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<p>Actually, on that subject, the point was that I can understand why they do not. Which leaves the other point still unaddressed by you i.e. the Supreme court sanctions death based remedies for murder, yet it is not considered murder …</p>
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<p>But you don’t agree with that view. You believe that “race based crimes” (no examples given) deserve “race based remedies” (e.g. racial preferences).</p>
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<p>What’s there to address? Are you asking for my opinion on the death penalty?</p>
<p>philovitist,</p>
<p>Given the results of the human genome project, it appears that the proposition that “race is all in our minds” is a defensible position. Economic inequality is then only of the same nature as racial differences if one believes that the claim that money and economic value are “just all in our minds” is a more or less equally defensible position. An idealist or utopian can certainly claim that no one should have to pay for anything and that money should be just in our minds, but only someone on the extreme fringe would argue that such is the case now. </p>
<p>The belief in the value of money is universal and almost unanimous, as virtually all people are moneyists, and unilaterally becoming a non-moneyist would be sort of like unilaterally disarming oneself in a world of conflict. One will not likely help oneself or others by abandoning the concept of money. Racism, the belief that race matters, is not nearly as universal or unanimous, and becoming someone who cares nothing about race is not nearly so dangerous, or even dangerous at all, for oneself or for others.</p>
<p>On a somewhat related topic, I will add that Pat Buchanan, who was a campaign advisor for Nixon, helped to perfect the “Southern Strategy” which involved convincing the voters to focus on race and issues dealing with race rather than on broader economic issues, getting voters to form race-based alliances and to abandon alliances based on sharing similar economic situations. This way working class and impoverished whites would be divided from working class and impoverished African-Americans. The strategy worked wonders.</p>
<p>Austinareadad - only for those who are not on the receiving end of racism. How do you ignore race, when racism is directed at you? There’s a difference between believing race shouldn’t matter, and believing that is doesn’t matter. </p>
<p>Yes, we have advanced to the point that a man of african descent is serving his second term in the white house, but we still have those who question his citizenship. Yet nobody gave any real credence to those who questioned the citizenship of him opponent in 2008 - John McCain, who was NOT born on US soil. If Obama had been white, not only would his citizenship not have been questioned, but he might have won by a more significant margin. For a significant percentage of Americans, race still matters.</p>
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<p>And you care about a small minority of conspiracy theorists…because?</p>
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<p>You’re still proving my point. I don’t dispute the POSSIBILITY that all else equal, had Obama been O’Bama with two white parents, he could have won both elections with larger margins of victory. But the point is that he still won both elections decisively. And so you can’t say that “for a SIGNIFICANT percentage of Americans, race still matters.”</p>
<p>The problem here is that we have people who refuse to recognize that the positions they espouse are either extreme or unrealistic. On one side, we have people who push the view that since Obama is President, racism is extinct in America. That’s absurd. But on the other side, we have people who think that having a half-white half-black individual as President of the United States means we’re still, for the most part, stuck in 1963. That’s equally absurd.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Why are blacks disadvantaged?
Because racism.</p></li>
<li><p>Why would blacks continue to have worse opportunities?
Because racism.</p></li>
<li><p>Why would blacks be vilified as a group if we as individuals stopped caring about racial classification?
Because stereotyping because racism.</p></li>
<li><p>And how much of that disproportionate jailing is due to the war on drugs, which perhaps isn’t a kosher topic for this thread?
I dunno.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>When you say that we should stop caring about racial classification, you are not proposing a solution to inequity between different ethnic groups, but proposing that we stop thinking of it as a problem.</p>
<p>Uh, no.</p>
<p>Given the results of the human genome project, it appears that the proposition that “race is all in our minds” is a defensible position.
[/quote]
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<p>Defensible in what sense? It’s incorrect.</p>
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<p>It’s not.</p>
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<li><p>But if individuals stop caring about racial classification, there will be no racism.</p></li>
<li><p>^</p></li>
<li><p>If individuals do not see others in terms of racial classification membership, how can individuals stereotype?</p></li>
<li><p>Do you dispute that it may matter, perhaps more so than “because racism”?</p></li>
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<p>Inequality in terms of what? Opportunities or outcomes?</p>
<p>Equality of outcome, in my opinion, is going too far. Not to say that minorities currently enjoy total equality of opportunity, though if we’re going to seriously look at inequality we need to consider a lot more than race.</p>
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<p>I would presume that if opportunities are the same, outcomes will be the same, too, but for the dearth of cultural capital and other resources that URMs have. </p>
<p>If so, this dearth would then also be a problem effort would be taken to address. :/</p>
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<p>Racism has already happened; racism is already instituted in the system.</p>
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<p>By appearance.</p>
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<p>Are you suggesting that blacks do drugs more often than other ethnic groups?</p>
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<p>Why do you presume that? In the 100m sprint, all eight contestants begin at the same starting point (equal opportunity). But not all eight cross the finish line at the same time (equal outcome).</p>
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<p>Care to give some examples? Remember, we are in a world where individuals are not racist but “the system” still is.</p>
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<p>But we are in a world where individuals see each other as individuals, who are inherently unique. How can they stereotype?</p>
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<p>I am suggesting that the war on drugs has harmed the black community far more so than “because racism.” If I wanted to voice the opinion that blacks do drugs more often than other ethnic groups, I would have written that. But I didn’t because that isn’t my opinion.</p>
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<p>The idea isn’t that everyone should achieve the same result. The idea is that the same distribution of outcomes should be achieved by the black population as the whites. In both groups, about the same percent doing well, and about the same percent doing poorly. </p>
<p>Because if it’s not the case, there’s something subtle that is wrong.</p>
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<p>If everyone stopped caring about race right now, then blacks would still be disproportionately represented in prisons, low-quality schools, and lower economic classes. It’s pretty straightforward. :/</p>
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<p>Oh, we’re living in a world without human beings! I’m sorry, I thought we were being somewhat realistic. I really only care about the world we live in and things we can do about it.</p>
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<p>You’re being ambiguous so I have to ask questions, for example, about what you think these reasons are and are insinuating in general.</p>
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<p>I’ve always found this to be interesting. The idea is that we should wait indefinitely until racial preferences achieve whatever it is they’re supposed to achieve, but if ceasing to consider racial classification doesn’t make the world hunky dory overnight, then it’s not worth it to cease considering racial classification.</p>
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<p>Please define “stereotype” for me and tell me how one is formed.</p>
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<p>I don’t see how it would change things after a thousand nights, either.</p>
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<p>No. Google it. Goddammit.</p>
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<p>But considering racial classification now with the goal of not considering it tomorrow makes perfect sense to you. Hmm.</p>
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<p>Sure.</p>
<p>[Stereotype</a> - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary](<a href=“http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/stereotype]Stereotype”>Stereotype Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster)</p>
<p>As an example of how to use “stereotype” in a sentence, Merriam Webster provides the following: “It’s not fair to stereotype a whole group of people based on one person you don’t like.”</p>
<p>Let’s examine that sentence. It would seem that “stereotyping” covers the situation of making judgments about GROUPS based on INDIVIDUALS. Now, since the kind of group we’re talking about in our discussion is racial classification, and you’ve chosen to enter a discussion where the hypothetical is that individuals do not care about racial classification…how is it that blacks will be stereotyped?</p>
<p>Oh, wait. Of course. Silly me. You realized your point was invalid, so you decided you didn’t want to have this discussion anymore.</p>