My son is a senior voice student at UNT. UNT is a great in-state option for you for classical/opera, and is affordable. We have been impressed with the quality. It’s not necessarily an easy acceptance, especially for a female voice.
It’s hard to gauge what is a reach/match/safety with music auditions, so it doesn’t hurt to also have a non-audition safety on the list that you are sure you can afford. Maybe one of the non-audition LAC’s like Luther, or maybe Southwestern(a TX option near you), that have good music programs.
3 Likes
@Parentof2014grad is correct. The other issue is that if your D is notably talented and experienced (as it appears that she may be), a “safety” school may reject her to recruit other more “likely” students. This is another way in which VP will differ from an academic process. You have to really focus on match/reach schools mainly (teachers will help with that). Safety schools would be non-audition…bc if you go too low on an audition school…they will know it and possibly pass on you. They may be trying to build a class of 20 vocalists (10 female) so they may not want to offer space to an over-qualified vocalist who they know will get better offers. Be aware they will ask where she is auditioning and she’ll wants to be honest. So working with a teacher on an appropriate, thoughtful list by early Sr year is important. It will show that she knows herself as a vocalist.
Your D does seem like an experienced, good candidate. One of the hard thing for parents is to BELIEVE what teachers are saying. You may want to cover all the bases, spend extra money etc…bc it is so competitive and who knows!!! BUT, experienced teachers DO know. They can’t make any guarantees but they should be able to point her to the right level of schools…and in that grouping you may be surprised to find about 12 good schools…it narrows down quickly!!
As for “mock auditions”, go for it. I just didn’t want you to think that you have to join an expensive service to do mock auditions. Many teachers do provide these opportunities. And the more that she can sing for experienced teachers, the better. That should help her draw up a list.
So, back to your OP, you don’t need an expensive service. Still you should feel free to pay teachers and other music professionals to hear your D sing and get feedback to develop a list. Of course, you can hire a service…it’s just not necessary. I hope that this helps.
3 Likes
If you are on a budget, I wouldn’t necessarily jump to using a consultant. I would hope your voice teacher would be your best resource here. And if your voice teacher isn’t experienced launching students to college, maybe it is time to switch to a voice teacher that is seasoned at launching students to auditioned programs? My kid switched voice teachers junior year and that made a HUGE difference for us. Ended up being a teacher and the best consultant ever - 2 for the price of one. Did not hurt the teacher was on faculty at a college.
For background, I had 2 kids go through vocal auditions. One was a double degree applicant. We were trying for merit money. And for various reasons (merit, experience, etc) my kids applied to more traditional colleges with schools of music and less stand alone conservatories. They applied to a super wide range of schools. MY oldest kid was super academic. My younger is too, but wanted to be more music/performance focused in college. She is a freshman this year and was just cast in her first opera - she is so excited!
One thing I might do since you are local to UT Austin, is have
your daughter reach out to a voice faculty member and ask if they would do a paid lesson for a student considering auditioned vocal programs. It can help sending your background with lessons, summer programs, etc maybe even a private video link. Your voice teacher may have suggestions this way too.
I totally agree there may not be a lot of money out there for female vocalists in conservatories for UG. With 2 kids and with 22 schools applied to between the 2 of them, we travelled a lot and we listened to a lot of vocalists at a wide RANGE of schools. Frankly, we heard some less developed vocalists at some very competitive programs and we heard amazing vocalists at programs rarely talked about this board. When you’re considering programs, I wouldn’t assume all the vocalists will be all in the same place. Go listen to clips of a bunch of vocalists at programs of interest. I was actually fairly surprised when we first started doing that. Maybe because I have some music background that was higher impact for me but it gave us a good sense of perspective.
Female voice is pretty competitive a lot of places. I also think schools can pass on a talented vocalists for a ton of reasons. Like you look and/or sound alot like someone admitted last year. Or they think they aren’t a top choice for you. Or they don’t have the budget to offer you money. My older kid was told straight up by a teacher at a sample lesson once that he wished they had to budget to have him but he’ll get way better deal elsewhere. Having a non-auditioned safety in the hopper isn’t a bad idea. A lot of schools near metros will have really amazing faculty working with students.
I will say when asked what schools my kids were auditioning for they always had 2-3 peer schools to say in their back pocket. You don’t need faculty members trying to read your mind or your budget or making decisions for you any more than they already will.
4 Likes
Hi there! I too was a music major newbie and thought I needed a consultant…in the end we did GREAT on our own given ample time, research, and visits. What year is she? We started before high school with college camps and then visits right at the top of junior year. Our time and energy was what was most helpful. All in all we did 4 college camps (and. variety of others not affiliated with schools) and started with a list of 10. The visits and camps helped us narrow the application list to 6. He got in his first choice (and all the rest) which was based solely on HIS instrument and the professor he connected with most. Obviously her instrument (voice) and genre will produce different results! Good luck. It was a wild but very fun ride.
1 Like
My son is a dual degree major at Oberlin College and Conservatory and we are very happy with the school. Honestly, if your child is strong enough to get accepted into Tanglewood, she should have the type of private teacher who knows who your daughter should study with on the college/conservatory level.
We talked to my son’s HS private teacher about his desires in college. He wanted to be a dual degree student, and I wanted him to stay on one campus. His teacher made a list of college music professors she thought he should call and set up a trial lesson before applying to any college. He met with at least six teachers, via Zoom, and decided his first pick, for various reasons, was the Oberlin teacher he is presently studying with. He considered schools like USC-Thornton (Loved the teacher) but found out after the lesson that Thornton is not an option if he wanted a second major.
We did hire a college counselor for academic purposes but in the end, we really did not need him although we did love him. My son had no rejection letters but this had far more to do with how my son practiced for his college auditions than it had to do with the college counselor. My son did have an outstanding teacher the last few years of high school. She is also a conservatory teacher.
When we have been on Oberlin’s campus during the school year, we are met with students who are truly passionate about what they are studying, whether it be in the Con (Conservatory) or College. I cannot recommend this school enough if there is a perfect-fit teacher at this school for your daughter! I cannot begin to stress the importance of finding a perfect-fit teacher for her! Like I mentioned earlier, if your daughter’s teacher had the foresight of being able to get her into a program like Tanglewood, I would think she has the foresight to know the names of teachers around the country who are good fits at the college level.
The academic college counselor actually loves Oberlin and calls it “Like the Ivies but better.” The only Ivy with a comparable music program is Yale. The Yale teacher never responded to my son’s lesson request (We were paying for these lessons) so he decided to not apply to the school. There were three schools who were unresponsive to my son’s request and since he met with top teachers at other schools, some with equal or near equal competitive admission rates as the Ivies, so he just took those unresponsive schools off his list. It was his choice. I wasn’t going to argue with him.
He had all sorts of reasons for putting Oberlin at the top of his list, including liking teachers who he could possibly study with in graduate school. Oberlin is solely an undergraduate program, which the teachers do point out that there are far more leadership roles and music roles that are gotten because it is solely an undergraduate program. Schools, like Rice and Northwestern, where my son very much liked the teachers, have graduate students who would be competing for the same seats and opportunities he would want to have as an undergraduate. And, he really connected with the Oberlin teacher so–Oberlin ended up being the win/win in the end. I could not be happier–he is in his second year, too.
Hope this helps!
2 Likes
@ChucklesbytheBay not sure I agree with this:
The only Ivy with a comparable music program is Yale.
If someone wants an Ivy, Harvard has a double degree program with NEC as does Tufts. Check Princeton out too. I also liked Oberlin the best of all the schools we looked at though.
This is really helpful - i guess the Ivy point is that Yale is the only one where the music programme is within the same university. DD24 has applied for both - really good to hear how O has worked out for your DS
1 Like
This:
is exactly the reason my S22 did not apply to schools like NU or Rice. He wanted the full experience as an undergrad. That does limit choices for sure, but luckily the Oberlin teacher was the one whom he connected with and felt like a good continuation/expansion on his private teacher in HS. And it has turned out to be all true.
@Jkb2 I believe many Yale undergrad music majors or other majors who want lessons, will study with a grad student. That may or may not be a good thing but just to add to the discussion. Yale has recently added a double degree.
1 Like
Hi yes that’s not necessarily a problem if she gets in and would prob apply to YSM later on
My son is in this position as a freshman and while I initially scoffed at it…it has been a HUGE motivator for him. Just another perspective.
1 Like
Absolutely! A close friend’s son is in the same position with grad students in his actual studio, which really surprised me! But it’s working great for him, although there are opportunities set up just for undergrads at least.
Every school and every kid is different!
It’s not necessarily a problem to have grad students to compete with as an undergrad. My son found it motivating and inspiring to be in such a deep pool of musicians. He sang in choirs with grad students beginning his second year. There were so many opportunities for everyone, it was never a limitation on his progress. I’m sure this varies from school to school but I wouldn’t make the presence of grad students a negative.
For many students it may even be a positive to have lessons from grad students. My son had lessons from a grad student on a secondary instrument and she was absolutely fantastic and he made rapid progress. All his choirs had a grad assistant who conducted in addition to the professor and they were generally outstanding musicians with many years of experience prior to grad school. Much was learned by observing them, for my son. The presence of grad students can be a huge positive.
1 Like
Yes! Not necessarily a negative at all; but it IS something to consider when applying, which is why I bring it up as do many other veterans of this forum.
My S22 did research and spoke to a graduate of a particular school he was considering applying to. He asked her directly, how are the performing opportunities for undergrads? She replied, there are none. Everything is reserved for grad students and visiting artists. Undergrad at X University is where you are learning and not performing on their big stages. (performing takes place within the classroom) So, that took that particular school off his list because he very much wanted to perform in undergrad. So, it’s not about competing, it’s about actual, real opportunities if that is desired. And with voice specifically, undergrads are very young in their physical development. There is no amount of rehearsal or study that can replace the years of development that are needed to reach your potential as a singer.
Now, obviously, not every music school is set up like X University, which is why these questions are important to ask so that your goals are met and you have the most information you can get going into this process.
I do think exposure to grad students is an absolute positive- my S just did a summer program in which he was one of only two undergrads in the program and it was so rewarding and he learned so much from those who have years of experience and growth on him.
This topic was automatically closed 180 days after the last reply. If you’d like to reply, please flag the thread for moderator attention.