<p>Based on 50% popularity and 50% academic prestige:</p>
<p>Tier 1 - HYPSM</p>
<p>TIER 2 - Berkeley, Columbia, Duke, Chicago, UPenn, Caltech, Michigan</p>
<p>TIER 3 - Cornell, Johns Hopkins, NYU, Georgetown, UCLA</p>
<p>TIER 4 - Brown, Dartmouth, USC, CMU </p>
<p>TIER 5 - WUSL, Rice, Notre Dame, UVa, UNC. Emory, Vanderbilt</p>
<p>TIER 6 - UCSB, William & Mary, UIUC, UT-Austin</p>
<p>For a complete Ranking for college desirability, please refer to USNews&WR.</p>
<p>Based on undergraduate student selectivity (SATs)-the prestige of the undergrad student body as opposed to the scholarly prestige of the faculty</p>
<p>Tier One
Caltech, Harvard, Yale, Princeton, MIT</p>
<p>Tier Two
Washington U St Louis, Dartmouth, Stanford, Columbia, Cornell A&S +Eng, Brown Chicago, Penn</p>
<p>Tier Three
Tufts, Northwestern, Rice, Notre Dame</p>
<p>Tier Four
Georgetown, Carnegie Mellon, Vanderbilt, Emory, Johns Hopkins</p>
<p>
Nope.</p>
<p>Berkeley = 4.7</p>
<p>Michigan = 4.4</p>
<p>UCLA = 4.2</p>
<p>I think the smaller, more undergrad focused schools are more prestigious than the larger U’s that are world famous for their grad programs. Ergo, Tufts, Rice, Georgetown, William & Mary, and Wake Forest would all be 5-10 spots higher than is the common orthodoxy here on CC.</p>
<p>From these posting does that mean Columbia and Penn are not lower ivies, but rather middle ivies? Not that i agree that there is such a thing as lower ivies in the first place, however.</p>
<p>Based on their faculty reputation and their contributions to the human being:</p>
<p>Tier 1:
Harvard, Stanford, MIT, Berkeley</p>
<p>Tier 2:
Princeton, Caltech, Yale, Chicago, Columbia, Cornell</p>
<p>Tier 3:
Penn, Michigan, UCLA, Wisconsin-Madison, UIUC, Duke, UC-San diego, U-Texas at Austin, University of Washington, Johns-Hopkins, Carnegie-Mellon</p>
<p>Tier 4: other universities ranked top 100 in US-NEWS college ranking.</p>
<p>Tier 5: the rest.</p>
<p>Layman’s prestige is based on supply and demand for the world’s top students. Not only today, but also historically.</p>
<p>HYPSM, Oxford, and Cambridge always attracted the top students and that is why they are tier 1.</p>
<p>Until fairly recently Columbia, Penn, and Cornell, were relatively easy to get into. That’s why they are the “lower” ivies. Is the quality of education less than HYP? Probably not, but we are talking about superficial prestige. And time is not on their side.</p>
<p>JHU, CMU, ND, and Michigan have also been historically easier to get into. That is why they are not very prestigious.</p>
<p>Tier 1:
Oxford, Cambridge, Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Stanford, MIT</p>
<p>Tier 1.5:
Amherst, Williams, Caltech</p>
<p>Tier 2:
Duke, Brown</p>
<p>Tiers 3:
Dartmouth, Penn, Georgetown, JHU, Columbia, Cornell, Berkeley, Chicago, US Naval Academy</p>
<p>Tier 4:
Michigan, Northwestern, CMU, ND, Rice, West Point, UCLA, UNC, Tufts, UVa</p>
<p>looking back on all of this, these threads are SO ridiculous. There really is no need to rank or tier off by prestige. Outside of HYPMS, everything is basically on the same exact playing field. Irregardless, these are all great schools and in the grand scheme, HYPMS is on the exact same tier as the rest of these schools.</p>
<p>These threads just serve to perpetuate uneducated opinions on higher education in the United States.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Hopkins has consistently been ranked among the top 15 for the past 26 years since the inception of USNews in 1983. It is among the handful of universities that has been apart of the “top ten club”… Where I am from (Northeast, City of Harvard/MIT), Hopkins is well known and is respected by many many ppl.</p>
<p>^ Phead, it is not just the Northeast. Wherever there is a hospital, politicians, writers, schools, etc, Hopkins will be a VERY respected name among academia. There is just too much history and accomplishment for Hopkins to not be prestigious. In some and many cases, the prestige of Hopkins outstrips that of UPenn, Columbia, Dartmouth, Brown, etc, especially when you are asking doctors, people interested in International Politics, Well-versed people in certain Humanities, music, etc. The Hopkins prestige is a national and worldwide presence. Something that isn’t always true of many of the schools that seem to regularly be placed ahead of it on prestige. (only on this forum, i might add)</p>
<p>In terms of undergraduate prestige, Hopkins’ name serves it well. People honestly do not separate graduate from undergraduate prestige because prestige is prestige. Either you know about the school and know it’s a good school, or you don’t. You don’t exactly hear Harvard and think: “Oh…great grad programs, but comparatively subpar undergrad…”</p>
<p>The people who do do that, are the same people who probably bicker over pepsi vs. coke.</p>
<p>JHU is underrated on CC</p>
<p>“The people who do do that, are the same people who probably bicker over pepsi vs. coke.”</p>
<p>Pepsi is better than Coke…except in France, where Coke is surprisingly delicious! hehe!</p>
<p>Seriously though, I agree with the assessment that JHU is highly regarded everywhere. It is comparable to the likes of Cal, Chicago, Columbia, Cornell, Northwestern, Penn and only a handful of other elite universities.</p>
<p>Coke>>>>>>Pepsi. Hehe.</p>
<p>Based on prestige (not academic quality!!) in both Oregon and a wealthy DC suburb:</p>
<p>TIER 1
Harvard, Stanford, Yale, Princeton, MIT, Georgetown, Oxbridge</p>
<p>TIER 2
Johns Hopkins, Columbia, Duke, Cornell, Berkeley</p>
<p>TIER 3
Notre Dame, UVA, William & Mary</p>
<p>TIER 4
Dartmouth, Brown, Penn</p>
<p>I removed the universities in the list in the OP that no one where I live(d) has ever heard of</p>
<p>phead,
Re your claim in # 49, for the record, Johns Hopkins has not been in the Top 15 for the past 26 years. JHU was # 16 just two years ago (2007). It was # 16 in 2002. It was # 22 in 1995. </p>
<p>In addition, JHU’s ranking by USNWR may be inflated due to how JHU reports its data for selectivity and graduation/retention (due to exclusion of Peabody students) and particularly for Financial Resources (# 3 ranking among all national universities). Here JHU includes the massive spending that goes on at JPL even though this area has nothing to do with undergraduate education. </p>
<p>I don’t discount JHU’s high standing in academic circles although I would be inclined to attribute the preponderance of this view to the school’s graduate programs and their prominence in the medical industry.</p>
<p>As for prestige, some folks like using yield as a barometer for this. JHU’s yield is reported at 33%. Among colleges ranked in the USNWR Top 20, only Emory (30%) has a lower yield. </p>
<p>Using yield as a proxy, here is how the tiers would come out for the USNWR Top 30:</p>
<p>Yield , College</p>
<pre><code> TIER 1
</code></pre>
<p>79% , Harvard
70% , Stanford
69% , Yale
69% , MIT
68% , Princeton</p>
<pre><code> TIER 2
</code></pre>
<p>66% , U Penn
59% , Columbia
56% , Notre Dame
56% , Brown
52% , Dartmouth
47% , Georgetown
47% , Cornell</p>
<pre><code> TIER 3
</code></pre>
<p>42% , Duke
39% , Vanderbilt
38% , Caltech
37% , Wake Forest
36% , U Chicago
35% , USC
34% , Wash U
34% , Northwestern
33% , Johns Hopkins
33% , Rice
32% , Tufts
30% , Emory
30% , U Virginia</p>
<pre><code> TIER 4
</code></pre>
<p>28% , U Michigan
25% Est , U North Carolina
24% Est , UC Berkeley
23% , Carnegie Mellon
22% Est , UCLA</p>
<p>I don’t have the OOS yield data for U North Carolina nor the two UCs, so if I’m wrong, please forgive me and provide the correct number.</p>
<p>I will add that the IS students in California, Virginia, Michigan and North Carolina would each place their school into the top of the third tier/bottom of the second tier.</p>
<p>Hawkette, students generally prefer going to school close to home. Penalizing publics by not including in-state students isn’t fair.</p>
<p>This is a stupid thread. BTW, Princeton’s yield is like 59% for this year…</p>
<p>Also, people give way too much credit to YPSM. Harvard is in a tier all by itself!!!</p>
<p>hawkette, looking at your yield numbers, I’d have to wonder why Penn was not pumped up a tier and possibly UMich as well.</p>
<p>Other than that, I think the interesting fact about those numbers is there actually are some pretty distinct borders-- large drop off after Harvard, then large drop off after UPenn, then largish drop off after Brown (or DMouth), large drop off after Cornell, etc…</p>
<p>I’m not sure I agree with your tiers (only because I think they’re affected by conventional wisdom because the numbers may cause me to draw boundaries elsewhere… like say wherever more than 4% drops between one school and/or when the difference between top and bottom exceeds 18%, as an arbitrary ballpark designation).</p>
<p>I do think that this only measures prestige amongst students-- those who get in choose to go because they view this as the best choice for them.</p>
<p>I think that hawkette didn’t include IS students not because of the proximity to home, but because there is a significant factor which has nothing to do with prestige that goes into play there-- which is that these schools cost half as much for IS students as their peers do. While I’d include the numbers anyway, it’s pretty tough to say that the competition is fair there. That being said, financial aid policies at HYP help them quite a bit as well.</p>
<p>StevenSeagal. I find it hard to believe that no one has heard of the University of Michigan where you came from, whether it be in Oregon or a wealthy DC suburb.</p>
<p>RJK, that’s because Michigan was not in the OP’s original post. StevealSeagal was only lisitng universities in the OP’s original post. I am surprised that nobody he knows in Oregon and DC know about Chicago and Northwestern though. That sounds unlikely.</p>