Even schools that require “all scores” generally do so only for testing done during the high school years. They don’t want your TIP-qualifying scores. Still, three is plenty, and the kid could improve his overall application package more by ensuring that he gets an A in AP Physics (and perhaps a 5 on that exam) than by taking the ACT again.
I don’t think any college requires you to report scores you got in middle school. I agree with others that getting more A’s (especially in science and math if he’s going into engineering) would be far more productive.
I made my daughter take the test twice and I could not have gotten a 3rd out of her if I pulled all my hair out. It was worth taking twice. She made a 28 the first time. The 2nd time, she made a 34 and significantly improved her science score which was low the first time. But her English didn’t change much. The merit money coffers open at 32 so for us, the 2nd time was key. But I would not try to improve on a 33. It really won’t make up for GPA. Make sure you have some schools in play where he is in the 75% category because you can’t totally make up GPA with ACT scores. I’m frankly amazed you got him to take it so many times. He’s more pliable than mine, LOL.
OK everyone. I’ve got the gist of what you are all saying. My concern was his 3.5 GPA and while no amount of A’s this semester is going to budge that number much, he knows that an upward trend may count for something. The idea that an even higher ACT might make the schools think “slacker” when combined with his GPA is in fact consistent with the admissions presentation at UIUC in which they said they’d prefer a high GPA reflecting hard work for four years versus getting lucky on one particular Saturday. My hope is that another high ACT would show not so much another lucky day but perhaps a kid with potential to do the work at college. It was very hard to get my son to believe from the moment that he set foot on the high school campus that every grade needed to be an A. There was no way he was going to try that hard or becone a grade-grubber. I do think he is more mature now, willing and able to college level work for the field HE has chosen, and I will need to find some safeties for him to consider.
On a side note, I really do not appreciate the many snarky, judgemental comments. I would think that if you find my thread wacky, or our family’s choices not in sync with your own, you might just chuckle to yourself, roll your eyes and move on to another thread. I hoped to get reasoned observations on my son’s situation and I am thankful for the parents who actually took the time to leave them.
Your son is probably just really stressed and burnt out. Taking the SAT and ACT between spring of junior and fall of senior was enough for me! Unfortunately, during junior year in the session he got the 33, you probably should have had him take the ACT with the writing portion but there’s nothing you can do about it now. Let him take a break for a while. Maybe during the interim, he can get the score up on his own. Sometimes, these progressions happen naturally.
I took the ACT in April coming off of some decent ACT and heavy SAT study, wrapped up the SAT study before summer started, and continued ACT study going into the fall. I took the test in October and went up 2 composite points, going up across the board. Your son still has a lot of time to improve! At the moment, you’ve been cramming tests at him. I personally see nothing wrong with starting a little early. I started a little late in some people’s opinions (took the PSAT for the very first time in junior year, took SAT for the first time in winter/spring of junior year)
If I started when I was in 9th grade with regular practice and study, maybe I could have been better. So you’re down the right track with that, but you don’t want to crack the whip too much. 33 is certainly a respectable score (it’s 99%! However I heard some places dole out merit only for 34’s and 35’s. ). You should let your son take a breather for a couple months and have him take it with the writing again during the late spring or early fall. Hopefully it can be the last time!
OP: if you haven’t done so already, you can check out this thread. It looks like it may be helpful for your son’s situation.
Depends on your son, but pick your battles and all that. If he’s not going to put in extra effort to prep ahead of time and doesn’t want to do it, it doesn’t sound like it’s worth the fight. Fwiw my understanding of Purdue’s admissions process is that they are “holistic”. Have your son start an engineering club outside of school and crown himself President. Not really joking.
Trust me, your child is not alone. In reality (not CC reality), 3.5 uwGPA and an ACT score of 30 with Writing will gain your child entry into many good schools. Just maybe not the big names you see/may want (but it never hurts to try! - once he has a couple of safety schools and matches. Early admission is your friend.). You and your son will have to search but you will find good programs for your son. I also recommend the thread “does he really have to be an a student…?” Lots of school recommendations there.
Oh, I think there are many wacky threads on CC. It so happens that threads about multiple SAT or ACT generate responses from a wide range of members with different opinions. The biggest issue is that there are NO general rules that apply to everyone. Each student is a unique case.
The issue of retaking the test is always subject to interpretation. It used to be that people would tell that taking the SAT more than twice indicated an obsessive behavior and that colleges would discount such scores. While that reality was hard to find at any college in a verifiable way, it took the seminal research by Fischgrund to relegate such “advice” to the mythical real it belonged. Top schools did not care about the number of sittings as much as they care about the scores. And nobody ever got his or her scores increased for having taken it once, or without prep as many love to mention.
That is, however, not the main question. Should a student take many OFFICIAL tests? That answer is … not really as any reasonable preparation might keep that number very low. The TIP tests do NOT count. One can learn a lot from taking the PSAT in 9th or 10th grade without increasing the count. With several dozens of QAS tests available, there is no need to waste many Saturdays finding out the “real scores” let alone practicing. Anyone can do that at home or at the library. All in all, one could easily get “there” with 1 or 2 administrations.
Should a student retake a test despite a high score? That answer is defined by the chances to earn a higher score, and especially on a section that offers chances of improvement. Does it pay off? Well, years ago, our dear friend Curmudgeon asked a similar question and met with the typical “recommendation” to run with the score and focus on the GPA. Something that was hard for a Val with perfect grades! I suggested there was no downside to sit one more time as the difference was between a triple and a homerun! Does anyone still think the higher score did not make a difference in the grand scheme of things? Check his posts!
Wacky thread, indeed!
Just to be clear, I don’t think the original question was the wackiest part of this thread.
I know
As everyone has pointed out, a 33 is a fine score. I wouldn’t push him to take again. But since he’s interested in Engineering, might he take the SAT 2 subject tests, either Math 2 or Physics? If he does well, that would indicate strong ability in the direction he wants to go. If not, just submit ACT. You can take them both in one day. I’d grab a SAT seat (they tend to “sell out” in our neck of the woods) for June and see if you can persuade him. He’ll be studying for the AP Physics anyway (one presumes…) Buy the prep books and bribe him to do the review!
Things may be different now that the AP courses have been redesigned to some extent, but as of last year the AP Physics curriculum did not seem to align very well with what was covered in the SAT II test. D (admittedly neither especially talented nor especially interested in physics) did fine on the AP Physics B test but not so well on the SAT II.
OP, I posted a question on CC last week and got one of the meanest condescending responses I could have imagined to an innocent question. Some people are just not nice. Good luck!
Ease up on the testing. Tell him that it may be a good idea to retest in September senior year, but you won’t ask him to retest or mention the ACT until then. Let him breathe.
However, make sure he gets A’s in his science classes.
In addition, beside UWisc and Purdue, take him to visit colleges - UMN, UAlabama have already been mentioned. What about Rose Hulman, Cal Poly SLO+CPP+SDSU if you can afford the trip (and the 32k cost), RPI, RIT, UCincinnati and its famous Co-op program…? This way, he sees what the point is… it may help motivate him.
Do plan on Subject tests in May/June (Math 2, one science, and one humanities to show he’s not all stem :p)
Thumper, I got your PM but this is the only way I could figure out how to respond. Thank you for your kind PM.
There is a point of diminishing returns on multiple testing. Your son’s score of 33 is competitive for the ACT. Would a 36 be more competitive? Of course, but what is the chance he will get that score if he is burnt out? As several posters have already stated, there are some colleges that require ALL ACT scores taken in high school,because a high score taken in context of the number of attempts does not impress adcoms. However, many schools do not require this, and only ask for the highest score.
I think it is human to think that a few more points on these tests will make a difference in college admissions, but it just is not true. Unless he scores a perfect 36, a point or two above a 33 isn’t worth his time.
He did well, a 33 is enough to get him into many prestigious Universities. He doesnt have to take it again. And colleges will take the higher score of the ones you send them, it wont weigh on him that he got a lower score the 2nd time.