Questions on USC

Colleges and Universities A-Z University of Southern California
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<p>I just had a few questions on USC, as we will be taking our kids on a California college tour next year. I have heard a lot of great things about USC and how it has improved so much over the last 20 years (when I was in college, it had a bit of a mixed reputation). However, we are still a bit on the fence on whether our kids will apply or not. (My son will probably major in economics and my daughter in either drama and/or English). My concern is that USC has 17,000 undergraduates where all the other potential schools (California as well as East Coast) have u/g enrollments between 1,500 and 9,000 students. I guess my question is whether USC can give a comparable educaton to a LAC or a typical selective East Coast private university with between 6,000 and 9,000 undergrads. My specific concerns about USC are whether you would encounter some of the negative aspects of a larger state university, such as 1) large class sizes; 2) endless queues for registration and the inability to register for the classes that you want for your major and minor; 3) getting your housing choices; and 4) whether the USC campus is very clique-y, with fraternities and sororities dominating the social life and 5) are most undergraduate courses taught by professors or graduate students? Is access to the faculty good? I would be grateful for your views. Thanks, Jackuk</p>

<p>PS - I had posted this question on another thread regarding visiting California colleges and I was advised to post it here also.</p>

2

<p>Well I haven’t started at USC yet but I can answer some of your questions…</p>

<ol>
<li><p>To me, they’re not really that big. You can go see the class sizes for yourself: [Fall</a> 2011 | Schedule of Classes](<a href=“http://web-app.usc.edu/soc/term_20113.html]Fall”>302 Found) Just click on a class, and a module and there’s a column that reads ‘Registered’ and you can see class sizes there.</p></li>
<li><p>If you register early, you’ll be more likely to get your first choice. I actually didn’t apply that early and I got my first choice. So yeah, just make sure you apply when you get the news and you should be fine. :)</p></li>
</ol>

<p>I’m sorry I can’t answer your other questions. :/</p>

3

<ol>
<li><p>depending on your major you will have some large class sizes. but honestly once you get past around 50 students it doesn’t really matter if you have 50 or 300. the class will be taught in the same manner.</p></li>
<li><p>never had problems registering for classes in 4 years, although i will say i don’t like the webreg interface.</p></li>
<li><p>getting housing can be competitive but university housing is guaranteed for your freshman and sophomore years. there are many other cheaper options in the surrounding area north of campus.</p></li>
<li><p>the greek community is very visible (generally you can pick out the sorority members because they all ride the same beach cruiser bikes with a starbucks coffee in one hand and texting with the other lol), but i wouldn’t say the social scene is “dominated” by it. there are a ton of house parties and stuff everywhere on ellendale and menlo as well. not to mention all the various club activities, etc.</p></li>
<li><p>pretty much every single class is taught by a professor. i only had 1 graduate student (ph.d candidate) ever teach a class and that was japanese 1. she was a great teacher, btw. faculty is extremely easy to access, especially the younger profs. one time i emailed my biochem prof a list of 10 questions i had and he responded to me in less than 2 hours at like 10pm via his blackberry lol. all profs are required to have at least 4 hours of “office hours” where they will be available to answer any questions that students have.</p></li>
</ol>

4

<ol>
<li>The only time you will encounter a “large class” is during your general education coursework and (potentially) some of your lower level introductory courses. This holds true for any prestigious university comparable to USC, even in the 3,000 - 10,000 UG schools.</li>
</ol>

<p>At USC, the size of these classes can vary. My biology GE freshman year had about 170 students in the lecture class, but my Russian Lit GE had about 40 students in the lecture.</p>

<p>These large classes are broken down into what are known as “discussion” or “lab” groups. Depending on the class and the subject, these are either moderated by TA’s (PhD students) or the professor themselves. I really never had a “bad” TA, just TAs I didn’t click with. A majority of my TAs, though, I found very relatable and really connected with. </p>

<p>Your son might find his intro econ classes (freshman year, maybe sophomore) to be on the larger side, but your daughter’s intro theatre classes will be small. Many English classes are workshop format, so by nature, they are on the small size, too. Size of classes is dependent on the way the material must be taught. This is true of any school. You will never see an acting workshop class of 100 students because that isn’t realistic – but a course on the history of American cinema does not need to be as intimate.</p>

<p>Just like at any college, your access and relationship to any professor is what you make of it. In my four years at USC, all my professors, from my GE classes to my 500 level classes stressed that they were accessible and ready to help students with their questions. If you take advantage of the office hours and email/phone accessibility of your professors, it is very easy to have a relationship with your teachers.</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Registration at USC is based on how many units you have. Seniors go first, then juniors, etc. You may not be able to snag a spot in that very popular Arts and Letters GE you wanted (those are limited to 20 students), but you will never face “not getting” a GE or an intro class you need to graduate.</p></li>
<li><p>USC housing is guaranteed your first two years at USC and there is enough freshman housing now with the recent opening of the Arts & Humanities dorm to house all freshman. By the time students are sophomores and juniors, however, most live in non-USC owned housing in the surrounding neighborhood because it is either nicer or cheaper (or both) than the USC apartments. There will never be a time where you won’t have a place to live; there are enough spaces for all non-commuting students.</p></li>
<li><p>Georgia Girl likes to throw around the statistic that only 17% of USC UGs are in the “social” Greek system. They are a present group, but they by no means have a monopoly on the social lives of students. I was not in a sorority and I never felt like I was missing out on social opportunities. I never felt like USC was cliquey. Of course, there are the occasional rude or pompous people (like at any school) but I always found everyone to be open and friendly.</p></li>
</ol>

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<p>Thanks for the great responses. As a follow-up question, why did you chose USC for college and what other schools were you seriously considering other than USC? Also, how hard is it to get into the Honors Program?</p>

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<p>^ Which honor programs?</p>

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<p>I think it is called the “Thematic Option” in the College of Arts and Sciences.</p>

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<p>^I can’t honestly tell you how difficult it is to get into TO, but I know that an invitation is not a guarantee of acceptance. According to the meeting we had at orientation, it’s roughly 7% of the incoming freshman class (~196 students).</p>

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<p>Not all qualified students apply, so while I think thematic option is a great program, you shouldn’t think that you have to be in the top 7%to be admitted. I would guess more like the top 20% +/- are invited.</p>

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<p>There are other programs for motivated students which may interest your son and daughter. In addition to the Thematic Option there is the Freshmen Science Honors program, freshmen seminars and First Year Investigations.</p>

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<p>You have received some very good answers and I thought I’d just add another perspective (as the happy parent of 2 current Trojans) as you go on your college tour and see many universities, including USC:</p>

<p>1) It may be misleading vis a vis the quality of classroom experience, to simply look at class size as an indication of value given. In classes where class participation, discussion, collaboration, interaction, critique and individual feedback are part of the curriculum, small class size is extremely valuable. USC keeps these format classes quite small, as one would hope. However, lecture-style courses are intended to present fundamental material, and in these courses it’s the quality of the professor, his/her communication style, wit, power, and intellectual/subject matter credentials which will be the key. In such classes, students (whether there are 50 or 300) will sit (comfortably in the case of USC), listen, think, and take notes. At USC, these same professors are extraordinarily available to answer questions and continue discussions in their office hours. In addition, each lecture class has an adjunct discussion session or lab, allowing a group of 20 or fewer students to get further into the material, often led by a TA. As mentioned above, the large lecture classes are limited to intro to classes, mostly, and disappear once the student reaches a more advanced level in their major/minor.</p>

<p>2) Unlike some stories at large public universities and others, USC’s online registration for classes is a dream. To help students move smoothly through their sequence of classes towards graduation, special D clearance is granted by one’s department advisor before registration opens to save a seat. This means even a freshman/soph who may have a later registration time will find no troubles getting into necessary sections of major requirements. Perhaps the most popular electives may fill up before those latest to register get there, but as one quickly moves up in seniority, those electives are easily scheduled in later semesters.</p>

<p>3) During freshman year, most students make arrangements with their friends about subsequent year housing. Sophomore year many decide to live in USC-owned apartments conveniently close–across the street from campus. Further out, there are lots of great options that either cost less or for a bit more, provide a bit more luxury.</p>

<p>4) One benefit to a large university is you’ll find the size of each happy sub-group is pretty impressive. Just going by majors/Schools, there are hundreds of Theatre kids, hundreds of Film geeks, hundreds of musicians, hundreds of engineers, hundreds of pre-meds, hundreds of economists and so on. If the desire to hang with one’s compatriots is high, students definitely will find their own. Of course, many find they desire to mix and match, find friends across other interests and they easily do. The Greek scene is perhaps clearer to spot (versus the video gamers or the community service kids)–with their self-branding Greek letter T-shirts/sweatshirts, but it is not an overwhelming presence. Just a nice part of the diverse mix.</p>

<p>Best of luck to you and your kids as you travel to California.</p>

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<p>Thanks everybody for the great responses.</p>

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<p>Also, I should stress that Thematic Option isn’t for everyone. Your children might be qualified, but due to the structure and material covered in the courses, they might want to stick to the regular GEs instead. It doesn’t mean you are “less smart” if you choose USC’s GE track instead of TO – in fact, all I think you “get” from being in TO is a medal at graduation. (If this is wrong, someone correct me.)</p>

<p>I was invited to TO when I was accepted to USC but found the courses I was able to take through the GE program more interesting to me than TOs philosophy/Classics-heavy coursework. Also, my major and the way my coursework for that was laid out also played a huge role in deciding that TO wasn’t for me. If your children decide to pursue USC, they should explore the TO site to see whether or not they are interested in those courses.</p>

<p>As far as why I chose USC – it just felt “right.” I loved the school from the second my mom and I stepped onto campus for the tour we took when I was a junior in high school. USC had everything I was looking for in a college – school spirit, a recognizable name, selective admissions. It also helped that, at the time, I was applying to schools with a very specialized major, so my options were pretty limited to begin with. (I applied to schools either as a screenwriting major or creative writing major.) In the two academic areas I decided to major in, USC’s programs are ranked highly, if not at the top.</p>

<p>I didn’t apply to a lot of big name schools (for the reasons I mentioned above) – except for Princeton, and barely anyone gets in there to begin with! – but I did turn down 100% full rides (scholarship) to both Emerson and Middlebury to attend USC, which I suppose is important to note.</p>

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<p>^Correct re: TO (but I didn’t know about the medal). There isn’t even an “honors” distinction on the transcript or the degree. It’s purely an interest-based thing, and it certainly doesn’t interest everyone (it really is a personal thing). </p>

<p>As Georgia Girl mentioned, there are many other programs with an “honors” feel to them.</p>

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<p>Zelda,
The statistic regarding percentage of students in the “social” or NPC and IFC chapters at USC was given to me by an university official. There are many Greek letter multicultural groups, Greek service groups and Greek ethnic groups. However, when one considers there are campuses where 30% or 40% of students are in the “social” chapters SC does not have that large of a percentage.</p>

<p>Wake Forest has 35% of male students in fraternities and 48% of women in sororities. Vanderbilt has 35% of male students in social fraternities and 50% of women in social sororties.</p>

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<p>GG - Thanks. We are not applying to either Vanderbilt or Wake Forest for exactly that reason.</p>

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<p>I’m confused. I quoted your statistic accurately in a non-negative fashion. The issue you have is…?</p>

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<p>I felt duty bound to respond to this thread, being both from the UK and a current USC grad student. To give some background, I did my undergrad at Cambridge and my Masters at Brown. I would put USC alongside either of them, if I am being honest, although it certainly has different strengths and weaknesses. That being said, with the pace of change, the ambition of the schools certainly goes 1.USC, 2.Brown, 3.Cambridge. I am sure you know about the difficulties of UK universities at the moment, but USC’s ambition is staggering (beyond the headline-grabbing donations). To give you an example- I know the social sciences best, but I am sure examples abound from other fields- economics was hiring 10 new professors last year. 10. In the worst job market higher education has ever seen. UCLA, UCSD and (to a slightly lesser extent, but still visibly) Berkeley are losing faculty due to delayed promotion, attrition without replacement, pension pots filling and profs looking elsewhere etc. Obviously, they’ve put fees up by 33% to try and stem the tide, but the California public university system is in a mess. I say this with no triumphalism, I think California’s public education system played a huge role in the state’s development and it should be something that California residents still take great pride in. But USC, Stanford and Cal Tech are making hay. And it isn’t just the Cal system that is being raided- big name professors have come from all over the place: Damasio came from Iowa (and does loads of talks on campus, which is fascinating), Castells from Cal, we’ve just stolen two prominent Oxford philosophers (as well as a collaborator from Arizona), Lord Eatwell has come over from Cambridge etc etc</p>

<p>I have had friends at Harvard (they had TAs and little professor interaction), Brown (my fellow grad students TA’d), Stanford (ditto), Cal (ditto), UT Austin (huge classes and TAs). In reality, every school has TAs. But USC’s professors are much, much better than most I’ve seen in wanting to play a much more hands-on role with the development of undergrads. The amount of supervised honors theses, the length of office hours, the letters of rec, supervised programs like TIRP, talks on campus, prof-connected clubs and societies etc etc. CIS has huge numbers of talks, in an intimate setting, on public affairs; the Unruh Institute combines student and visiting speakers on pressing domestic issues; The Energy Institute on campus is doing some really exciting work with students from all fields including field trips, visiting speakers, conferences. The US-China Institute, The Korean Studies Institute, the Philosophy Society has some great talks. Obviously drama on campus is pretty superb (the only place better I’ve seen was Cambridge, but we didn’t have as good facilities). And then, during courses, I taught one intro course last year where the prof knew everyone’s name (it had 250 students), sat in on TA’s discussion sections, had approx. 6 hours of office hours every week, emailed students he hadn’t seen recently, re-graded everything we graded to ensure fairness, had an extra-curricular, extra-credit quiz competition etc etc. Ask any TA from any other school and they will tell you that I am making this up!</p>

<p>In short, there is every single way that a talented student will be stretched at USC in a way that at a lot of other schools they’ll be lost in the shuffle. I know every school says that, but that’s been my experience, for what it’s worth. Obviously, like everything, it is as much about the student as it is about the school, but if the student wants to push him/herself, they’ll be greated enthusiastically!</p>

<p>Lastly, on Greek Life. It’s obviously there, and some people speak very highly of it, but the vast majority of my students are not in a frat or a sorority and some of the ones who are are extremely able. It’s certainly not Animal House or anything, indeed far from it. To be honest, as there is so much to do on campus and in the city, it’s nigh on impossible for the Greeks to dominate anything. Sorry Greek people!</p>

<p>And, if we are looking at party schools, Cambridge would probably have beaten Arizona State or whoever is most notorious. You put a bar in every college, you don’t insist on continuous assessment like they do at USC, instead giving exams at the end of the year, and you’ll get a lot of undergrad drinking! USC is far, far tamer than Cambridge ever was! </p>

<p>The other thing, which I think is important but others think less so, is the campus experience. Football games, tailgating, sports facilities, on-campus drama, recreational sports, clubs and societies etc are all very important aspects of the undergrad experience. I think Brown students missed out on that. I really do. As long as you get great academics and proper attention at a bigger school (like at a USC, Duke, Stanford), then I feel you miss out by not having that technicolor university experience. I go as a grad student because I felt I missed out as an undergrad. I wish I had had the opportunity. Makes for a great feeling of togetherness (family, if you will) and a really close Alumni network, which is as important as your degree in many ways moving forward.</p>

<p>Anyway, I am prattling on at this point. Let me know if I can answer any questions.</p>

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<p>SWR, thanks for the great comments, particularly with your British perspective.</p>