Pro Choice at Fordham?

Colleges and Universities A-Z Fordham University
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<p>I am super excited to have been admitted to Fordham, and after reviewing the website (have not gotten a chance to visit yet unfortunately!) it is becoming more and more appealing to me.
However, with Fordham as a Jesuit university, it considers itself, understandably, pro-life. I had accepted that, but did not realize that this meant that it would not even allow a pro-choice group on campus. This happens to be an issue of some importance to me.
That being said, I was wondering how much one could "feel" this influence, and the influence of the Catholic church as a whole on campus -- specifically its more conservative stance on some social issues, like pro-life vs pro-choice.
I love the Jesuit commitment to social justice and community service. It was something that attracted me to Fordham. But now I'm having some hesitations. I would love for some insight on this, as many posters on this forum seem so knowledgeable and helpful.</p>

<p>I also really hope this doesn't spark any kind of political debate - I am not trying to determine if the atmosphere regarding this issue is "right" or "wrong," just objective opinions on how a pro-choice student's opinions will be received -- if there is any room for discussion on this issue on campus.
Thanks so much.</p>

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<p>Fordham supports debate and dialogue, even about issues that, as a Catholic school, it has taken formal stances on. While no official pro-choice club exists at Fordham, there have been pro-choice speakers on campus. Some clubs have also sponsored events that challenge the pro-life point of view. For example, during last year’s “pro-life week” events that Fordham’s Respect for Life club hosted, some clubs and students protested through informational materials, fliers, and discussions. </p>

<p>Fordham (and other Catholic schools) cannot support official pro-choice clubs because it cannot allocate money towards an act that the Catholic Church equates with murder. However, as an academic institution, Fordham will not silence those who may have differing opinions. There are many Fordham students and faculty members (and yes, even some priests) who are pro-choice or who hold views that challenge those that the Catholic Church currently espouses. </p>

<p>Please let me know if you’d like more clarification about this issue or more information about how Fordham’s Catholic identity shapes Fordham as an institution.</p>

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<p>My S is a junior at Fordham would be of the same opinion as yenrod. The Jesuits are there to educate, not to force their beliefs on anyone. Debate is encouraged.</p>

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<p>And while debate is encouraged and solicited, students should know that they do not shape the doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church, and as such, must be mindful and respectful of what the Church teaches, even if they respectfully disagree. That is to say that tolerance is a two way street, not a one way street. (A common misperception, from my perspective). </p>

<p>So while the University faculty and administration are respectful and tolerant of your views and opinions, you should be respectful and mindful of theirs. And particularly sensitive to the fact that being a Roman Catholic institution, it will follow Church teaching officially. Sometimes tension on issues is healthy and good, and sometimes that tension evolves to positive change. But it is also true that sometimes change is not possible because to do so would be contrary to the fundamental beliefs and teachings of the Church. Thus, people respectfully disagree and move along. </p>

<p>Nor is Fordham a “one trick pony”, meaning its not fixated on this one issue. In fact, I don’t believe its a major point of contention, i.e. a flash point with students or faculty. It may come up from time to time, but its not a huge issue. Perhaps because legalized abortion is the law of the land, and Fordham respects civil law. There may be Jesuits or other religious teaching at Fordham who voice the Church position of strong disagreement and disapproval of that civil law, on moral grounds, but that is all.</p>

<p>Just as Notre Dame invited the President, a pro choice politician, to speak at their commencement two years ago, sparking controversy around the country. </p>

<p>The main point for any non Catholic or non Christian or dare I say, Pro Choice Catholic, is that Fordham is an open and tolerant institution of higher education, with Jesuit heritage, ethics and ethos. Each person is valued independently. Nor does it mean that Fordham’s faculty and administration is all ‘in sync’ privately with Church teachings, just as many Fordham faculty are not even Catholic. You may be surprised at who would be in agreement with your personal views. All we ask (those Catholics here on CC and among the Fordham family who support Church teaching on the subject) is that you come to Fordham with an open mind, full of your respectful ideas, tolerant of others as you wish them to be tolerant of you. Nobody at Fordham will force you to believe anything or follow doctrinal teachings. Nor one belief system. Fordham is a diverse community.</p>

<p>We welcome you to Fordham, particularly those who practice tolerance of all points of view. Tolerance does not mean everyone will agree with you, only they respect your right to your opinion.</p>

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<p>I think h2olovr understands the concept of tolerance. There was nothing in his/her post that indicated a lack of respect for differing opinions. </p>

<p>But Ghostbuster is correct in saying that Fordham is not a “one trick pony” fixated on abortion, probably because it is “the law of the land.” It’s usually only when Fordham’s Respect for Life club is particularly vocal about the anti-abortion movement that students/clubs will enter debate over the issue. Respect for Life itself isn’t even fixated on abortion, as it frequently hosts events about the death penalty, euthanasia, human trafficking, genocide, etc. The point is that (in my opinion) pro-choice students don’t usually feel the need to defend abortion against “Fordham University” itself and its administration; rather, pro-choice students usually only need to respond to fellow students who oppose abortion. </p>

<p>In my opinion, LGBTQ issues are much more visible points of debate on Fordham’s campus. But again, it’s usually not a matter of students needing to respond to Fordham University being anti-LGBTQ (which it is not), but rather responding to the general intolerance of LGBTQ individuals in society as a whole. In fact, you may be surprised at how supportive of LGBTQ students Fordham is; the University itself (in addition to students) has made an official effort to support the acceptance of LGBTQ students on campus and in society, all while remaining in accordance with Catholic teaching.</p>

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<p>I didnt say the OP had any lack of respect for tolerance. I simply made a statement that tolerance is a two way street. Frequently, from my personal experience and what I hear from others anecdotally, people with views that are contrary to Church teachings are quite demanding about being respected with their views, but often don’t share that same level of tolerance for the Church or those who support the Church. So I was simply asking for mutual tolerance. I also stated overtly that tension is sometimes good in discussions, to bring about change, except of course where change is not possible. </p>

<p>I don’t know what the LGBT discussion has to do with this thread, by the way. But whatever. There is tolerance for those views as well, and a strong level of support for students complaining of intolerance in the dorms, as I have known ResLife to move students out of dorm rooms to get away from intolerant people.</p>

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<p>h2olovr: I was also admitted to Fordham and am seriously considering going. I STRONGLY believe in a woman’s right to choose and no one will ever influence me otherwise. I am extremely liberal in ALL of my social views. There is a club at Fordham called the Democrats of Fordham (or something like that), so I’m sure there are people in that club who will agree with you on the issue of abortion. I know I’m definitely joining that group if I attend Fordham, lol.</p>

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<p>Thank you for all your opinions! This and speaking with some friends, teachers, and others who have attended or are attending a Catholic / Jesuit universities, it is definitely setting my mind at ease with regard to this issue. </p>

<p>iLoveNewYork15: Agreed, haha. A friend of mine who attends Boston College told me that their Young Dems branch has sort of “unofficial subsections” which often hold views that contradict the official policies of the school. She’s quite liberal and told me that she does not feel that the Jesuit tradition undermines her beliefs, and in fact the emphasis on social justice / community service more often allows her to express her beliefs than suppresses them. So I guess we’re in luck if we choose Fordham! :)</p>

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<p>also @yenrod - I will definitely let you know if I have more questions, especially as decision time draws nearer. Thanks so much!</p>

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<p>If you want an unorthodox political club, check out: </p>

<p>[Fordham</a> Young Americans for Liberty](<a href=“Facebook - log in or sign up”>Facebook - log in or sign up)</p>

<p>The group is essentially fiscally conservative and socially liberal. But anyone is welcome.</p>

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<p>Oooh, libertarianism too? Interesting – though as of right now that does not align with my beliefs, I guess college is THE time to learn and explore new viewpoints! ^^</p>

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<p>I’d like to see a socially conservative and fiscally liberal club…</p>

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<p>Meg: There are plenty of conservatives at Fordham. It is overall a fairly apolitical campus, meaning its not a hotbed of activism. But political groups exist and they have clubs and guest speakers. Newt Gingrich came two years ago. Larry Kudlow also came. People get along at Fordham and generally exhibit mutual respect. There are also conservative faculty and a few conservative Jesuits on campus. Its a very diverse campus.</p>

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<p>Haha, I was just making a joke(ish). I don’t identify as either strictly conservative, or liberal. I’m Catholic and most of my beliefs seem to align themselves as socially conservative and fiscally liberal.</p>

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<p>Great…my comments werent trying to label you or paint you in a corner. I was offering suggestions so that you can find what you want at “Alices Restaurant.”</p>

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<p>Perhaps soon… A Socialist club.</p>

<p>Anyway, as to the topic at hand, I would agree that the University could not support a pro-choice group as, in Catholic eyes, that would be a pro-murder group. Thus, the suppression of such a group by a Catholic university is warranted. However, this certainly does not entail a suppression of ideals or opinions, as long as the University does not fund groups that encourage the practice of what they (and I) see as the murder of an innocent human life.</p>

<p>Again, as other posters have noted, the always pro-life standard of Catholicism leads to ideas across the political spectrum, including anti-abortion, anti-death-penalty, anti-hunger, anti-homelessness, et cetera. Being in New York City, and amidst the Jesuits, I feel that there will be little want for diversity of culture, belief, and mind.</p>

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<p>I just wanted to add my thoughts and experiences on this issue. </p>

<p>I live in the Philippines( Majority of population is Conservative Roman Catholic), I’m Catholic and I attend a Jesuit High School but I also attended a Dominican School for my grade school (elementary). I am very passionate about politics, especially issues like this. I’m a liberal, and in my school, I think I can only count with my fingers those with similar ideas.</p>

<p>Given that, the Jesuits in my school (Who have also taken up college, masters and even doctorates at schools like Fordham and Gtown) and, as I have experienced during inter-school visits and tournaments, Jesuits at other schools, treat the vocal liberal minority with respect and even encouragement who are unlike the Dominicans (at least in the Philippines), and other orders of priests (again based from inter-school debates, observations etc.)</p>

<p>The Jesuits for me have been educated to be largely tolerant of others. To be respectful. As one friend said, "Christs with the small ‘c’ ". The Society of Jesus is really a unique order, and I am really impressed by them. I can also attribute the gradual rebirth and subsequent strengthening of my Catholic faith to the Jesuits and the aura surrounding them (how they teach, how they view others etc.)</p>

<p>With that, I can say that I want my “Jesuit Experience” to continue as I start college- that’s why I mostly applied to Jesuit Catholic Schools. Seeing how Jesuits in the Philippines treat pro-choice, liberal people with respect when condemning them and joining the majority of the nation would be easier and more “conventional”, I can infer that Jesuits schools like Fordham would really tolerate and even celebrate the political and social diversity in campus. In the end, I can infer based from all I’ve said that IT IS BECAUSE OF, and “not in spite of”, the Jesuits that schools like my high school (which is incidentally the number one HS here, and the number one University in the county, 250+ in the world- again because of the Jesuit foundation) and even Fordham that pro-choice, liberal peeps would really be welcomed would even thrive in such a community.</p>

<p>Hope my background could help you- even if just a little :slight_smile: good luck!</p>

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<p>To OP-It is from my understanding that the Jesuit order is very open to any beliefs.</p>

<p>I myself am a Pro-Life Catholic and strongly discourage abortion, but I value your opinion of giving women the choice. Catholic means “universal.” There is a reason why you think women should be given the choice, and I respect that. In return, I would expect you to respect my opinion as well.</p>

<p>Fordham is a place for intelligent young people to gather and become educated adult citizens. The Jesuit school motto, “Men and Women for others,” should apply to everyone going to Fordham, whether it be a Catholic, Christian, Atheist, Hindu, etc. </p>

<p>Overall, I think you will see a spiritual population at Fordham with ranging views from extreme left to extreme right. Please go there for the education and learning experience, and don’t base your decision on the political norm.</p>

<p>You will be welcomed at Fordham regardless of your opinion on abortion, and I hope you keep an open mind and respect the pro-life population. It is a sensitive issue, and there are reasons people have strong opinions about them.</p>

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<p>I really appreciate everyone’s insightful and interesting comments. Thank you so much.</p>

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<p>no problem, I hope it helps make your decision! I had a gut feeling that the Jesuits are the most left-winged order in context of other Catholic orders. :-)</p>