<p>"Can you please stop being so insecure about CMC? "</p>
<p>So I point out where I think you are wrong and then I am tell you about a class my son attended at Pomona and I am called hateful, vengeful and other assorted names, and you are calling me insecure. Pot calling the kettle black. (not accusing you of doing this)</p>
<p>Zrathustra, I disagree with your analogy. The joint science dept and the math dept at CMC have fine reputations and most of the computer science courses are jointly offered by Pomona, CMC and Harvey Mudd. Computer Sciences at Pomona relies heavily on CMC and Harvey Mudd. If CMC is specialized, it is only that it emphasizes leadership and looks for applicants who excel in the classroom and have made a significant impact in their community or schools.</p>
<p>Parent57, I said insecure because you keep thinking we’re trying to insult or demerit CMC. No one here is. We’ve established that over and over because you take a lot of what we say, even if it’s not even important [Okay, CMC is a specialized school. So what?], as an attack to CMC. I did not say it because you portray some negative aspects about Pomona. </p>
<p>The word specializes means “having a specialty”. A specialty is something you’re known for being good in. Your carpenter specializes in carpentry, yet he can be fantastic in philosophy, debate, and baseball. CMC works the same way- it specializes in business/leadership/political programs, but it can still be great in other majors.</p>
<p>No, I never said you’re trying to insult or demerit CMC; however, I did say you were incorrect in a few of your characterizations of CMC and their students. By merely pointing it out to you, some here are hyperventilating and acting like I had just killed their firstborn.</p>
<p>On the whole elitist thing, I think that’s more a joke these days. Most students are keenly aware of the “age-old” stereotypes of each school but it never really manifested itself in the classroom, in most social settings…On occasion at a party, but more a light-hearted way to break the ice than anything else: “You go to Pomona…you must be reeeally smart.”</p>
<p>On the whole campus thing, I found that most people thought Scripps was the nicest campus, maybe followed by Pomona. They’re all nice though–in different ways.</p>
<p>Parent57, you are super-sensitive if anyone characterizes CMC (or even Pomona), yet you are all too ready to make broad generalizations about CMC when it serves your own purpose. </p>
<p>For example, here’s one post I noticed, which suggests you are proud of CMC’s image, and don’t hesitate to generalize about CMC students - as well as about those who don’t belong there:</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Here’s another one where you pat the CMC extroverts on their assertive heads:
</p>
<p>In the current thread, you purport to speak for how most CMC students view Pomona students, but you’re not there! Then you get all huffy about other people’s opinions, even if the writer is a current student describing his or her personal experience. </p>
<p>People here are not trying to pick on you; they’re simply noting that you come across as a biased and frequently hostile defender of all things CMC. Can’t we just all agree that people are always going to have particular impressions of a place or a group - and sometimes that individual impression takes on somewhat iconic status - i.e. a stereotype? You do it, other parents do it, students do it, and college guides do it. The sharing of opinions can be very interesting, but not when you give the impression that you wait in the wings ready to pounce on any perceived slight. Could you maybe take it down a notch?</p>
<p>
Now, this is just false. Harvey Mudd, of course, has a world-class CS program that is more than self-sufficient. Pomona has a small number of CS majors, but all classes needed for the major are offered at Pomona and some students never take a CS class at Mudd. Pomona and Mudd have different introductory sequences, so it’s more common for students from either school to take some upper-division courses at the other. CMC has a much more limited program, and CS students from there actually must get an off-campus major from either Pomona or Mudd. CMC has the same intro courses as Pomona, which probably contributes to the decision of many CMC students to pick the Pomona major. This semester, there are 10-15 CS courses each at Mudd and Pomona, and 2 at CMC.</p>
<p>There are complete math programs at all three schools, but Pomona and Mudd have exceptionally good ones (probably both in the top 5 among liberal arts colleges). </p>
<p>edit: None of this is to say that someone interested in technical subjects shouldn’t go to CMC. For example, if you want to major in Math or CS, but also want to dedicate a lot of time to studying econ, I think CMC might be a better fit than Mudd.</p>
<p>Well, FauxNom, all I simply did is point out some inaccurate statements and relay some comments from my son who took a course at Pomona, and a number of the Pomona (parents) posters practically have a heart attack. And you are accusing me of getting huffy, super sensitive and hostile. I think any IMPARTIAL observer would find these comments pretty funny!</p>
<p>Lockn, I took a look at the Spring schedule and CMC has 20 math courses and Pomona has 22. I am not seeing a huge gap here. BTW, Mudd blows both Pomona and CMC out of the water in the number of math courses offered.</p>
<p>From personally reading this entire thread, the only inaccurate, and even with that only partially inaccurate, statement that was not yours is the OP’s initial topic, where he stereotypes the schools into one word. </p>
<p>Let’s do a run down.</p>
<p>Artrell- responds to you in your harsh judgement of OP’s post and tells you it’s just an opinion.
OP- responds to your criticisms with a less stereotypical post.
Things go well for some posts.
Lockn- responds to your post by stating that his experience supports OP’s point
You- I “promise” no one at CMC thinks that. Do you personally know everyone at CMC? I don’t think you can really judge that.
TTT- tries to ease up the tension by stating that the entire place benefits as a whole
Sarabande- thanks TTT for loosening up the tenseness in this convo
You- “Sarabande, don’t you think patting yourself on the back with self-congratulatory boasts is somewhat tawdry.” Yeah, that’s certainly fair. Then you talk about how Pomona is grade-competitive, which no one will agree with. It’s clear you and your son don’t really know how Pomona is like.
Jean- brings up a good point that you’re degrading Pomona unfairly as a rivalry to CMC.
TTT- notices that these wrong observations stem from some angst against Pomona and tries to consolidate you by saying CMC is still a fantastic place to be
You- call the grade laid-backness “a company line” The rest of your post was great though.
Things go well for some posts.
TTT- states reasonably that the experience is different for everyone- one person’s experience shouldn’t be taken as the overall gospel.
You- state OP’s characterizations of CMC were inaccurate
OP- reposts what was already there and gives a lot of due credit to CMC
You- start arguing about ONE word in OP’s post.
OP- Notices that you’re getting really picky with CMC and tells you to stop continuing the argument.
You- wrongly react by saying you’re called hateful/vengeful. No one says this or even implies it.
You- give an entirely wrong characterization about CS at Pomona, yet again confirming your angst with it. Continue arguing about specialty even when it’s used in a GOOD context.
OP- responds by trying to consolidate to you that CMC’s still a good school.
You- state that again OP is inaccurate about CMC and the students, after all he or she, and the other posters, do to consolidate you. Wrongly accuses posters here of “acting as if I killed their new born”…I never noticed that.
prefreshnyc- States, like I did, that the elitism thing is not really taken seriously.
FauxNom-responds to your double standard and tells you to be more reasonable.
Lockn- reasonably gives some counters to your statements and corrects them.
You- States other are accusing you of being huffy, sensitive, and hostile. It’s clear that you return some of the hostility[accusing the “parent” posters], are very sensitive about even one word, as FauxNom rightfully calls “wait in the wings ready to pounce on any perceived slight”, and are continuing to argue even when posters have told you over and over again that CMC is a commendable school.</p>
<p>The posters here were reasonable with their characterizations of CMC and logical with their responses to your criticisms. Your characterizations of Pomona are for the most part, wrong, and you’re the one who keeps taking the reasonable criticisms to your posts as hyperventilated and dramatic.</p>
<p>NW, your rundown is hardly objective. Here is one inaccuracy among the many in your review of the thread.</p>
<p>“You- wrongly react by saying you’re called hateful/vengeful. No one says this or even implies it.” Read the thread again after taking your Pomona hat off.</p>
<p>Okay, I see what you mean in TTT’s post. But even so, what does that prove? Do you deny you’re being hateful about Pomona? You haven’t said a single good thing about it despite all the other poster’s countless praise for CMC. You’re bringing up personal attacks and insults to the posters, so how is that not vengeful? You think I wear a Pomona hat? Really? I am gonna be the one who takes full advantage of CMC’s social events and courses. And I would not mind a “Claremont McKenna is [nearly] a perfect school” because I can’t think of any flaws with it.</p>
<p>I think my review of the thread, other than that little detail I missed, is pretty accurate.</p>
<p>Anyways, I’m done. Thanks for the OP and anyone else who contributed for their characterizations of Pomona. It truly feels like a wonderful place and I can’t wait to go, especially with the wonderful consortium =)</p>
<p>
I don’t think my post ever claimed that the quantity of math courses at CMC was insufficient.</p>
<p>Okay, now I am getting slightly irritated. Let’s call a spade a spade. The OP starts the thread by calling the student at Harvey Mudd a lovable nerd, the Pitzer student a hippy, the CMC student is a jock and lo and behold the Pomona student is what “well-rounded.” Yeah, I have some trouble with those self-serving stereotypes, because it is a lot of BS. And you Fauxnom, if I remember correctly, (if I am wrong, I apologize) called the students at CMC macho in a thread last year. Does the description of the typical CMC student, in which you have quoted me, make you uncomfortable. You don’t like assertive people? You guys can say how much you appreciate the other schools, but the condescension is not that hard to detect. Maybe it is because you are intimidated by CMC students, who knows, but your patronization of the other schools in the consortium is not really fooling anyone. This goes back to my original point that there are some students at the Claremont schools who detect this attitude, but trust me no one I know at CMC thinks Pomona students are elitist because they supposedly don’t take advantage of the other schools. Can you see that even having this thought that others in the Claremont schools would be insulted because Pomona students are not more involved in their schools is somewhat overbearing.</p>
<p>Okay, it’s pretty obvious now that A) You’re not reading the posts or B) You’re only looking for the problems with the posts. </p>
<p>I summed up the 5C’s in one word because it was a quick way of understanding the diversity of the whole consortium. Do you deny CMC is more jocky than the others? HMC is less nerdy? Did you not see that I said “who are all still quite diverse in their own way?” </p>
<h2>Pomona IS well-rounded. You can’t stereotype it. We have students of every kind here. Other than the liberal, laid-back, and friendly attitude, you’ll find an exceptionally diverse body. The other schools, except maybe Scripps, are all about the fit. CMC looks for leaders, HMC looks for those particularly well qualified in Math and Science, Pitzer looks for the politically active. Pomona in their ADMISSION LETTER stated they wanted a diverse student body. That is not to say the other bodies aren’t diverse, but they follow a pretty general trend. Pomona doesn’t.</h2>
<p>“You guys can say how much you appreciate the other schools, but the condescension is not that hard to detect.”</p>
<p>My god. You’re so completely wrong. You know where you’re detecting the condescension from? From your own insecurity with CMC and your hostility towards Pomona. I have some amazing friends from CMC and they’d be embarrassed to see this. </p>
<p>“Maybe it is because you are intimidated by CMC students, who knows, but your patronization of the other schools in the consortium is not really fooling anyone.”</p>
<p>The only one who’s fooling yourself of what happens in the consortium and what our opinions are is you. Who are you to tell us you know our own opinions better than we know them? Look at the thread titled “Top 10 Reasons to go to Pomona”, most posts in there mention the consortium, many in the first position.</p>
<p>“This goes back to my original point that there are some students at the Claremont schools who detect this attitude, but trust me no one I know at CMC thinks Pomona students are elitist because they supposedly don’t take advantage of the other schools.”</p>
<p>Your son has not seen through the eyes of someone who actually attends Pomona. It seems like you attended CMC so the same applies to you. This is all about experience here. The post clearly stated it was MY opinion. Ultimately, just because the matter isn’t relating to you doesn’t mean it must be wrong.</p>
<p>Anyways, I don’t think I’m gonna post in this thread anymore. If you have any questions about Pomona please PM me. I’d be glad to answer your questions with things I with my very own eyes have witnessed.</p>
<p>Parent57, you need to be more confident and secure with the inherent quality of CMC’s offerings, which by all accounts here are substantial and admirable. Your comments are not being read as “assertive,” but instead as insecure, and I fear you are inadvertently undermining the school as its most desperate spokesperson. You sense that you are being condescended to, or perhaps patronized, and I think instead other posters are trying to reassure you that you don’t have to shout so loudly that CMC is a worthy institution. We’re all in agreement with you here, except perhaps in that many here view the consortium as a cooperative endeavor, while it seems clear that you view it as a competitive contest. In this sense, it’s true that there’s a substantial culture clash between your and others’ articulated views of the 5C’s. Perhaps you can best express your confidence and enthusiasm for CMC on the CMC forum. When other parents or students even “having a thought” seems “overbearing” to you – well you’re demonstrating a level of insecurity that falls outside normative bounds.</p>
<p>LLL, you’re in self-denial mode. Go ahead take a poll of the other students at the consortium and let’s see if what I said or what you said is correct. Also, I could stereotype Pomona, just like you stereotyped the other schools, but if I did there would be a lynch mob here looking for blood.</p>
<p>Go ahead and stereotype it then. Give us your opinion. Saying “like a lynch mob looking for blood” doesn’t do anything other than provoke even more tension. We already saw an earlier poster’s less than positive opinions to Pomona’s campus aesthetics. After nostalgic posted some photos to give his insight, others followed, with him ultimately stating it wasn’t to his taste. None of us disagreed because it’s his credible opinion.</p>
<p>For the poll? Student experiences already exist. Why don’t you google them or search them up in the board here? You’ll find plenty on the matter. There were posters here echoing what I stated, as well as posters who stated that the elitism status is just a tradition rather than something to be taken seriously. I prefer that type of perception- a collaborative one so that a prospective student can weigh all options- over an absolute one.</p>
<p>I am sure I will make everyone happy by telling you this is my last post in this thread. Instead of responding to each of my points, all I get is how insecure I am or personal attacks on my character. That’s okay, I am not complaining, but the fact that many of you deny what I am saying (which is a commonly held belief by many at the Consortium) is very revealing of the the total lack of awareness of how you are viewed by others at the CC schools. But don’t worry I won’t burst the bubble you have constructed for yourselves.</p>