The quote has been around for a long time. I want to know when the masses ever used it as policy. In actual history I see wars, fights, silencing, people kicked out of places, and more.
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Bari Weiss is awful.
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Thank you.
Priceless skill: Letting your kids do debate. Seeing their faces when they have to discuss something and you know that are on the opposite side.
One of the best $ we ever spent was on debate. Boy, did it make it hard to live with teens who could argue but knowing they could see both sides was our ultimate goal. They still use those skills every day.
I never mince words about free speech. It’s a critical part of democracy. That’s why it’s 1A. Without it, anyone can silence anyone else at any time. Happening now at a local place near you. Will be interesting to see what happens over the next decade.
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Probably depends on the political topic. At various times, some political topics have been such that people can be cordial and agree to disagree, but others are basically like religious or identity wars where people yell and do not listen (and complain about “free speech” when others do not listen to them). Race and racism related issues usually tend to be of the latter type, although that does not always mean that conflict about such dominates the politics of the time or squeezes out cordial debate on other issues (e.g. when there is a supermajority political consensus on the topic, or when the factions on the topic are scattered across the political parties).
Of course, today, race and racism related issues are mostly divided along party lines, and there is no overwhelming supermajority consensus, so other political topics get pulled into religious or identity wars.
How Politics Replaced Religion in America - The Atlantic compares the current state of US politics to a religious war.
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In The Friends of Voltaire, Hall wrote the phrase: “I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it” as an illustration of Voltaire’s beliefs. This quotation – which is sometimes misattributed to Voltaire himself – is often cited to describe the principle of freedom of speech.
[
Evelyn Beatrice Hall - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Evelyn_Beatrice_Hall
](Evelyn Beatrice Hall - Wikipedia)
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What do you mean? No HW parent or student (or former parent or student) was amongst the 53 people charged in the Varsity Blues scandal.
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Yes, I am aware of the origin.
It was the foundation for respectful discussions and being able to agree to disagree with decency.
I was trying to address what I see happening with kids today, not get into some debate about history of the masses.
I am quite aware of silencing in history which is why I find today’s climate disturbing. I don’t care who or what side is doing the silencing, either direction it’s not okay.
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Not directly but many of the parents used Rick Singer’s services. https://www.fastcompany.com/90606880/why-los-angeles-was-the-epicenter-of-the-varsity-blues-college-admissions-scandal
I don’t think it’s true that many parents used his services. The school received subpoenas about two former parents, neither of whom were charged. I get it, it’s a rich private school, and it SEEMS like the sort of place parents WOULD use his services, but the facts don’t bear that out.
Not exactly what the author of the linked article says. Her exact words were prominent parents used Singer’s services
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And what I’m trying to say is there’s really nothing new under the sun. Humans have been humans since humanity began. The majority often silences the masses. The topics may change, but life goes on. And through it all, hopefully progress happens. Seeing videos of the past and reading about history of various wars, etc, I’m pretty sure progress is happening. I like to think high school and college age kids can actually think for themselves, keep what is good, and dismiss the rest. Not everyone will, of course, but overall, I see progress throughout the centuries and decades.
People often are wistful about “the good old days.” I always wonder what days those were. I look at history and am glad to be alive now.
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Kiddo’s public middle school does this every few years on a school-wide basis. They call it “the hunger lunch”.
There is a random draw - 5% of the kids get a Thanksgiving meal, cloth napkins and a a big table at the front of the gym. 15% get something like a sandwich, and sit on the bleachers. Everyone else sits on the floor with rice and beans.
They have a speaker come to talk about food scarcity and insecurity. The parents love it. Kids not so much.
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So thankful I’m done with k-12. I’d be homeschooling for sure with all the non-academic crap clogging up schools these days.
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I feel the same. I am happy to be living in a time when casual racism and homophobia are less acceptable. In terms of education my kids attending public school in liberal MA have been pretty traditionally educated - complete with references to Newton’s Law. And, yes, Shakespeare and other classics are still in the curriculum.
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delete.
I’m pretty partial to running water in most places, lower crime rates, better health care, access to the knowledge of the world via a phone in my pocket, easy travel (in non-Covid days anyway), better/safer cars, food safety nets (in our country), people starting to care for the planet, no need for the Green Book, women being able to vote and have pretty much any job they want including being the boss without having to sleep their way to the top, women able to wear pants/drive/have their own credit, etc. Heck, my list would go on and on for pages. I can read history books or listen to stories from my grandparents/parents (RIP) and in-laws and be really glad I live now vs in their days.
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Well like many here, I’ve been around a while too. Have seen quite a bit.
What I have never seen is the ability of technology to spread news and information so quickly. The pluses are obvious. The downside is too. You can cripple someone’s good name, business and family in a few sentences. Technology has become a weapon to shut down views we don’t share. Yes, some just skip over it. But for many, that’s not enough.
It happens every day. Many say others who have different opinions “deserve” what they get. Their orthodoxy and opinions are worse than many belief systems. Don’t agree with their opinions or aporoach? They’ll call you racist, or sexist, or fill in the blank. It’s ceaseless, loud and getting louder all the time.
Some may feel that things are better than in the past. But I recall many great conversations that wouldn’t happen today. People are too wary. They turn to their own little world which keeps getting smaller and smaller until they find every friend they had with a different opinion is no longer around.
I’m hoping for the best. But keep seeing the worst.
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Some of what is being criticized actually is racist, sexist, or just plain nasty, and stuff like that is getting more common and louder. Of course, that is just the critics using their freedom of speech in response to someone else’s freedom of speech.
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What I am stressing is, many people have constructed an orthodoxy to frame other people’s arguments. They allow no discourse and they use devices to attack others as mentioned above. If one doesn’t agree they WILL be silenced.
I’m a fan of 1A. If I don’t like someone’s argument, I’m not in favor of shutting them up. Silencing other views is the main issue. And the attacks are often made on similar bases.
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