Ranking International Relation Programs

<p>Can someone out there please tell me something about Pitt's GSPIA (SIS-security and intelligence) program???</p>

<p>For IR, I really would have to say after talking to different people who graduated from all of these schools that they all have merit-- but the question is are you willing to go into major debt just to have a "name school" on your resume? I know when making my choice that I was not willing to go to Harvard with over $70,000 in debt for a Masters degree. SAIS or SIPA are not any cheaper--with average tuition and living expenses equaling $90-100,000 for two years! Might as well get a law degree! </p>

<p>In DC, your average starting salary in the govt will be a GS-9 (43,000) if you have no govt experience. NGOs pay worse. I think someone mentioned that you can do well in finance/banking-- but you really don't need an IR degree for that. Also, none of these places will pay you more money for going to SIPA or KSG (it is not like going to a top tier law or business school). Remember, the IR schools are not officially ranked- instead the best are clumped together! </p>

<p>My suggestion- go where you will have the least debt-- all the IR schools (top ones recognized by APSIA-- ie Harvard, Columbia, American, GW, Georgetown, Fletcher, and SAIS) will give you connections within the DC/NY area. </p>

<p>I ended up going to American b/c I didn't want to be in debt the rest of my life-- and trust me-- although it is no ivy I still got a great education and found a wonderful job in the field I wanted (development [trade capacity building]/trade policy) before graduation in the US federal govt. Other friends of mine (American grads) got jobs (as analysts etc.- not staffing type positions) working in the FBI, CIA, State, Commerce, on the hill, various NGOs, think tanks, one is employed as Rumsfield's assistant (who by the way just got offered a position as a political appointee), and even in the private sector (ie investment banks). So, you don't need "a name school" to make it DC-- just keep that in mind before you sign up for that variable rate private loan to go to KSG or SIPA....Looking back-- I am glad I didn't!</p>

<p>For IR, I really would have to say after talking to different people who graduated from all of these schools that they all have merit-- but the question is are you willing to go into major debt just to have a "name school" on your resume? I know when making my choice that I was not willing to go to Harvard with over $70,000 in debt for a Masters degree. SAIS or SIPA are not any cheaper--with average tuition and living expenses equaling $90-100,000 for two years! Might as well get a law degree! </p>

<p>In DC, your average starting salary in the govt will be a GS-9 (43,000) if you have no govt experience. NGOs pay worse. I think someone mentioned that you can do well in finance/banking-- but you really don't need an IR degree for that. Also, none of these places will pay you more money for going to SIPA or KSG (it is not like going to a top tier law or business school). Remember, the IR schools are not officially ranked- instead the best are clumped together! </p>

<p>My suggestion- go where you will have the least debt-- all the IR schools (top ones recognized by APSIA-- ie Harvard, Columbia, American, GW, Georgetown, Fletcher, and SAIS) will give you connections within the DC/NY area. </p>

<p>I ended up going to American b/c I didn't want to be in debt the rest of my life-- and trust me-- although it is no ivy I still got a great education and found a wonderful job in the field I wanted (development [trade capacity building]/trade policy) before graduation in the govt. Other friends of mine (American grads) got jobs (as analysts etc.- not staffing type positions) working in the FBI, CIA, State, Commerce, on the hill, various NGOs, think tanks, one is employed as Rumsfield's assistant (who by the way just got offered a position as a political appointee), and even in the private sector (ie investment banks). So, you don't need "a name school" to make it DC-- just keep that in mind before you sign up for that variable rate private loan to go to KSG or SIPA....Looking back-- I am glad I didn't!</p>

<p>OT, but since the discussion is on AU: how good/respectable is its undergraduate polisci program (in the school of public affairs)?</p>

<p>When I was discussing the the college fellowship/internships with the staff at the Department of State, they said their best affiliation was with George Washington and Georgetown, and then Howard. The SIS at American is a great program, but the university itself is overshadowed and not as respected as the other schools in DC. I'd say that it 5th in D.C. for Internation Relation behind, JHU, Georgetown, GWU, & Howard. American will give you a lot of oppurtunity in the D.C., but you'll have a lot of (superior) competition.</p>

<p>Personally, I feel American's SIS is in need of major updating. After spending the first two weeks of July at SIS for NSLC, I removed American from my list, the school is very lack in asthetics and the SIS building is on plan to be torn down, as it should be.</p>

<p>If you're planning to have AU on your list for 2006-2007, make sure you check in on the school's progress. The program is outstanding, the issue mos have is mainly with the facilities and dorms.</p>

<p>Woodrow Wilson is far from mediocre. The confusing part about Princeton, is that not all IR/IA students accepted at Princeton are accepted at Woodrow Wilson, only 90 students in each class are admitted to Woodrow Wilson. From the students that are studying International Affairs but are not in Woodrow Wilson, I've heard much disappointment.</p>

<p>As a student graduating from a private school of 130 students, I'm not sure of what do to do. I have the the over-the-top reccomendations and applications to get into schools like Tufts, Stanford (double legacy), and George Washington. But I'm lost, because I want a liberal arts education. My college advisor wants me to go Columbia, Georgetown, or GWU, but I can't make the jump from 120 to 20,000.</p>

<p>Will going to a liberal arts college like Colgate, Swarthmore, or Macalester limit you chance at getting into grad school?</p>

<p>Also does anyone have any comments on specific international Relations programs? I know American and the Claremont Colleges have solid programs, but what about:</p>

<p>Bucknell?
Colby?
Colgate?
Dickinson?
Kenyon?
Vassar?
Connecticut College?</p>

<p>You sound like you want to go to one of the top grad schools and to pursue an IA/IR career eventually. If that is the case, then consider yourself lucky to know your future career trajectory at such a young age. Take advantage of that self-awareness, and for christ-sake, consider taking advantage of your connections (...I can't imagine having the luxury of turning down a double legacy connection at Stanford). It's taken me years to get to that point.</p>

<p>I think that a Liberal Arts education can be valuable in the world of IA/IR if you tailor it to what graduate schools are looking for. In other words, use it to hone your language, analytical (quantitative and qualitative), and history/poli sci. But, if you're going to do all of that, why not just go into Poli Sci or an IA/IR undergrad, and supplement it with LA electives. On the other hand, you might consider a minor or double major in LA.</p>

<p>Good Luck</p>

<p>Cre8tive1 you made some good points-- but I am not certain if you were referring to the Masters or undergrad program. I am talking about a MA-- so dorm situations would not necessarily apply to a graduate student. </p>

<p>From what I understand, and those (American MA grads) who I know got jobs or interned at State, they all found it filled with AU alumni-- moreso than any other school in the DC area. Although I can't give any exact numbers, I know from AU's career center that we have a huge foreign service representation at State-- as well as within its civil service. Clearly, a non-AU grad (especially an alumn that went to another DC school) would have a bias against AU-- as most alumns do for all other competing IR schools. From what I hear, although I never applied to State, because of our huge alumni representation, we are highly respected and wanted there-- moreso than other IR programs. </p>

<p>But keep in mind- subjectivity matters a lot. I have been in conversations with various DC colleagues in the govt, private sector, NGOs, etc. who have a vast array of opinions of the different IR schools-- ranking schools like GW, SAIS, Georgetown, AU etc at all different levels. And yes-- believe it or not many people do think (even when I don't tell them I am an AU grad) AU is superior (or on the same level) with other IR programs like SAIS and SIPA. But believe me-- the reverse also holds true! </p>

<p>And please keep this in mind-- the DC machine is primarily based on who you know-- not so much where you went. Just because you go to an IR program at (for example) Columbia, Johns Hopkins, or Harvard does not mean you have a superior ability to get a good job. I know of Kennedy School of Govt. grads that have gotten staffing positions (ie administrative) in the govt, on the hill etc.-- and Univ. of Florida IR grads getting jobs at USAID as country analysts. Go figure. </p>

<p>Also, in regards to the AU SIS building-- they plan to have the new one built by 2007 I believe (but don't hold me to that). You can see a blueprint for the new building on the SIS site-- but regardless of whether a new building is built while you are there-- that shouldn't be a relatively large factor in choosing where to go to school. I mean, it is old-- but not a shack! And in regards to resources-- AU, GW, and Georgetown all have access to the same facilities (they share their libraries etc)-- so there never is a dearth of material. </p>

<p>Don't get me wrong-- I am not trying to make out AU to be the best IR program out there. I think they all are great. The problem is that everyone is trying to find out "who is the best?" I mean--- how can you when there is no ranking? And at the same time-- people are trying to get the best bang for the buck and have an excellent career. Therefore, I just think that potential gradudate students should focus on the APSIA schools and choose the one that 1) best fits your academic interests and 2) gives you the least debt. </p>

<p>To make this clear-- this message is for potential graduate students only-- not undergrads. I have no experience with AU's undergrad program or any other undergrad IR programs. But for those interested, I did take MA classes at Georgetown's IR program-- and they were the same as AU's. I think this is an important point to make again-- In my opinion there was no quality difference between Georgetown and AU graduate level courses. </p>

<p>My final piece of advice: choose the best APSIA grad school for you-- don't base it on the unversity's undergrad rep! Grad school and undergrad are two totally different worlds! Especially for IR!!! Good luck to all!!</p>

<p>I'm just wondering. Are there IR programs that do not have the traditional geographic area concentration requirement, and instead has a broader and more interdisciplinary study?</p>

<p>Why does Columbia have a good intern'l relations program?</p>

<p>Because the gods willed it to be so?</p>

<p>Why are there French people in France?</p>

<p>List of Presidential Management Fellows Finalists:</p>

<p><a href="http://www.pmf.opm.gov/agfinal.asp%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.pmf.opm.gov/agfinal.asp&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>This is a program for grads that are "fast-tracked" into Government. Many American U IR people, GWU, Hopkins and G-town too.</p>

<p>Sorry, couldn't get the link to post. So I would say ranking, who cares? It's all good...</p>

<p>"Univ. of Florida IR grads getting jobs at USAID as country analysts."</p>

<p>woohoo14, UF has an IR program? I live in FL and it just doesnt seem to be the state to live in if you want to major in IR. </p>

<p>And in general, I want to be an Foreign Service Officer OR go into Int'l Business. I like the idea behind IR in schools like American, Gtown, and GWU. But what about schools like Middlebury, Macalaster, Dickinson, and Bucknell for International Studies or International Relations?</p>

<p>dudedad,</p>

<p>Great post! This really sheds some light on the program specialties. If you look at the PMF distributions by school, here's how the top schools IR schools break down:</p>

<p>JHU-SAIS: 23 (total nominations)/22 (IR-related)
American U: 41/19 (IR-related)
GWU: 22/12
Georgetown: 33/13
Monterey: 17/9</p>

<p>I am currently doing research for masters in international development. so far JHU-SAIS and fletcher sound like the best bet. where can I find information for rankings in this field?</p>

<p>I am going to be a high school Senior and I also am interested in IR for undregrad, and thanks to all who posted. This tread has been very helpful to me. I have a list of schools that I'm trying to cut down and was wondering if anyone would mind telling me which of my schools are not worth applying to for IR undergrad.</p>

<p>SUNY Binghamton - saftey
American U
GW
Boston U
NYU
Hopkins
U Chicago
Brandeis
Yale
Princeton
Brown
Columbia (2 grandfathers went there... does that help me?)</p>

<p>*Georgetown isn't on there because I visited it and absolutely hated it.</p>

<p>Also if anyone could tell me how the language programs are at these schools that would be awesome. I want to load up on foreign languages in undergrad and hopefully that will make me more of an asset to the CIA or Foreign Service in my future endeavors.</p>

<p>Thanks Much</p>

<p>columbia doesn't have an IR programme for undergrads i think.</p>

<p>princeton has a great one in the woodrow wilson school. not sure about yale. chicago has int. studies....guess its similar to IR. tiz pretty well regarded.</p>

<p>but georgetown, tufts and jhu are the tops.</p>

<p>besides the univs already mentioned, what other colleges/univs could one apply to as a safety/match level that are still good in IR. Of course, not as much as these but as a second/third tier?</p>

<p>The top 10 domestic graduate schools in international politics that i could find in USNews and World Report are:</p>

<ol>
<li> Harvard University</li>
<li> Stanford</li>
<li> Columbia
Princeton</li>
<li> University of Michigan-Ann Arbor</li>
<li> UCSD</li>
<li> Duke University
Berkeley</li>
<li> University of Chicago</li>
<li>NYU</li>
</ol>

<p>Also I am a senior at USC getting ready to take the GREs and start applying for graduate schools. If anyone has done anything in particular to get into these schools or has any tips to make me stand out to the schools i would appreciate it.</p>