<p>Hey everyone. In the spring we'll be starting to visit schools for my son (a drumset player looking at Jazz Studies programs, mostly dual degree programs).</p>
<p>My question, is what we should be doing on these first visits (i.e just getting an overall feel for the place, he won't be staying overnight, etc...). Obviously, we'll take tours of the school itself and the conservatory. What else should we be looking to do? </p>
<p>Thanks,
David.</p>
<p>Also try to line up a lesson with a professor. The lesson helps your S figure out if he likes the prof, let's the prof know your S and allows the two of you to get an independent evaluation of whether or not your S is a viable candidate for that school. Some professors charge for lessons, some don't. It's always a good idea to ask when you make the initial contact.</p>
<p>That's one thing we were wondering: is it a good idea to set up a lesson that far before auditions (as he will obviously be a much improved player when auditions roll around given how far from now that is)?</p>
<p>Yes, I think it is since I'm guessing you visiting more schools than you'll apply to. Once you know if there are 1 or 2 schools S really wants to attend, then we set up second lessons there in the fall to "fine tune" things.</p>
<p>"he won't be staying overnight, etc"</p>
<p>I am not sure what you mean be etc, but I would consider spending a full day including an overnight visit. Tours are time consuming and expensive and I would recommend trying to get the most out of the experience. As mentioned, the lesson is not an audition but rather a opportunity to assess the teaching style and personality of the studio head. Try to arrange the visit so that you can also observe a student concert or rehearsal. Also consider meeting and touring the academic departments of interest. Also setup an appointment with admissions.</p>
<p>We've done quite a bit of on-line, etc. research so my son's list is narrowed already. The further distance schools are all getting longer visits: 24 hours at least. He is familiar with the home town conservatories, so doesn't need as long a visit at those.</p>
<p>I agree...do the tour, info session AND something in the school of music too. And try to set up a lesson with someone at each school. And watch an ensemble rehearsal and/or a concert. It will likely take you a full day to do all of the above at each school you visit. Re: overnights...most places do not have official overnight visits for juniors. DS never spent the night at ANY of his music choices...not even after acceptance. For him, the feeling of the music department and private teacher were far more important than the "Karma" on the campus or in the dorms. Also...everywhere you go...check out the practice rooms. Most large schools of music will offer tours of their music facilities (I thought UNT was top notch and if your kid is a jazz player I hope that school is on his list). The trip to your "home town" conservatory will probably be almost as long...but not quite as long. We had one of those and skipped the campus tour (since we had spent two days a week there for four years, that wasn't necessary), and the lesson (DS's private teacher was the teacher there)...but we did attend the info session and he DID have an interview with someone in the music department on our visit. The only thing that made it better was that we just did it at our convenience since we were close by.</p>
<p>No, Junior year is not too early for a lesson. In fact, that is all this is - a lesson. Not an audition. This is the time for your son to figure out if he can relate to this teacher. If he likes the teaching style. I also think it's real valuable to get the teacher's impression - does he encourage your son to apply, or is he lukewarm? My S dropped a school off his list because the teacher was extremely critical of everything S did. It may just be the teacher's style, or personality, or it may have been a bad day. But my S felt that if he went there, he would be expected to change everything he did, from style to technique. It was such a huge contrast from experiences at other schools that he knew he didn't fit there. (Up to that point, he'd rejected a few teachers for being "too nice." Felt he wanted a stricter teacher. After that, he realized that he wanted a picky teacher, but not necessarily a constantly critical one.)</p>
<p>After you visit a couple schools, you will begin to feel where there is genuine interest, and where there is simply polite interest.</p>
<p>I agree with Thumper - my kids also never did overnights. (No opinion about them - it just didn't work out.) All S2 did was meet with the teacher, and tour the campus. D has also sat in on classes (such as music theory). We also examined the condition and tuning of the pianos in the practice rooms. Silly, maybe, but it helped us evaluate the commitment to the music program.</p>
<p>Another thing about visiting junior year is that, come senior year, you can visit the top contenters again when you audition. You'd be surprised at how much more you learn the second time around. Plus, it's my opinion that the audition is a little easier if you've visited the school already, know your way around, have met the faculty, etc. Takes some of the pressure of the unknown away.</p>
<p>We figured that anywhere that was within a day's drive (i.e. about 500 miles) was worth visiting in Junior year and, if it stayed on the list, again in Senior year. If your son is going to be that much better by audition time, that is all the more reason to schedule a lesson in Junior year. The teacher will be impressed by how much he has learned in a year's time.</p>
<p>We found that department recitals were one of the most informative things that we could attend. When you get consecutive performances by several students of the same teacher, some common threads start to emerge. These recitals do not always make the web sites, so it is a good idea to call or email the teacher and ask about them before scheduling your trip.</p>
<p>Bassdad is right. After acceptance, DS went to his top choice school again (he actually wanted to go to the top TWO, but the second school never returned phone calls, emails or letters sent re: this and DS decided if that was how they treated their students, he was NOT interested in them). When he went to the post acceptance day, he had a FULL day beginning at 9 in the morning and ending at 10 in the evening. This included a walk around with the music adcom, sitting in on a theory class, visiting with his private trumpet teacher (who actually had left him a note because he heard DS was visiting...nice touch), attending an orchestra rehearsal...and most important...attending the brass department chamber music jury...usually open only to students IN the program, but DS (and I) were invited to come to see it because we were there. If school number 2 had offered him the same day, he might have matriculated there. School number 2 had the "hey, we are ____ and we don't need to do anything else to impress you" attitude. Too bad.</p>
<p>Thumper, not having emails returned is an issue we have been having, and I don't quite know how to read this. Part of me gets annoyed, since I think the same as your son, "if this is how they treat their students....", but then again, we aren't yet in the position to be throwing schools out based on their lack of etiquette.</p>
<p>What is a usual turn around time, and when to follow up? DS wrote both to conservatory admissions and two professors at one school about two weeks ago...heard back from neither. He heard from one professor, but not another, at a different school. It just seems like such bad PR to me, to igore potential students like this... and I read his emails, which were short and to the point, and didn't ask for much, except to tell when we were visiting and whether it would be possible to meet with them.</p>
<p>Sorry to hijack...I can post this separately, if need be (but son is also a junior, so it kind of fits!)</p>
<p>My son has a friend who visited Oberlin during her spring break in her junior year of high school. She arranged for a private lesson on her instrument, after which the teacher told her not to bother applying the next year. I'm guessing she wouldn't have improved enough to make a difference but you never know. So you ARE taking somewhat of a risk having a lesson in your junior year.</p>
<p>for what it's worth, my son made a tremendous growth during the Xmas holiday of his senior year. He practiced like crazy and took additional lessons with a new teacher. Although it would have been nice to have auditioned for Oberlin's Early Review, I'm not sure he would have been as impressive. Maybe he would have still been accepted, but possibly not, and likely without his rather substantial scholarship.</p>
<p>Responding to Thumper and Allmusic - Juilliard was terrible about all that administrative stuff. It affected me negatively about the school, and I really wanted S to choose a different one. We met their rep at an arts fair, and I truly don't understand why she was even there. Her attitude was arrogant, and her answer to every question was, "Well, you'll need to visit and see for yourself." It definitely turned me off.</p>
<p>H and S went to visit the school junior year. We tried unsuccessfully to contact the teacher in advance. Juilliard refused to give us any contact info. They asked us to write to them and see that he got the letter. We never heard back, and don't know who's fault. It is equally possible that it was the teacher's fault. We had heard he was extremely busy, teaching at 3 schools and his full time NYPhil job. So S applied there never having met or had a lesson with this teacher. The reason was, over and over, people were telling us and him the school and specific teacher would be perfect for him.</p>
<p>After he was accepted, they had a really hard time keeping our situation straight. We tried hard to send clear instructions about which address to use for what. But they sent bills to my sister (which she refused to pay. :) ) Sent S visa applications - twice. We really had to keep track of things ourselves.</p>
<p>Now, 3 years later, I have to say S's teachers were right. The teachers, both instrumental and classroom, are top notch, and the education he is getting is phenominal. But the administration at the school stinks. I joke about the school being run by artsy people who have no organizational skills. It is definitely a sore spot, but in actuality, affects my S very little.</p>
<p>Drummerdad: I have to ditto everyone on trying to arrange a lesson if at all possible. The teachers know that there will be progress made over the course of the year prior to the audition. Even if your son doesn't make a good impression, wouldn't you rather have that information now? Applications and auditions are costly in time and money. I think it's better to find those teachers who see potential in your son, and focus there. It also helps to attend concerts, or classes. Many teachers hold studio classes, often weekly. If a lesson can't be arranged, try to find out when these classes are held and whether your son can sit in. Your son can then get a sense of how the teacher interacts with students and get the chance to talk to other students at the school.</p>
<p>Allmusic: We also had the same experience with school administrations. Some are better organized and more friendly than others. Generally (but not always), we found that the "top" teachers were the least likely to give lessons to prospective students. They are extremely busy people, who don't have the time to give extra lessons. Some of them teach in summer programs, or provide master classes in different places, so your son may be able to meet them that way. Or as a last resort, you can talk to former or current students to get more information. </p>
<p>When we visited schools, we drew up a list of about 20 to 30 questions we wanted answered. For example, how large is the studio? How many applicants does the school usually get on D's instrument? How many usually accepted? What sorts of things do students do after completing their degree? What do students typically do in the summer? What performing opportunities are there, inside the school and in the community? How are orchestra positions determined and are they rotated? If there is more than one teacher on a particular instrument, how are the assignments made? Not all of our questions were answered at every school, but we got lots of extra information that helped to narrow the choices.</p>