO.)</p>

<p>Central Perky: No way was i indicating that pharmacy was a joke to get into. but it is a generally accepted consensus that med school is harder to get into than pharm school, and that pharm school is often times a backup/fall-back career that former premeds turn to.</p>

<p>^WHAT (and a double one at that for the ineptitude of the OP, but quite frankly the OP's speaks for itself and no further comment is necessary)? Pharm school has a few unique courses that they require which medical schools don't, and requires experience in a pharmacy that the majority of pre-meds won't have fulfilled. Usually if former premeds find out that they don't have what it takes for medical school, by then its probably too late for pharm school as well since the damage has already been done academically.</p>

<p>MyAshes,</p>

<p>Obsessed is not the right word. Premed students are committed, involved, and highly motivated in persevering their goals. </p>

<p>It's a good thing! When you look at how difficult it is to get into Med schools, it's no wonder they have to be this involved. Also, by nature medicine and sciences in general, are fields of discovery. Students in these areas get trained to seek information/research all they can. Kids on CC are seeking information and expertise that exists outside of their boundaries. Information gleaned is power earned!</p>

<p>Applaud these students for being so passionate about achieving their goals. If they are so incredibly diligent about seeking information about 'getting into med schools', imagine how diligent they will be about studying medicine itself!
I would any day prefer having a Neurologist, or a Cardiologist or any other specialist treat me if he has been curious enough to keep up with the latest research/developents in the ever changing medical field....... </p>

<p>I say kudos to you premeds on CC for your enthusiasm and perseverence.</p>

<p>captain_obvious: I have no idea what you're trying to say. For the most part (at least at my school) the reqs are the same for both aside from the diff in standardized test.</p>

<p>The coursework requirements may be similar (although I don't think so), but the extracurricular expectations are very different. And the obvious difference in standardized testing is nonetheless a significant one.</p>

<p>There's overlap, but I know at least some pharm schools actually require business classes, less chemistry (my pharm friends only took a semester of organic), and some other slightly different requirements.</p>

<p>The big differences is those extracurriculars. Those are very different, very time consuming - physician shadowing and volunteering at a hospital do not represent quality pre pharm experiences. </p>

<p>Finally, if you really want to be a doctor, you're not going to be happy as a pharmacist. If you really want to be a pharmacist, you're not going to be happy as a doctor. They just do different things, and have different expectations. Both are certainly important, but just because they're both in health care doesn't mean that they are the same.</p>

<p>Yeah, pharmacy would be a strange alternative to being a physician. Nurse practitioner, Physician's assistant, physical therapist, there are lots of other health professions that share a doctor's relationship with patients, direct care elements, etc. Pharmacy just is not one of them.</p>

<p>The coursework for pharmacists is very different from the coursework for premeds at my school. You cannot compare the GPAs because of this (and other factors), but as an anecdote the average GPA for our pharm school is 3.85, while the med school's is 3.6. Of course, coursework, EC, testing, etc. is all different. If a premed failed to get into med school, they could not transfer to pharmacy very easily.</p>