<p>My S has been admitted to Stanford and Williams. He would, no doubt, do well at either place. The decision seems to be between the quality of life that Stanford offers and the access to profs that Williams offers. Specifically, for someone who loves sports and sun, being able to shoot hoops, play tennis, participate in ultimate frisbee and ride a bike in the sun year-round is very appealing. I do believe that the climate and the ability to get out and about affects one's attitude. We live on the West coast, though in the rainy part (!), so STanford is definitely closer than Williams. Williams certainly has a greater focus on undergrads and the attention he would receive is one of the reasons he applied in the first place. Since my S doesn't know what he wants to do, having faculty advisors is appealing. But it certainly is cold and isolated in that neck of the woods.... Any thoughts?</p>
<p>I have lived in California, for almost 20 years, and on the East Coast; and have gone to school in California (Stanford) and the East Coast (Wellesley). The East Coast cannot win the weather battle with Stanford (except for the unbelievably wonderful fall weather and foliage). However, please be assured that cold does not = nothing to do/isolation and cabin fever. He will find a vibrant community at a small East Coast LAC, spring, fall and winter. So, don't let the fact that Williams has winter and is in a smaller town be a deterrent. I wouldn't call it isolated.</p>
<p>Is your S very likely to be adversely affected by winter weather and a delayed feeling of spring? </p>
<p>When I was in college, we had a suicide during the winter months; and every February when we had lots of sleet and ice and dark days, the overall campus atmosphere was generally glum. Some students found it difficult to function at their top form until spring set in. This was a LAC in the South, so spring for us was March. When D was in school in NM, real spring was a month or more later. </p>
<p>Some people are not much affected, at least not seriously, by the weather, but others find a long, cold winter truly debilitating.</p>
<p>Your son will have faculty advisors at Stanford as well (though they will not be going and looking for him). Having close relationship with profs is possible at Stanford, but it requires some effort and initiative.
Williams is a great school, but for someone who "loves sports and sun, being able to shoot hoops, play tennis, participate in ultimate frisbee and ride a bike in the sun year-round" being at Williams during the winter might feel like an exile in Siberia.</p>
<p>Hi. Lhasa, my son probably wouldn't get depressed from the winter weather. He does like to ski. He visited Williams in the winter and was favorably disposed. And I appreciate the comment that Williams is not isolated, just because it's cold. I wonder whether STanford gets the "laid-back" reputation because so many people are outside throwing frisbees, etc.</p>
<p>For what its worth, my nephew graduated from Williams 10 years ago...He had a mentor in the science dept. who corresponds with him to this day...helped him navigate the grad school application process, and became a good friend. A wonderful experience for him.</p>
<p>Dke, that's what makes Williams attractive. It really does seem like a toss-up. Both of these qualities are important. I guess, though, that while you can't change the weather at Williams; you can understand the types of challenges that a research institution presents for undergrads -- and then try to overcome them with initiative.</p>
<p>From Williams he got into one of the top grad school programs in his field...has more work than he can handle.</p>
<p>oops! By "work" I mean employment opportunities, not grad school work....he's been out for several years....He credits what Williams gave him for most of it.</p>
<p>Glad you clarified that, Dke. Because I was wondering whether faculty access is more important to achievement focussed students, whereas quality of life (weather, etc.) might be more important to students who want a balance of work, social, fitness, etc.</p>
<p>I remember reading a post a while back on the forum from a guy who had gone to Williams and loved it, while his friends who went to Harvard weren't as enthused; apparently that had expected the Williams experience but with more prestige, instead they got some of the large-U scenario.</p>
<p>This has always stuck in my mind. I don't know what college experience your son wants in terms of small classes, attention from faculty, etc., but he does have 2 choices that differ here on that aspect. I guess the ideal school would be Williams in Palo Alto, but in real life we have to make compromises.</p>
<p>I wonder if the whole "research opportunities" thing is overrated at the undergrad level......not sure about that...I guess it would look pretty good on a grad school application.</p>
<p>Maybe it's not the research opportunities that are so important, but an adult who takes an interest in you. Someone you can turn to for advice about what to do with your life. Or is that just too idealistic a view of "access to profs?"</p>
<p>I can't vouch for all liberal arts colleges, but I think the orientation is more towards what you're talking about as opposed to the "publish or perish" mentality found at the big research unis.</p>
<p>Mikemac, I think the large U vs. LAC dilemma is a little bit different from the large U+quality of life vs. LAC dilemma. Cambridge (and more broadly, Boston) offers a vibrant cultural, city scene. I may be mistaken, but I don't think that one of Harvard's often-cited strengths is that it offers students a good quality of life.</p>
<p>For what it's worth, I just checked Princeton Review online and saw that Stanford is rated #3 for "Happy Students" (How happy students are with their lives outside the classroom, on a scale of 80-99. We weighed several factors, including students' assessments of: their overall happiness; the beauty, safety, and location of the campus; the comfort of dorms; the quality of food; the ease of getting around campus and dealing with administrators; the friendliness of fellow students; the interaction of different student types; and the quality of the relationship with the local community.) It's also rated #5 for Best quality of life overall. Williams is rated as having a beautiful campus and dorms like palaces -- I'm sure those things contribute to quality of life too!</p>
<p>I have a daughter who is currently a junior at Stanford. She has developed very close working relationships with two faculty members in her area of interest. One was able to secure her a summer research job in Australia this past summer; it was a very personal connection and she ended up spending many nights with the Australian researcher/physician and his family. Close working relationships are very do-able there. The students, despite the "laid-back" picture of frisbee-throwing on lawns, are quite intense and intellectual. My daughter has commented that students want to seem more laid-back than they really are (Type A's in Type B clothing). :)</p>
<p>senhora, Congratulations to your son for two wonderful choices! My son is a sophomore at Williams. We are an American family that lives in Southeast Asia so the weather contrast is about as extreme as you can get and still be on the same planet. Some days there is a 100 degree F difference in temperature!</p>
<p>My son LOVES the weather in the Berkshires. The kids have a great time in the snow -- for skiing, snowboarding, cross country, sledding, snow trekking, skating and just fooling around. The kids are very active and the long winter doesn't slow them down. Cold weather clothes have progressed so much since we were kids. They are light weight and warm. You just throw them on and go.</p>
<p>The quality of education is insanely good at both Williams and Stanford, so there's no bad choice; however, the difference in teaching style between an LAC and a big university is signifcant. Many of my son's highschool friends go to Stanford and love it, but for my son, Williams was (and is) the best of all possible options. He's flourishing in the intimate environment, close contact with his professors, the friendly and supportive attitude of his peers. </p>
<p>I think your phrase an "adult who takes an interest in you" perfectly sums up the attitude of Williams faculty and administration. They are first and foremost teachers (although they may also be PhD's, authors, researchers, lecturers, and experts in their fields). They are there for the kids and they REALLY are accessible.</p>
<p>I think "isolation" is a misleading term for Williams (and Siberia is just downright silly). The Williams campus is self contained, it really is a purple bubble. The campus and the village have everything the kids want and need. There are tons of activities -- sports, arts, lectures, social -- and the sense of community is tremendous. The kids generally go to New York or Boston once a term either on their own or for a school related trip. But they're always glad to get back to Williamstown.</p>
<p>Other pluses are Winter study, the tutorial system and the freshman entry system. </p>
<p>In short, I have nothing bad to say about Stanford, but Williams is a very, very special place.</p>
<p>My son is a junior at Stanford and it has been a great place for him, overall. He has had many wonderful experiences and opportunities there, and I believe it was the best college choice for him. However, I will comment on the issue of advising, since it is one of the original poster's questions. Overall, my impression is that it is entirely possible to forge links and get advice from faculty, but, as has been said above, the student must take the initiative for this to happen. My son's freshman advisor was a graduate student who was assigned to him because she was in the same "general area" as his interests (e.g. engineering, humanities, natural science). Subsequently, he has received assistance from faculty (even from a professor whom he had never met before, in a department unrelated to his major, when he needed help with a proposal he was writing for summer funding) when he sought it. His academic advisor at this time is a professor who is rather well known in his field, and is a very busy person with commitments both within Stanford and outside the university. My son has a very good relationship with his advisor, and knows him quite well as he was his student in a very small seminar class, but feels that he is so busy that he doesn't want to bother him with questions or ask for advice more frequently than absolutely necessary. It is likely that at a small LAC, he would not be so hesitant to go to his advisor for advice. Stanford is definitely trying to make improvements in its academic advising program, as discussed in this article from the Stanford Daily - <a href="http://daily.stanford.edu/tempo?page=content&id=14643&repository=0001_article%5B/url%5D">http://daily.stanford.edu/tempo?page=content&id=14643&repository=0001_article</a>
One of the changes is that a full time Academic Director will be assigned to the dorm where many freshman live. I don't feel that the advising at Stanford is a major detriment to my son's experience there, but I think that at a smaller school there would be more emphasis on advising. Also, I would be glad to answer any other questions about Stanford.</p>
<p>Thanks for all the thoughtful input. MotherofTwo, I'm really surprised that your son was assigned a grad student advisor as a freshman. Ouch! Momrath, it sounds like your son is having a great quality of life because he loves the snow sports. Do you folks think that many students look to profs at LAC's as "in loco parentis"? Or that they turn to their profs with questions that they wouldn't ask their parents?</p>