I fully agree with OP @OldbatesieDoc : “I wouldn’t recommend anyone serious about athletics waste their ED pick without a slot.” And this is the crucial point… one must verify with the coach that the slot (or full support) is understood and confirmed.
Every peer athlete of my son with a slot gained admittance via EDI, whether at Amherst, Williams, Middlebury, or Bowdoin (none was deferred, none was rejected). In contrast, I’m aware of students with less definitive support (e.g. “tips”) who did not not gain admittance to some of these schools. Knowing this, my son accepted Bowdoin’s “slot” over Pomona’s encouraging but less definitive support.
In conclusion, this doesn’t appear to be a Bowdoin problem. Anything less than a slot in NESCAC leaves one vulnerable (varying by sport or year). At the same time, this is not to say every NESCAC “tip” is doomed… but a mere tip would leave me uneasy.
I let S handle most of the conversations, but this area is one where I confirmed what was meant with the coach and didn’t rely on a 17 year old’s impression of what the coach meant. The only offer I didn’t confirm came with a specific dollar amount and also was from a school that was at that point probably plan C so I didn’t think it was necessary to call.
We only talked seriously with one NESCAC coach (Williams). We never got to the point of an actual offer, but i asked him what % of guys he got in that he gave offers to. He said he would never ask S to apply ED unless he was positive he would get in. He said he was 100% on his 4-5 recruiting classes getting guys like S in (assuming a positive preread). I assume that meant that at least for that coach, he only asked for ED when he was using a slot.
My guess is that it has more to do with the individual coach than the school. But this is an area where I think it is important to get involved as a parent, and to ask very pointed questions. Although TBH, in OP’s case with his daughter’s stats, I probably would have not been worried and done the same thing they did.
As highlighted by the experiences of @OldbatesieDoc (so sorry about what your family went through) and our DD, anything less than a slot puts the student at risk of disappointment, notwithstanding any other encouragement the coach offers. I would add that other NESCAC coaches our DD was dealing with (particularly Midd and Hamilton) were much more forthcoming. The only reason I shared our own experience was to caution families about the illusory level of comfort engendered by a Bowdoin coach initially saying they would help a student get through admissions if they needed it. Best wishes to all who are currently going through the athletic recruiting and college application process.
I feel the generally thoughtful, helpful and well-meaning responses will help others make their ED decisions, which was why I posted this thread in the first place.
I have dealt now with over 20 NESCAC, newmac, centennial and Ivy coaches in 2 different sports for men and women.
Some were incredibly honest and helpful, and others, downright dishonest and without scruples.
I also have found the wisdom of this group to be invaluable. Neither of my children would have gotten safely thru the arduous process without the help of this group.
An admissions counselor for another academically selective school told me this about ED deferrals-“we don’t defer unless we are pretty sure we will accept the student at RD, because we are thinking about the well-being of the student.”
That’s what Bowdoin didn’t do, and what I find if not reprehensible, less than upstanding. The AdCom knew my DD wanted to play her sport enough to take a chance. With her stats, of course she would be accepted elsewhere. They also absolutely have to be aware that most student-athletes have other options where they would be better off applying ED 2. I believe they were acting in the most self-serving way possible not to reject her outright so she could move on. Instead, she had to go thru being rejected twice.
The coach was not dishonest. We thought her odds were about 80%, and went into that with eyes open. That’s why I post my DDs academic stats as well-so others can compare and estimate their odds.
However, what I want other female athletes from the NE to know is that the odds are likely considerably less, and if you are deferred, consider it a likely rejection instead of a likely eventual acceptance.
Thanks!
@OldbatesieDoc That’s very interesting that you have heard that a deferral at ED turns into an acceptance at RD. Our counselors and some ex admissions folks we have heard speak say exactly the opposite, that mot deferrals end up in WL or denials.
Similar thing happened to us at Williams, but luckily I knew what questions to ask. My daughter for 2 years was told by the coach she was the #1 recruit. Many, many emails back and forth. Offered her a slot on the team about a month ago. The coach never did a pre-read, or asked for any of her scores. Nothing. So my daughter emailed him and asked him if he was planning to do a pre-read, because she wanted to make sure she was cleared with admissions, as Williams is a very hard school to be accepted into. He responded “oh, good idea, send me your information.” And then she made the crucial mistake of telling him that she planned on applying for financial aid. As soon as those words left her mouth, he became very upset and said she should have told him this from the beginning, and lo and behold, 2 days later her pre-read was denied. I have learned so much and it is a very ugly process. Luckily, some other great schools have offered slots. Bowdoin reached out to her today, but we are being very cautious. Thanks for all the great info!
Haverford! And she is very happy there, and 3 hours closer to home! @midwesternmomof4 wow, close call. Williams is the school that was totally dishonest with my son (for 2 years)
Fwiw, from what I’ve seen, way more ED deferrals (general population ) result in rejections or WL in the RD round than acceptances. But a handful do turn into acceptances in RD or off the WL. The odds are against you but not impossible.
But if you are an athlete and are playing your best hand upfront, I would think that your best shot is in the ED round and if the news isn’t good then, there is little reason to assume it’ll improve with the passage of a few months’ time.
This is a great thread. I am going through the recruiting process again with S2, a basketball athlete. He’s targeting D3 schools. He got a verbal offer for a visit to a NEWMAC school but no request for transcript, school profile or senior schedule. Now he is on NCSA with all his scores and videos posted on there. The coach has scoured his profile a few times, exchanged emails and texts and more recently had a conference call with me and son to extend a visit in October. Should I be concerned that no preread was requested? I didn’t bring up the issue during the call as we wanted to nail down a date for the visit and I figured the conversation about a slot, ED and such would take place after everyone meets in person.
OTOH, W&L emailed and text my son with expressed interest. He asked for above mentioned documents which my son supplied and followed up with a couple of emails but no response.
I’m not as sure with basketball. What year is your son? W&L didn’t request official paperwork until after our visit. Some schools requested prior. You could ask the coach about a pre-read?
@calsmom I am only familiar with one school in the NEWMAC (MIT) and they don’t conduct pre-reads. If your son is interested in another school in the NEWMAC, I would ask the coach if pre-reads are conducted. Good luck to your son.
@BrianBoiler he’s a senior CO 2019. My son plans on emailing W&L coach one more time to close the loop to see if he should just move on. Otherwise he’s going to concentrate on having a good visit with the other D3 school. @shuttlebus thank you. The school is Clark University and so far our dealings with them have been very pleasant and the follow up prompt. Saw lots of videos of the school, the team and dorms. So far so good. I’ve scoured the Clark threads on here too, some mixed feedback on the city of Worcester but I’d like to see for myself. My son’s not picky just wants a solid education and a chance to play college ball.
Yes- Williams was very dishonest with us as well. I’m glad I had some great advice and finally knew what questions to ask. And BTW, need-blind at Williams is a total lie. They expect certain athletes from “wealthy” sports to be full-pay. This was told to my face.
@shuttlebus
“MIT does not conduct pre-read”, what does it mean? Asking because my DS20 is just filling out MIT’s recruited athletes questionnaire (he is a club swimmer). Thank you.
@makemesmart A “pre-read” is when the coach forwards a student’s transcript and standardized test scores to the admissions office. (This usually occurs after July 1st between junior and senior year of high school.) The admissions office will then let the coach know if the student is given the “green-light”, meaning the student meets the academic criteria of the admissions office.
This pre-screening process does not take place at MIT.
July 1st before the senior year is the first day on which potential applicants can be informed of the results of the pre-read. For some sports (like men’s lacrosse), many of the slots are quickly given away starting on July 1st. This implies that you should be making your NESCAC contacts well prior to July 1sr, which is very early in the process. Slots are numerically limited so it may be impossible to snag one if you have delayed making contacts with the coach . .“Tips” (A-band) are, I think, not numerically limited but of course carry less weight in the admissions process . . It is unfortunate that information about the real deadlines for athletes and the real meaning of tips and slots is not forthrightly disclosed by either the NESCAC or is member schools . . And if the athlete’s application slips to the RD phase, chances are there will be no slots left due to the numerical limits. Finally, not all sports are created equal, with some having just 1 slot . . Again, it is almost never known how many slots your sport has . . So a tough and mysterious process that is learned by students and their parents on the fly . .