"Race" in College Admission FAQ & Discussion 7

<p>It would appear that reporting one’s race as Caucasian would not add to one’s admission chances at most colleges. If the choice is between reporting race as Caucasian and non-reporting, might one surmise that it is perhaps equal or better in terms of impact one’s on admissions chances at most colleges to non-report?</p>

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<p>There was one set of figures I saw one time–alas, I don’t have a link at hand–that showed base admission rates for different categories of students. (I can’t even remember if this was about just one college, or more than one.) The base admission rate for a self-identified “white” applicant in that set of figures was about the same as for a “race unknown” student, and that makes sense, as there is a sole study (reported in an earlier iteration of this thread by another CC participant) that suggested that in that study population most “race unknown” students would be identified as white if they cared to self-identify. (It further makes sense that “white” people make up the majority of “race unknown” students because they make up the majority of all students.) </p>

<p>So from the expediency point of view, it’s perhaps neutral for a white student to mark or not mark the race box on the optional questionnaire. There are other points of view–taking a stand for saying that one is related to all human beings, or that the categories are arbitrary and meaningless–that might warrant not marking the form, but there doesn’t appear to be an admission advantage for a white student to decide not to mark the form. </p>

<p>As usual, most colleges don’t publish enough detailed data about such issues to be sure what really is expedient. That is, most colleges hide the data they surely must have about how one race category or another is viewed as an admission factor. So people seeking their best chance of admission cannot always be sure what to do.</p>

<p>It is in no applicant’s self interest to racially identify himself as “not-reported” to a particular college until such time as the majority of applicants do so. There are only so many seats at a university. If admissions feels their mission is to provide an advantage to particular racial categories, then there must be a balancing disadvantage to be not of those categories.</p>

<p>^ </p>

<p>Fairly strong contrary evidence can be found in </p>

<p>[post</a> #6](<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/1064033868-post6.html]post”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/1064033868-post6.html) </p>

<p>and </p>

<p>[post</a> #7](<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/1064033879-post7.html]post”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/1064033879-post7.html) </p>

<p>of this thread, neither of which are exhaustive in giving examples of colleges that admit and enroll many, many students who are officially reported as “race/ethnicity unknown.” </p>

<p>Moreover, “if admissions feels their mission is to provide an advantage to particular racial categories,” then the admission office is acting illegally (whether a private university admission office or a public university admission office), because that is a prohibited admission goal under federal law. Students who have any reason to suspect that all “race unknown” applicants are systematically disfavored compared to students of some other race or ethnicity category should [know</a> their rights](<a href=“http://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ocr/know.html]know”>Know Your Rights) and file a [civil</a> rights complaint](<a href=“http://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ocr/docs/howto.html]civil”>File a Complaint: Discrimination Form | U.S. Department of Education) against a college acting illegally like that.</p>

<p>A wise man once said “most colleges hide the data they surely must have about how one race category or another is viewed as an admission factor”.</p>

<p>Maybe we could call it CollegeGate.</p>

<p>It would be a good idea, in my opinion, for colleges to be more transparent about how they use the fraught ethnicity categories, if at all, as an admission factor. The University of Michigan admissions director referred to using “two different sets of standards” in admission the year that it had to change its procedures to fit the voter initiative passed in that state. Right now too much is mysterious, and that makes it hard to evaluate college admission policies for their unintended consequences versus their stated goals.</p>

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<p>The plural of “snow job” is not “evidence”. The pseudo-data so repetitively reposted by tokenadult do not pass the laugh test, in part because they are off by factors on the order of five or fifty in many cases.</p>

<p>^ </p>

<p>Which cases, on what evidence?</p>

<p>News is out today about a new study on an “excellence gap” between high ability students of different social groups. </p>

<p>[Equity</a> and Opportunity Threatened by Growing National “Excellence Gap”](<a href=“http://www.newswise.com/articles/equity-and-opportunity-threatened-by-growing-national-excellence-gap]Equity”>Equity and Opportunity Threatened by Growing National "Excellence Gap") </p>

<p>The study conclusion is that the No Child Left Behind legislation has focused too much on learners with the worst school performance and has not done enough to raise the performance of higher-ability learners, and especially hasn’t maximized the performance of high-ability learners in some social groups. The study report </p>

<p><a href=“https://www.iub.edu/~ceep/Gap/excellence/ExcellenceGapBrief.pdf[/url]”>https://www.iub.edu/~ceep/Gap/excellence/ExcellenceGapBrief.pdf&lt;/a&gt; </p>

<p>has more details.</p>

<p>The reading list linked here </p>

<p>[Harvard</a> Summer Institute on College Admissions, June 21-26, 2009, Suggested Reading](<a href=“http://www.fas.harvard.edu/~sica/reading.htm]Harvard”>http://www.fas.harvard.edu/~sica/reading.htm) </p>

<p>leads to quite a few different books that relate more or less directly to the topic of this thread, perhaps books that are especially influential in college admission offices.</p>

<p>My mom is Asian, My father is a GCC citizen (Id rather call the Middle Eastern Race that instead of “white”, thats plain insensitivity and ignorance to the feelings and uniqueness of the Middle East), what am I supposed to put? well that help in my college app i nterms of Aff. Action?</p>

<p>It may be irrelevant… They may just label you as Asian: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-admissions/861318-little-disturbing.html#post1064063137[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-admissions/861318-little-disturbing.html#post1064063137&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>– However, when you check white on the common app it will ask you to specify what kind. There is a box for Middle East.</p>

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<p>The federal regulations that are the core news to share and discuss in this thread </p>

<p>[U.S&lt;/a&gt;. Department of Education; Office of the Secretary; Final Guidance on Maintaining, Collecting, and Reporting Racial and Ethnic Data to the U.S. Department of Education [OS]](<a href=“http://www2.ed.gov/legislation/FedRegister/other/2007-4/101907c.html]U.S”>http://www2.ed.gov/legislation/FedRegister/other/2007-4/101907c.html) </p>

<p>include this comment: </p>

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<p>So although there are some grounds for considering Middle Eastern people as a distinct group from European people or Asian people (that is what would be at issue here), it’s just a government decision to group people as they are now grouped. It’s not meant to be insulting, and the Census Bureau is already on record saying </p>

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<p>Plenty of European people notice differences between Corsican people and French people, or between Irish people and English people, or between Kashubian people and Polish people, or between Serbs and Croats, but all alike are regarded as “white.” There is no need to feel especially singled out if you are grouped with people with whom you feel you have differences. </p>

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<p>It’s hard to say what will help your application in terms of affirmative action, because colleges aren’t clear about what they are looking for. I have never, ever encountered a college admission officer who said otherwise than that “our college cherishes diversity.” All colleges claim to be seeking to build diverse groups of students. I’m not aware of colleges that are clear about what they think they might be missing, or what kind of applicants would be most regarded as adding diversity to an already diverse college class. </p>

<p>As the earlier reply said, some colleges allow optional self-designation right on the ethnicity questionnaire form to add details such as Middle Eastern background to the federally mandated question (mandated for colleges to ask, optional for students to answers) about “race.” Whatever your college application form says, you can self-describe however you like in your essay question answers or short answer question answers. You can put in your application what you want to have there at any college with a “holistic” admission process. What that will mean to the college and how significant that will be for admission may vary from college to college. </p>

<p>Good luck in your applications.</p>

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<p>The description you gave in the link you kindly shared to your new thread raises some odd questions. I checked the relevant federal regulation, </p>

<p>[U.S&lt;/a&gt;. Department of Education; Office of the Secretary; Final Guidance on Maintaining, Collecting, and Reporting Racial and Ethnic Data to the U.S. Department of Education [OS]](<a href=“http://www.ed.gov/legislation/FedRegister/other/2007-4/101907c.html]U.S”>http://www.ed.gov/legislation/FedRegister/other/2007-4/101907c.html) </p>

<p>and as of this year an applicant with both white and Asian “race” would be reported in a “two or more races” category not otherwise distinguished as to which races make it up for federal reporting. </p>

<p>As always, colleges decide, within broad legal limits of nondiscrimination law, what student characteristics matter as admission factors. If you are admitted to the college of your choice, it might be interesting to find out how the college views its own admissions procedures in a world with more and more “multiracial” people.</p>

<p>I hope later today to check out from my friendly alma mater university’s library the book Affirmative Action Around the World: An Empirical Study by Thomas Sowell </p>

<p>[Affirmative</a> Action Around the World - Sowell, Thomas - Yale University Press](<a href=“http://yalepress.yale.edu/Yupbooks/book.asp?isbn=9780300107753]Affirmative”>http://yalepress.yale.edu/Yupbooks/book.asp?isbn=9780300107753) </p>

<p>[Affirmative</a> Action Around the World … - Google Books](<a href=“Affirmative Action Around the World: An Empirical Study - Thomas Sowell - Google Books”>Affirmative Action Around the World: An Empirical Study - Thomas Sowell - Google Books) </p>

<p>[Amazon.com:</a> Affirmative Action Around the World: An Empirical Study (9780300101997): Thomas Sowell: Books](<a href=“http://www.amazon.com/Affirmative-Action-Around-World-Empirical/dp/0300101996]Amazon.com:”>http://www.amazon.com/Affirmative-Action-Around-World-Empirical/dp/0300101996) </p>

<p>to see what international examples of affirmative action policies in higher education admission are described there. As an American who has lived overseas (during two different three-year stays, one in the early 1980s and one around the turn of the century in a non-Western country, I’m always curious about what people in the United States can learn from policy examples in other countries. I’d love to hear in this thread about how ethnicity is considered (if at all) in college admission in other countries of the world.</p>

<p>The Wikipedia article </p>

<p>[Affirmative</a> action - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](<a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action]Affirmative”>Affirmative action - Wikipedia) </p>

<p>on the general subject takes an international perspective, and links to other interesting articles.</p>

<p>Link to a diversity index of United States universities. I don’t claim that the methodology of this index is the only meaningful way to look at campus ethnic diversity. </p>

<p>[Best</a> Colleges - Education - US News and World Report](<a href=“http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/national-campus-ethnic-diversity]Best”>http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/national-campus-ethnic-diversity)</p>

<p>Even if you checked the unknown/didn’t fill in the race section, wouldn’t schools be able to guess your race most of the time based on your name? I mean, someone who is “unknown” but is named…say, John Zhang, is obviously Asian…</p>

<p>^ </p>

<p>That’s in the FAQ posts above in the thread. Colleges aren’t expected to guess, and many report a lot of “race unknown” students.</p>

<p>everyone should read all 50 pages of this: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/yale-university/830524-quadruplets-admitted-yale.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/yale-university/830524-quadruplets-admitted-yale.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>its probably one of the biggest affirmative action debates there has ever been on cc. but it was a huge win for “equal treatment” of the races and for providing a “more objective outlook” on the issue. i think mifune, the main debater for the equal treatment side, did a great job.</p>

<p>have you already read this tokenadult?</p>