Princeton vs the University of Chicago

Colleges and Universities A-Z Princeton University
1

<p>Hey, everyone!</p>

<p>I didn't want to resort to making a thread about this, but I really need all the opinions I can get. Right now I am deciding between Princeton and the University of Chicago, and I'm having a very difficult time. I hope to study physics, and thus I hope for very strong research opportunities. If I don't study physics, then I will probably still something related to mathematics; however, I'm not at all a math-science only kind of guy: I am looking for a complete liberal arts education, as I could never even dream of sacrificing my education in literature or social sciences for some math and physics. Both schools seem to provide general education requirements that will assure I get a very complete, well-rounded education, as will my peers. I plan on playing trumpet throughout college as an extracurricular, but I'm not phenomenal at it so I'm worried about how selective the music groups are at the schools. Perhaps I'll join a singing group as well, again depending on competitiveness. It might be worth noting that in my spare time I also hope to tutor kids of all ages.</p>

<p>I'm a rather "intellectually focused" person, you could say--I'm not saying I'm brilliant, as I know many students at both schools that could integrate circles around me! I just mean that I enjoy spending my free time learning or discussing more academic subjects. I do not party, and I probably will never attend a party in college, and I am in no shape or form a drinker. I'm hoping for a school where I can definitely spend a great time with a small group of friends just talking, going to a concert, playing board games or video games, playing music, playing basketball, anything of that nature.</p>

<p>Thanks to anyone that takes the time to read this! I really appreciate your help!</p>

2

<p>Haha. Besides the physics major, you and I have the same problem and the same choices. I'd love to hear any advice for this, too.</p>

3

<p>Congragulations on having such wonderful choices. I don't know a lot about Princeton except that it is an Ivy league school and obviously has the cachet and prestige that go along with that. I have heard that it is quite preppy, but I am sure that there are all kinds of students there and you could be very happy. My child goes to U of Chicago and sounds a lot like you, so I can speak from that perspective. First of all, she is in her second year at Chicago and loves the school. She sings in three choirs there. There are four major choirs that I am familiar with, including the Rockefeller Chapel choir (church music), the Motet (the premier choir), the Russian choir and the overall University Choir. People enjoy them and there are people of varying musical levels in different choirs. They have several musical performance groups including a symphony and it sounds like you would fit right into one of them. The music department is primarily a theory, composition department, so the kids in the orchestra, etc. tend to play for the fun of it and it is not so intense. Academically, the school is well rounded with an emphasis on learning for learning sake, so people are not so grade oriented and tend to support each other and help one another. The core curriculum guarantees that your education is well rounded. Students tend to be less preppy and a little more intellectual, but there are all kinds of kids there as I am sure there are at Princeton. Athletics and fraternities are probably less important at Chicago than Princeton, but there is plenty of fun and tons of extra curricular activities and arts on campus. They are building a new 100 million dollar arts center, so the arts are certainly growing at Chicago. Princeton is not in an urban area. Chicago is. Do you want to be in a city? The Chicago campus is gorgeous and gothic like Princeton with beautiful quads and buildings, but much smaller than Princeton. Downtown Chicago is about 20 minutes away and the kids go there for things all the time. Still the campus has the oldest film society in the U.S., a wonderful professional theatre on campus and great musical concerts of all kinds. There is a strong international community with international house sponsoring all sorts of dinners and international events. I suggest that you go and see both campuses and make your mind up. I suspect that they are somewhat different and only you can tell what the better fit is for you.</p>

4

<p>P.S. Chicago has a very strong community service program with many of the students teaching children at local schools in Chicago. The University runs a program of schools called the lab schools for the children of Chicago and there are innumerable opportunities to tutor kids of all ages. There is also a fabulous new gymnasium complex on campus with opportunities for all kinds of intra mural sports.</p>

5

<p>Thanks for the prompt replies!</p>

<p>I actually visited Princeton for the Princeton Preview event last week, and this is the main reason I ask the question: before the visit I was leaning toward Chicago because I found it sounded more intellectually focused and had more of the quirky students I thought I would fit in with better. It sounded like Chicago was more collaborative as opposed to competitive, as well. But I was very surprised by how friendly, down-to-earth, and fantastic students at Princeton could be. The professors definitely helped me out as well, as the presentation with the chair of the physics department stressed that he simply does not allow a competitive nature to persist in his department, and he definitely has it as a high priority to force students to work together to succeed. I'm actually going to visit Chicago for the first time tomorrow, but I decided to post this ahead of time so that maybe I could get some ideas about what I want to look into at Chicago.</p>

<p>That's nice about the art center! I really would hate to lose my music because of a disinterested student body or underfunded school, but growth is a great sign. I'm actually not sure if I want to live in an urban area--I guess we'll see how I take to Chicago! I've never truly been in an urban area. I come from a suburban community in Southwest Florida, and so the Princeton town felt extremely familiar to me (in a good way).</p>

<p>(For the record, I am not at all into watching sports, so I am not at all phased by Chicago's lack of sports--in fact, I prefer it!)</p>

<p>Thanks again for the replies! Awfully tough choice.</p>

6

<p>I had to decide between Princeton and Chicago last year. I based my decision on the following things:</p>

<ol>
<li>Liked the town of Princeton better than Hyde Park</li>
<li>Princeton has a better math department (although Chicago's is very, very good)</li>
<li>Princeton students seemed to do a better job balancing academics, extracurriculars, and social life</li>
<li>Reputation</li>
</ol>

<p>Number 3 had the biggest effect on my decision. Princeton students are all very intelligent, but we are also laid back, and when we finish our work, we know how to have a good time.</p>

7

<p>JoeTrumpet, it really sounds like the criteria you describe could be fulfilled very well at either school... Of course, Princeton is absolutely top-notch at both physics and math, and from what I hear, kids in those majors especially get a lot of individualized attention simply because the hardness of each major whittles down the pool. I went to the 10-12 preview and talked to a sophomore girl who's a physics major, and she said that there truly is a collaborative atmosphere among the physics majors (think MIT-style). I'd say that if you want more of a balance between social life and academics (regardless of whether you party or not), Princeton will be the better place for you - there are tons of intellectual kids there, but the campus is <em>not</em> "where fun comes to die," as UChicago is notoriously self-described. </p>

<p>P.S. Contrary to what newenglandparent said, there is very little Greek life on Princeton's campus (it receives negligible support from the administration).</p>

8

<p>I grew up in south Florida, have studied for two degrees at the University of Chicago and now work there, and have a daughter who is a first year at Princeton.
You deserve congratulations for earning acceptance to two wonderful institutions. The academics are wonderful at both and you can't go seriously wrong with either.
The way you describe yourself, at first blush you may have more in common with U of C students. I would say that Princeton students have the image of being more social in conventional ways than Chicago students.
A major difference to me is that the U of C is much larger overall and an urban school. In spite of administration efforts to improve the undergraduate experience, the U of C is not a "touchy feely" sort of place. In my PhD program, none of the professors wanted to teach undergraduates, and were not shy about telling us graduate students this. It is difficult to quantify it, but in my experience at the U of C- going on 20 years- you are treated as an adult and are pretty much on your own. This can work for many people, of course.
Princeton has more of the feel of a small community and has layers of support systems and people whose job is to keep it that way. In some ways, by your Princeton admittance, you are one of the "anointed" and have nothing further to prove. I have called the University of Chicago the "marine corps of higher education".
I don't think the opinions I have necessarily point to either school for every person. I will say that I am very happy that my daughter is at Princeton.</p>

9

<p>I'm a current Princeton student, and, as far as social life goes, if you really do not want to ever go out or party, at Princeton there is very nice substance free housing, which tends to be very quiet, and usually is home to the group of kids that it seems like you are interested in being friends with.</p>

10

<p>Thanks so much for the replies, everyone!</p>

<p>Silver, I definitely plan to live in substance-free housing: it sounds perfect for me.</p>

<p>Danas, it's funny because a professor I spoke with at Chicago made it clear that Chicago is less "hand-holdy" than Princeton. I guess I'm a bit of a sensitive guy, so I might like that about Princeton, but Chicago's "tough love" seems like it might be a nice support method.</p>

<p>Echang, I really like that collaborative feel of Princeton's physics. Unfortunately I didn't see the sense of "family" in Chicago's physics department.</p>

<p>To whomever mentioned this earlier, I've decided that I prefer Princeton's campus to Chicago's. Chicago feels very submerged in the city, and staying in the farthest campus did not make that feel any better. Just my luck: the one dorm I didn't want is the one I was placed in!</p>

<p>Anyway, I just got back from the Chicago overnight program, and unfortunately my decision still hasn't been made. I very much enjoyed the core class I attended, and speaking with people from the physics department was very nice as well.</p>

<p>The main difference I noted between the schools, though, is the student body. I knew Chicago and Princeton attracted different students, but wow! It's kind of funny, because anyone who saw me would say I fit much better with Chicago kids (I'm told I'm very hard to forget because of how I look), but at the same time I don't know if that's the kind of environment I want or not. Chicago kids definitely seem more alternative while Princeton students seem more mainstream. Again, I have trouble knowing which group I fit into: in some ways I definitely have the more eccentric tastes, while in other ways I don't go too far. Chicago kids and Princeton kids were both friendly, but because Princeton kids tend to have a more social nature they went out of their way to make me feel comfortable, and that was a plus for Princeton.</p>

<p>So, the point of this post is to lead me a couple of questions about Princeton. First off, I absolutely loved the core class I attended: it was a small discussion group led by the professor, and the students were active, engaged and had interesting things to say about a subject like Kant and free will. Can anyone tell me how Princeton's classes compare to this? I want students who seem to truly enjoy what they're covering in class, especially when it's a subject more likely to go over someone's head.</p>

<p>Secondly, I suppose this is a more awkward question, but would you think that Princeton would definitely have enough of a presence of students who aren't quite as "mainstream" per say? I'll define that as people who, for example, listen to rather estoric music (for example, I listen to a modern jazz band called Orange Then Blue that is extremely unheard of), or have strong interests in subjects that aren't quite known amongst most people (very artsy films, for example)? These people tend to look different too :). I guess it's a strange question to ask, but I'm just curious because I like there to be more people like that, but I can't help but think that Princeton's not like that all and Chicago is just too deeply immersed into that. I am extremely nitpicky, I know, but I want to absolutely sure about my decision! :)</p>

<p>Also, seriously, Chicago students smoke more. Not cool at all.</p>

<p>After reading everything I've written, it's sounding like I lean more toward Princeton. Maybe I do. I'm not sure. Perhaps when the wind changes direction I'll lean toward Chicago, unfortunately.</p>

11

<p>Princeton has a freshman humanities sequence which covers the great books of Western civilization. It counts as the equivalent of two classes per semester and is probably the closest thing to Chicago's Core classes. The students in this program are extremely passionate about the subject and enthusiastically discuss topics that would go over the heads of some people. In addition there are freshman seminars devoted to a very specific and often unusual topic. I took a seminar in a subject which I have no interest in pursuing, and even I was very engaged of the material! All of this is to say that you will definitely be able to have close interaction with your professors and participate in meaningful and thought provoking discussions with your peers.</p>

<p>Although you are correct that Chicago students are more alternative, there is a sizable body of alternative students at Princeton. Most of them join Terrace Club, the very antithesis of what people stereotype an eating club to be. If you want to be a part of that scene, it's available, but you won't be constantly immersed in it as you go about your day. It's a nice balance.</p>

<p>Alternative students smoke more in general, so the greater prevalence of smoking at Chicago is just a function of the greater of alternative students there. People in Terrace probably smoke at about the same frequency (maybe a little more) as the general population at Chicago.</p>

12

<p>I can give you absolute 100% assurance that the small seminar classes at Princeton will, as we said in the '70s, blow your mind. Almost literally. My daughter has had the same experience. I took seminars in Dante, in Renaissance History, a course in History of Science, a preceptorial for of all things Philosophy 101, and above all a seminar in the Theory of Literary Criticism - to this day over 30 years later I can remember the feeling in my mind during those discussions as clearly as any other experience of the mind I have ever had.</p>

<p>I will never forget lying on my bed in my dorm room, reading my notes in the Theory of Lit Crit, drawing diagrams of the thought patterns of the various schools of criticism, honestly, I didn't look like a nerd in those days being blond and approximately the correct length and volume, but I had the sheer pure joy of nerds who love their subject matter. I still remember the way the lined notebook looked, my diagrams. I am not kidding you.</p>

<p>No one majors in the humanities at Princeton if they don't love it. No one is in those seminars if they don't look forward to them.</p>

<p>My daughter took a Religion course. She had Elaine Pagels as her precept leader. Google her if you like. My daughter came as an agnostic from a Catholic high school, so had a good background for the course. It was like bliss for her. And my daughter is a science major:).</p>

<p>I make you my personal guarantee that the academics at Princeton will be like the greatest drug you ever imagined - even in the substance-free dorms.......</p>

<p>As far as the alternative students, Shirley Tilghman is looking to grow that group, especially as they grow the arts community with the recent enormous donations. But you are right, more kids at Princeton are mainstream. Check out IAmNobody's posts. She/he chose Princeton over MIT precisely because he/she wanted to stretch social skills. You may or may not want that at this time in your life. Only you can know that.</p>

13

<p>You have done your homework very, very well.
I think you should go to Princeton.</p>

14

<p>After much serious consideration, a lot of stress, and slightly lower grades in high school because of my obsessing over this decision, I am now leaning strongly toward Princeton. It's a very surprising feeling, because throughout the entire year I felt the University of Chicago was my top choice, and it makes it even harder to reject the school because the admissions council gave me "special attention" to try to convince me to go. I absolutely love the University of Chicago, and am very glad that I spent so much time learning about this school. I believe my application for the University of Chicago had some of the best essays I've ever written, and the whole experience has served to broaden my ideas of what an education is and what an education can be.</p>

<p>Of course, I can't attend both schools (and my requests for the two schools to become one will almost surely go unheeded), so by a slight margin I must say that I will probably be attending Princeton University next fall. Thanks to everyone for all the great help! These two universities are, in my mind, the two best undergraduate experiences in the nation, and I am incredibly thankful to have the opportunity to choose between them, and to have a great online community to help me decide. Thanks again!</p>

15

<p>It's not the school you end up choosing that's important, but rather the fact that you put a lot of time and energy into exploring your decision. As the Chicago booster here, I'm insulted when students shrug off the school at first glance, but I'm never insulted when, after some consideration, somebody decides there's a better place. I think 90-95% of students in a similar situation to yours would have simply said, "Okay, I'm into Princeton, that's where I'm going to go" without considering other possibilities.</p>

<p>Princeton's a great place to be, and I'm very confident you will find people who are both like and unlike you!</p>

16

<p>Joe, you come across as a very very thoughtful person. I think you might have a wonderful four years in Princeton. Congratulations on your leanings, may they become a decision soon with all the accompanying relief and celebration.</p>

17

<p>I'd have to say that Princeton is the better all-around school, but when it comes to Physics, it simply doesn't have anything on U of Chicago. If you want to surround yourself with others who have the same passion as you, I say go to Chicago.</p>

18

<p>Actually physics is one of Princeton's strengths.....</p>

19

<p>Of the five posts made by "TheExploiter", all have been in _________ v. Princeton threads in various forums around CC, and each one has urged the student to not go to Princeton. I'm not sure that's a superbly reliable source of information.</p>

<p>To the OP: first of all, you've got some great choices and can't go wrong either way! I think you'd be pretty happy at either U of Chicago or Princeton. On my part, as a student at Princeton, I want to echo the comments of some of the other posters - you'll find plenty of quirky people here on campus and a very welcoming community on the whole. You needn't worry too much about this.</p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

20

<br>


<br>