<p>Why is this permissable? I feel as though I'm broaching a taboo subject, but enough is enough. My friend's daughter just had a final chemistry exam, all who took it were terribly upset as they had not been able to understand a word this prof spoke all semester. We pay the big bucks for our kid's education, but have no say in much of anything that goes on there, and often don't know until the class is over. You never see an advertisement for any college that X % of their professors are masters of their subject, but can't communicate that to their students because of a language barrier. Perhaps they should have translators for their classes.
I do not mean to sound unaccepting; I strongly believe that iternational diversity strengthens our country in all areas. But there are two areas we should insist on English-speaking leaders - our professors and our doctors. In college, the time they have is too precious, the choice of classes are too important, & the cost of education too high for this to be acceptable. As for Doctors, it's a personal choice to stay with that doctor or not: it's too difficult to switch colleges. will this ever change?</p>
<p>It’s not a taboo subject; it’s been discussed often on CC. Why is this permissible? Because there aren’t enough Americans pursuing PhDs in STEM fields to fill all the TA positions in most big schools. And because all too many PhDs in STEM fields opt out of academia to pursue higher salaries, and avoid the publish-or-perish stress of tenure, by going to the private sector instead. </p>
<p>You mean the professor can’t speak English? Or the students don’t know how to listen to someone with an accent?</p>
<p>swimom, I agree. In fact my son crossed off a small college because there was only 1 professor who taught the required courses for his major. He sat in on her class and could not understand a word she said. Ordinarylives, it isn’t necessarily that students do not know how to listen (although that may or may not be true depending on the student). In my son’s case, his younger brother was adopted from a foreign country and spoke no English when he came home. On top of that, he has severe developmental delays and has very poor articulation and mastery of grammar. My son definitely knows how to listen - but hadn’t a clue of what this particular professor was saying. I think swimom has a valid point.</p>
<p>All of the profs can read/speak English… it is the accent that is an issue. It seems more common for STEM profs. Luckily much of the STEM classes deal with writing formulas on the board. Still it is tough… I remember the frustration. </p>
<p>My husband had a professor once who only said two words in English and those were “f$&@ you”. So the guy would enter the class, begin writing all over the board, talking in what was assumed to be his native toungue, then turn to the class and say “f$&@ you” - not as an insult, but like it was helpful. Now, my husband was a non traditional student, having entered college on a ROTC scholarship after 5 years in the Navy - after two days of this teachers nonsense, my husband marched into the Dean’s office and demanded an explanation. This happened at a large state university, so you might think he had no recourse, however the Dean listened and agreed to sit in on the class. The Dean did sit in on the class. When my husband came to the next class he found that the previous instructor was gone and the Dean informed everyone that he would be teaching the class. Other than my husband, no other students had complained and they probably never would have complained to anyone who could resolve the problem. I think your typical 18 or 19 year old doesn’t realize they can speak up and complain when there really is an issue.</p>
<p>It’s a real problem that students on the receiving end of incomprehensible spoken English don’t demand a teacher who can verbally communicate. Many instructors with heavily accented English need “accent reduction” and colleges, as employers, or the profs themselves, could procure this as critical professional development. Well, sometimes students do post warnings to other students on Rate My Professor (grains of salt needed). Basically, I don’t think most student know how much they’re paying — really big bucks — for a course, especially at private NFP schools. So, they blame themselves for not understanding, are fearful of being culturally offensive if they say anything, and complain only once they take the F.</p>
<p>It’s a shame that accent reduction isn’t a required class, because I think usually that’s the really the problem, not that the professors can’t speak English. I had an Austrian professor and remember finding him hard to follow the first class I sat in on, but I got used to it and he ended up being my favorite professor and thesis adviser. But I think for Americans European accents are usually easier to follow than Asian ones. Maybe it has something to do with tonal vs non-tonal languages?</p>
<p>It’s hard for Asians to master English (and vice versa!) Especially for relative newcomers to the US. </p>
<p>OP, I would suggest your daughter talk with her classmates. If they’re all in agreement that the instructor’s accent is too hard to understand, and that it’s affecting their ability to learn in the class, it may be time to speak to someone in the chemistry department. It’s probably not the first time the school’s had to deal with such an issue, if they regularly employ foreign teachers. </p>
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<p>A lot of Asians know English well already. But they are often from places where English is a commonly spoken language, at least in school (e.g. India, Hong Kong, Singapore, etc.).</p>
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<p>Perhaps that is an advantage of a large department – there is more likely to be a choice of instructors, and courses are more likely to be offered frequently (so that a student does not have to take a given course now or never). Yes, the classes can be large, but they also usually come with TAs, so the chance of getting both a difficult-to-understand (not necessarily because of accent issues) faculty member and a difficult-to-understand TA is lower than the chance of getting one difficult-to-understand instructor.</p>
<p>What? There isn’t already an app for that? With all the text-to-speech and translation software out there you’d think someone would come up with software that translates heavily accented English into standard English!</p>
<p>It is not a matter of total lack of English speaking candidates for STEM tenure-track assistant professor positions. I bet virtually 100% of positions advertised have more than one ‘qualified’ US citizen English-speaking candidate, with a relevant PhD and some level of publications. The issue is that the search committee and department may well emphasize the best possible research record and research potential, and downplay the importance of teaching. Or assume the accent will improve rapidly with teaching experience. Basically, they are not hiring teachers, and they don’t have education degrees they have research degrees.</p>
<p>S1 dropped Calculus 1 first semester of freshman year because the instructor’s English was impossible to understand. S1 was failing the class even though he had already taken AP Calc AB in h.s( junior yr.). and scored a 4 on the exam. He was taking the calc.I class for a refresher. </p>
<p>He decided to go straight to Calc II in the spring sem. Had an American instructor and made a B in the class. </p>
<p>There is a huge qualitative difference between listening and understanding. Listening is easy; yet, understanding maybe impossible. Students are in college to understand and learn, not just listen.</p>
<p>Additionally, there is this aspect - if I am paying $60,000/year to a college, I expect it to work for my kid. Colleges are a business in that regard, and I have expect my money to be spent in a way, which fully benefits my kids. My kids go to college to get an education, and specifically, I am not paying to be part of any social or hiring experiment. </p>
<p>The product, i.e., courses, should be presented in away the consumer is not shorted, and in fact, the consumer should be satisfied. If the college cannot do as much, then give me my money back or at least a discount. I feel really bad for the kids who take out loans and get this sort of thing - it is really not fair to them, as they get shorted and then shave to pay interest on the shortage. </p>
<p>I once was responsible for classes taught by TA’s, their independent classes. I had undergraduates complaining about British and Australian accents. When I taught in Chicago, I had to work to change from my Boston accent as undergraduates didn’t understand that. Undergraduates have a hard time hearing accents, and it is a necessary skill for them to acquire.</p>
<p>Virtually all universities require a 50-55 on the SPEAK test before a non-native speaker can teach as a TA. Of course there are exceptions, but for the most part, much of the complaining comes from undergraduates who would have a hard time whoever taught the course. </p>
<p>^^ I can definitely see a parent thinking that I am the one writing checks and part of the deal was not that my kid has to navigate language for a course, which is not a language course. </p>
<p>Acquiring a skill is one thing, but if I am paying the bill, my kid should be able to choose when he learns a particular skill. My kid has never had this issue, but I can darn sure see how it would trouble a parent and student.</p>
<p>And this concept that it is a kid who would have trouble anyway is a non sequitur, and holds no basis. How about the more relevant, elegant explanation - I speak English and while I do need to understand others with other accents in my field, learning the fundamental information in my field should be done so I maximize my learning. I can learn to negotiate accents later when it does not affect my ability to learn fundamental concepts. </p>
<p>It’s a problem from the days of yore. When I went to my college reunion, ran into an old classmate from chem lab. He said to me, about the TA from that class, "yeah, the little s**t, with bad breath, who didn’t speak a word of English. Not at all unusual in a research university, and a lot of people complained, sent petitions to the Dean, it was in the school paper as a regular issue.</p>
<p>Even worse than the not speaking understandable English was that during the recitiatons, some of these foreign students had no idea how the class itself was being taught, what info was when. They regarded the teaching as a nuisance to be born and the school felt no obligation to train them. They couldn’t understand the questions asked well, were not familiar with the specific material at hand (though geniuses in the subject overall), some had not had the low level courses in a decade, and we couldn’t understand their answers anyways. They also had no understanding of the US culture and the way things worked for undergrads in an American college. It’s a disgrace that this is allowed, and it still is.</p>
<p>I grew up surrounded by accents and I can understand people better than the average student. I often had classmates complain they couldn’t understand the prof when they really meant that they couldn’t understand them while multitasking with facebook and texting. </p>
<p>I think it’s an overblown problem.</p>
<p>It’s one thing when a few students in a large class have problems understanding the teacher because of an accent. They might be from areas where they haven’t heard many foreign accents or they may have issues with auditory learning. It’s another thing altogether when MANY of the students can’t understand. In the second situation, the students should get together and talk to a dean about it.</p>
<p>romanig - Not everyone like you has grown up around accents, so for you to take your life around accents and then deduce others are overblowing this issue makes no sense.</p>