Pomona vs. Ivy/Stanford

Colleges and Universities A-Z Pomona College
1

<p>Hello. I have a bit of a dilemna (albeit, a good one). </p>

<p>I've been admitted into Pomona, Stanford, Harvard, and a number of other colleges.</p>

<p>Whenever I tell anyone where I got in, they tell me "Good luck at Harvard". I go to one of those prep schools where pedigree is, well, just about everything. Sometimes they say, "But I guess if you really like the weather in California, you can go to Stanford." They assume I'm joking when I mention Pomona. Then they say that either A) I don't deserve my acceptance to Harvard/Stanford or B) That they think it's a good idea to take it easy for college.</p>

<p>Before I got this universal reaction, I thought I my list was: Pomona, Stanford, Harvard, in that order.</p>

<p>However, I can't help but wonder what I might be missing that everyone else seems to see. </p>

<p>This leads me to my question(s):</p>

<p>What are graduate school admissions like from Harvard/Stanford v. Pomona?</p>

<p>Are the academics truly better at Harvard/Stanford? (I was under the impression that there was too much of a focus on graduates...)</p>

<p>And, really, I suppose, why is everyone so thoroughly set on it as oppossed to Pomona?</p>

<p>I used to think I know where I wanted to go to school, but there hasn't been a single person who's supported my choice. I guess what I really want to know is if this is just the blue-blooded East Coast boarding school crowd, and not the general consensus. </p>

<p>Basically, I guess, I'd like to know if this reaction is just because of where I go to school, or if there's actually any basis for it? I really, really hope it isn't. I know I should do what I think is best, but that's awfully hard to do when absolutely no one seems to support it...</p>

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<p>Why would you want the general consensus to guide your life?</p>

3

<p>I’ll start by saying I don’t have stats for you; I’m sure those can be found in a few minutes on Google or in a following post on this thread. </p>

<p>What I will tell you is that I’m from Illinois and spent last year’s spring break visiting colleges in California. I visited Stanford, Berkeley, UCLA, and three Claremonts (Pomona, Pitzer, and McKenna)… I only ended up applying to those three Claremonts. Does Stanford have amazing name recognition? Yeah. Will Stanford get you where you want to go? Most likely, yeah. Do you fit in at Stanford? That’s where you decide.</p>

<p>Aside from doubts of getting accepted in the first place, I chose not to apply because I didn’t feel “at home” there. Not to say I’m necessarily not smart enough to be at Stanford - I got into and will likely be attending Pomona, if that means anything - but I don’t buy into the whole let’s-all-get-straight-A’s-just-because-we-can attitude. I feel like at Stanford, I’d be under too much academic pressure - everyone spends their free-time at the library studying studying studying instead of taking some time to themselves and simply enjoying the day. But at Pomona, I expect a much better integration of work and play. </p>

<p>The whole point of this post: find where you fit, and go there.</p>

<p>All that said, I’d encourage you to post this same thread on Stanford and Harvard forums, because I - as well as other posters - am clearly biased toward Pomona.</p>

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<p>Well said nick.</p>

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<p>

</p>

<p>and</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Thank you brabble, that is exactly what I was going to say.</p>

<p>@ drying, are you really going to go through your life making decisions by what the general consensus is? Where you work? Who you marry? How many kids you have? When you have them? I hope not.</p>

6

<p>Here is a great thread for this topic:
(found it on Pomona’s facebook group!)</p>

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/484896-rejecting-harvard.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/484896-rejecting-harvard.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>^ Definitely read that thread. </p>

<p>I also faced a decision between an ivy-league school (Columbia) and Pomona, chose Pomona, and have never looked back. But you should know that the decision you face isn’t all that uncommon among Pomona students. Many people here turned down similarly prestigious schools (Brown, Princeton, Yale, Stanford, Columbia, Dartmouth and top LACs) to attend. </p>

<p>As far as your questions go:</p>

<p>

[/quote]
What are graduate school admissions like from Harvard/Stanford v. Pomona?</p>

<p>Are the academics truly better at Harvard/Stanford? (I was under the impression that there was too much of a focus on graduates…)</p>

<p>And, really, I suppose, why is everyone so thoroughly set on it as oppossed to Pomona?

[/quote]
</p>

<ol>
<li><p>They’re equally good. Harvard may have a slight advantage. </p></li>
<li><p>It may depend on the academic department. But as a rule, no.</p></li>
<li><p>Simply because they probably don’t know Pomona very well. </p></li>
</ol>

<p>Conclusion: It sounds like you really want to go to Pomona. Do what your heart tells you to do.</p>

8

<p>Was accepted to Pomona, Amherst, Middlebury, Carleton, WashU, Georgetown, Yale, etc…and will be attending Pomona.<br>
Cannot stand the Ivy vibe…elitist, obnoxious, intense, competitive.
Cannot wait to get an incredible education at Pomona…and enjoy myself, too!</p>

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<p>I got accepted to Pomona and Stanford as well. I’m still deciding, but I think I’m leaning towards Stanford. I think you should go to Pomona if that was your gut. in terms of grad school admissions, pomona is very highly regarded and I think they have a near 100% acceptance rate to med schools. ( meaning nearly ever premed that applies gets into at least one med school. the national average is around 40%). I’ve heard that the academics at Pomona are great because you have excellent interaction with professors, but Ive also heard that the classes aren’t that difficult. Just so you know, the reasons I am leaning towards Stanford are a) I did feel at home at Stanford. b) I love the bay area, and I realy dont like SoCal that much. c) I want a bigger school than just 1500 people, or around 5000 if you count all 5Cs. d) the divisions 1 athletics are a lot of fun and I wont be able to get that anywhere else. Hope this helped :)</p>

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<p>Don’t believe a word about “easier classes” or less than stellar academics when compared to Harvard, Stanford, et al. In addition to what’s been mentioned already, here a few more good reasons to attend Pomona:</p>

<ul>
<li><p>Pomona College has fostered more Fulbright Scholars per capita than any other US academic institution 3 out of the last 4 years.</p></li>
<li><p>Pomona College ranks 15th nationally as a producer of PhD grads: (within 0.7% of Harvard, Princeton and Yale)</p></li>
<li><p>despite its smaller student body, from 2005-2007, Pomona had 9 Goldwater Science scholars, placing it above CalTech (5), MIT (8), Berkeley(6), Carnegie Mellon(6) and Michigan(6). 08/09 brought another 4, putting it in excellent company with MIT(7), Cornel(6)l, Berkeley (3)</p></li>
<li><p>at 165, LSAT scores of Pomona students are one above Stanford’ 164, tied with Yale and Swarthmore and one behind Harvard’s 166. In other words, there is no statistical difference between the schools in prepping their grads for Law School</p></li>
<li><p>Pomona students are often cross-admitted to Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia, et al., but many choose Pomona for their undergrad study because of its reputation for providing an intimate classroom setting (avg. class size 14), the chance to get to know and work closely on research with their professors, and a safe and caring environment for undergrads. You might want to check up on Harvard and Stanford in that regard – they are much larger institutions that are not particularly geared to undergrads and the (admittedly anecdotal) expressions of regret from unhappy – but stuck – attendees is plentiful.</p></li>
</ul>

<p>Finally, I remember reading a post on this site some time back that articulated the conundrum of name recognition vs. quality vs. prestige quite well:</p>

<p>" 99.9% of the American public will readily recognize (read: familiarity) Micky D’s Big Mac or Quarter Pounder (over a billion served!) vs., say, the “21” burger at the 21 Club (New York)… but does that Ronald McDonald more prestigious? Hardly.</p>

<p>Many people know (shop) at Wal-Mart vs. Bergdorf Goodman, but that hardly qualifies Wal-Mart to be categorized as “prestigious”</p>

<p>… don’t confuse the two terms: less familiarity doesn’t = less prestige. Just because your Bud-Light-loving neighbor hasn’t heard of Château Margaux doesn’t mean it isn’t prestigious - less familiar? Perhaps, but not less prestigious.</p>

<p>I would suggest that when it comes to undergraduate study, Harvard’s current reputation is as much a function of longevity and Eastern Ivy bias as it is academics. It made the transition from school to status symbol long ago. Stanford is another great school, but to the average person, it is known less for its academics, than for its maniacal devotion to, and success in Div I athletics.</p>

<p>If you’re looking for a stellar education at a top tier school with a 14:1 student teacher ratio; a place where you can actually interact with and get to know your professors; in a safe and healthy environment where you can work WITH – not in bloodthirsty competition against – your equally talented, intelligent and ambitious classmates, you simply can’t go wrong with Pomona.</p>

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<p>Just a note that might make you laugh… There is a t-shirt that Pomona students made that read something like:</p>

<pre><code> HARVARD
</code></pre>

<p>The Pomona of the east</p>

<p>: )</p>

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<p>^^^funny, except I think Pomona has more in common with Yale than Harvard.</p>

<p>In any case, congratulations drying. I’m a parent with 2 kids-- one who went to an HYP and one who went to Pomona. The Pomona kid is the more confident, more resourceful, more inner-directed, and the happiest. But he was that way before he went to Pomona. I think the place attracts that kind of person. He’s comfortable with himself, wanted the kind of personal education that Pomona provides, and didn’t feel the need for or want the hype surrounding a Stanford or Harvard. </p>

<p>You will find the most driven and competitive students at the big name schools, like HYPS. Some people thrive in that environment- others find it tedious, annoying and not conducive to learning. Pomona won’t get you the "oooh’s and ahh’s from the average person on the street that Harvard or Stanford might, but you’ll get plenty of respect from grad schools, employers and those who know education. You also won’t have to deal with the people who automatically think you must be a know-it-all or an elitist and have to try to prove you can relate to “normal” people; there is a downside to the fame of the big name.</p>

<pre><code> Just looking at educational opportunities, all three of these schools are great. You can’t go wrong. Pick the one that feels like you.
</code></pre>

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<p>Drying, go with the college YOU feel most comfortable with. Daughter has been accepted at three UC’s (with Regents Scholarships), Brown, Cornell, Pomona and UPenn. After spending the night at Pomona (highly recommend it) she knew it was the school she’d been looking for. Only YOU can decide where you’ll thrive.</p>

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<p>This may be helpful, albeit dated: <a href=“http://www.wsjclassroomedition.com/pdfs/wsj_college_092503.pdf[/url]”>http://www.wsjclassroomedition.com/pdfs/wsj_college_092503.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>A note in terms of the “prestige factor” --I myself am looking to attend Pomona College and am definitely in the same boat. It’s a trade-off that people aren’t going to be impressed (and although it shouldn’t matter …it kind of sort of does a little), when I get TO college, that’s not going to matter anymore. Pomona’s got so much going for it that it’s too hard to say no.</p>

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<p>You’ll get outstanding professors at any of those schools.</p>

<p>I think the main difference is here is that they are completely different. Pomona is a liberal arts school, Harvard is grad-focused. Pomona is smaller. Personally, I would rather go to Pomona because there is no grad department (no TAs), the classes are smaller, and it isn’t hard to have a good relationship with a professor. Those were all academic reasons. Theres also the consortium and a variety of other huge benefits with Pomona (not that there aren’t with Harvard). Choose where you want to go to school based on what you want.</p>

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<p>Thanks a lot. I realize just how bad of an idea it is to let the general consensus guide my life, I was just worried that there was actually some basis for it that I hadn’t realized. </p>

<p>I guess I’ll revisit all three schools, or, if I’m really impressed with Stanford/Pomona, just forget about Harvard. I talked to four or five people from last year’s class who went to Harvard and only two of them don’t regret their decision to go there (I guess they did it for reasons similar to why I would) and I’d rather not repeat their mistakes. </p>

<p>I think on some level I always knew I should just go with what I felt at first, but I sort of wanted at least someone else to agree that my decision wasn’t ridiculous, before I had to undergo the endless calls of “You stole my spot at Harvard and now you’re going to waste it?”. (My school is very small, and very good at being vindictive and such). </p>

<p>Thanks a lot. I think that I felt the best at Pomona when I visited, and ultimately that’s what matters. </p>

<p>Also, enkephalon, thanks so much for putting my doubts about academics to rest. I thought they were unfounded, but it’s nice to get confirmation.</p>

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<p>My pleasure, drying. Like everyone else on this thread, I’m happy to help. </p>

<p>I can relate to your indecision and anxiety, since our daughter went through the same agonizing process. In the end, she chose Pomona over Stanford and a few of the Ivies because she felt at home there from the moment she stepped on campus. After meeting some students, sitting in on a few classes and speaking with the profs, she was hooked.</p>

<p>Listen: You’re obviously a highly intelligent, ambitious and accomplished individual – or you wouldn’t have earned that slew of impressive admission offers. I have absolutely no doubt you will be a success in life no matter where you go for undergraduate study. Having said that, one variable which can make a difference at this stage in a HS graduate’s personal and academic evolution is that frustrating intangible known as “fit”. I believe that fit, or overall comfort level, is a critical determinant of success when choosing/attending a college – particularly if you are attending out-of-town and out-of-state institutions. After all, it stands to reason that if you’re happy with the environment, pleased to be with your new friends and classmates and closely engaged with your professors, you’ll perform at your highest level. And feel like a human being while you do so, not merely an academic automaton.</p>

<p>For what its worth, I believe Pomona (and other top LACs) offers a distinct brand of education that focusses on the needs of the undergraduate and helps them realize their inner potential over four important developmental years of their life. Orientation Adventure Week is one of many great examples of the lengths to which Pomona goes to welcome you, and to ensure you feel comfortable and part of the Pomona family from “day one”. Add in smaller classes (avg. 14 students per) taught by the best professors; lots of personal interaction with same and you have a wonderful, resource-rich academic incubator for horizon-widening and the development/refinement of critical thinking. And ultimately, a proven springboard into the finest grad and professional schools in the world.</p>

<p>But that’s just MY opinion. In the end, it’s up to YOU to decide what is best for you. The answer to that question may be Pomona, it may be Harvard or Stanford. Or someplace else. But whatever that final decision is, YOU must be happy with it, and make it – not to favour anyone else’s prejudices, wishes, or desires, but because you feel in your heart it is right for you. If you make it using those parameters, how can it be anything but the right one?</p>

<p>As Victor Frankl said: “The last of the human freedoms: to choose one’s attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one’s own way.”</p>

<p>Good luck, drying, and please accept my best wishes for a wonderful college experience and a happy life!</p>

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<p>In my opinion, the comment about the classes being easier at Pomona is not justified. In fact, it would be a difficult assumption to make unless one had attended both institutions. If you look at the stats of the admitted Stanford freshman class on CC, you will notice they are not (generally) as high as one would think–in fact there are plenty of admitted students with SATs around 2100. </p>

<p>However, if you are into name recognition, Pomona probably won’t do, especially from the east coast. Even on the west coast, many people confuse it with Cal Poly Pomona, a state school. However, my son found he was immediately “at home” at Pomona, and, after having visited Stanford and Pomona,didn’t get the right feeling from Stanford. He felt it was cold and competitive. I am sure the opposite could happen for many people. That is why there are so many choices! </p>

<p>For my son, he could care less about what people think about where he goes to school. Name recognition isn’t important to him.</p>

<p>Since you have the glorious option of being able choose, I would recommend you visit all and get the feel for the place. Good luck!</p>

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<p>westcoastmom is right. The USNWR stats for the entering class of Fall 2009 shows the following two CR and MAth composite rankings:</p>

<p>1515 , Caltech
1495 , Harvey Mudd
1490 , Yale
1485 , Harvard
1485 , Princeton
1475 , Pomona
1470 , MIT
1465 , U Chicago
1460 , Wash U
1455 , Columbia
1445 , Northwestern
1440 , Duke
1440 , Dartmouth
1435 , Swarthmore
1435 , Stanford
1430 , Brown
1425 , U Penn
1425 , Rice
1420 , Williams
1420 , Amherst</p>

<p>Needless to say, Pomona students are in darn good company, and there is no reason whatsoever to suspect they would settle for anything less than the best education they could secure for themselves.</p>

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<p>Stanford admits a lot of athletes which pulls down the scores. Not that these differences mean much anyway. These are all great schools.</p>