Research at D ...

[adrivit]

<p>To all students who are currently studying at Dartmouth pursuing science .... how are the labs? how are research options? can undergrads do independent and faculty aided research? Compared to MIT's UROP, how does D's research facilities stand? Thanks!!</p>

[knickknackpatty]

<p>Dartmouth is an absolutely perfect (on paper at least) place to conduct research. I havent started yet but still.</p>

<p>it is the smallest of the ivies, and is as P.Wright said a university in everything but name. Considering the fact that you have grad schools like Hitchcock med at your fingertips, its not hard to find a project. </p>

<p>Dartmouth itself will fund its own students in research. To name a few there is the freshman summer research opp and senior fellowships. D plan allows for huge amounts of flexibility of when you want to take 10 weeks for internships, etc.</p>

[adrivit]

<p>Infact in name also its Dartmouth “College”! But thanks!! Any sophomores or seniors at D wish to comment???</p>

[collegeseeker111]

<p>

Infact in name also its Dartmouth “College”!

</p>

<p>What?</p>

<p>10chr.</p>

[adrivit]

<p>Isn’t Dartmouth called Dartmouth College and not Dartmouth University??? Nevermind. Just a ref to what knick said … please comment on the research aspects of the post!</p>

[collegeseeker111]

<p>

Isn’t Dartmouth called Dartmouth College and not Dartmouth University??? Nevermind. Just a ref to what knick said … please comment on the research aspects of the post!

</p>

<p>If you read what knickknackpatty actually said, you would realize he quoted someone in saying that Dartmouth is a university in everything but name. Meaning Dartmouth is a university, in spite of the fact that it is Dartmouth College.</p>

[adrivit]

<p>Ok, I do get what I he said … but that’s irrelevant actually. Can anyone comment some more on the research facilities, probably someone who has already been there … Thanks!!</p>

[spideyunlimited]

<p>Anyone? …</p>

[rightnotleft]

<p>I can’t compare to MIT’s facilities, seeing as I’ve never done research there, but I can tell you that it’s incredibly easy to get an opportunity to do research with a prof here, especially in smaller departments (ie any of the sciences, pretty much anything except econ/govt, and there it might be easy, i wouldn’t know). Basically, all you have to do is go up to a prof and tell them you want to do research. I’ve had nothing but incredibly supportive and positive reactions from faculty, and they usually go out of their way to get you set up.</p>

<p>As far as the facilities, Dartmouth has pretty much state of the art equipment for anything you’d need, and if we don’t have it and you can convince the department that having something would be a great benefit, they’ll order you one.</p>

<p>All departments have professors who are really big deals in their respective fields, and more often than not they’ll bend over backwards to get you involved easily, and usually pay you pretty well too.</p>

<p>So yea. Dartmouth is awesome for research, esp. in the sciences.</p>

[wisconsinguy]

<p>As a science major at D, I will say that rightnotleft is right not wrong on this one. Research opportunities abound in whatever department, science or nonscience, one goes into. In my case, a professor whose class I was taking was impressed with my work (I was one of only two sophomores in a class mostly consisting of graduate students and senior honors majors), and invited me to join the lab on an amazing project that ultimately culminated into a senior thesis. Many of my friends have similar stories. And my advisor really was willing to ‘go to bat’ for me too–she has written at least four separate letters of recommendation for me, which have gotten me some great fellowships and into some amazing programs.</p>

<p>Facilities vary–some of the buildings are somewhat older, but are in the process of being renovated or replaced. That said, in terms of equipment, I always found Dartmouth had what I needed, and I could get access to it quickly.</p>

[adrivit]

<p>Thanks!!! Hmmm … positive posts!!! (Which increases the dilemma …)</p>

[spideyunlimited]

<p>dilemma? why? lol</p>

[adrivit]

<p>As if you don’t know … does applying ED to Dartmouth increases chances of gettin in??</p>

[tetrisfan]

<p>No, ED doesn’t particularly increase your chances. Only apply ED if it’s clearly your first choice school.</p>

[collegeseeker111]

<p>

As if you don’t know … does applying ED to Dartmouth increases chances of gettin in??

</p>

<p>When I applied, I came in with that perception. But I didn’t really grasp just how many legacies / athletes come in ED. I think it helps, but not as much as you’d think.</p>

[adrivit]

<p>OK. Athletes and legacies … didn’t think about that!</p>

[sybbie719]

<p>Almost half of the ED pool consists of hood applicants (athletes, legacies, developmental admits,facbrats, etc.)</p>

[atrophicwhisper]

<p>^ Sybbie, where did you find this? Can you show me an article or something (I’m interested to see this info)?</p>

[sybbie719]

<p>A couple of years ago the D ran a series of 5 articles about admissions.</p>

<p>Article # 5</p>

<p>

In admissions, many get ‘special’ attention</p>

<p>By Zachary Goldstein
The Dartmouth (Dartmouth College)
05/13/2004</p>

<p>(U-WIRE) HANOVER, N.H. — Minorities, legacies and elite high schools — all seem to benefit during the admissions process. With acceptance rates above average for these groups, is the average well-rounded applicant facing an uphill climb? Yes and no. </p>

<p>But acceptance rates are not high only for these groups. Athletes and students with 800 SAT scores also gain admission at a disproportionately high rate, Dean of Admissions Karl Furstenberg said. Rates are also higher for students with exceptional essays and above-4.0 GPAs. With so many people applying for admission at one of the top 10 schools in the country, it takes a combination of many factors to get that thick envelope come April. </p>

<p>On the other hand, roughly 40 percent of applicants are given some sort of extra attention — minorities, legacies or athletes. This year, 24 percent of applicants were students of color, 3 percent legacies, and roughly 13 to 17 percent were athletes, based on estimates. This 40 percent of the applicants has a combined admit rate nearly double the overall level. </p>

<p>Athletic admissions statistics are not released by the admissions office. Some speculate that athletes — particularly those for big sports — are given the highest preference of all. This does not appear to be the case at Dartmouth, although athletes do benefit from having a lobbyist in their coach. Coaches submit ranked lists of their recruited athletes to the admissions office. The admissions office then reviews the applications, taking into account the applicant’s athletic talent and coach’s recommendation. </p>

<p>“Athletic talent works in the same way other kinds of talent do. The only difference is it’s a much more organized and structured recruiting process and that’s a function of the NCAA and the Ivy League rules,” Furstenberg said. “They tell us who they want, but there are no guaranteed number of slots.” </p>

<p>But even with the ability to submit a list, some coaches expressed frustration with how little say they really have. </p>

<p>“How much clout do I have? Minimal,” men’s swimming coach Jim Wilson said. “If you look at my SAT scores and compare to the average SAT scores, my kids may be getting in with a 1450 instead of a 1460.” </p>

<p>Wilson did, however, speculate that some of the “higher-profile sports like football may be getting a little more help.” </p>

<p>Coaches are given little feedback from the admissions office before submitting their lists, according to Wilson. “I’m shooting blind,” he said, adding that other schools, even in the Ivy League, are actually more lenient with athletic admissions. </p>

<p>“Some schools will say ‘if he has this GPA and this SAT score were going to let him in.’ Our admissions doesn’t do that,” Wilson said. </p>

<p>Michele Hernandez '89, who worked in the Dartmouth College admissions office in the mid-1990s and is currently a private college counselor, concurred. </p>

<p>“Dartmouth actually has higher standards for athletes than most schools,” she said. “Many athletes that are walking straight into Harvard couldn’t get into Dartmouth.” </p>

<p>While athletic talent can bolster an application, it does not replace other criteria for admission, according to Furstenberg. If coaches do not find well qualified applicants to put on their list, they risk not getting enough players that year. </p>

<p>“If the coaches say we need nine soccer players this year, but we only think six of them are qualified, that’s what they get,” he said. “All of the decisions are made here; the only person at the institution who can admit someone is me.” </p>

<p>Based on acceptance rates alone, African-American students have the best chance of getting into Dartmouth, with legacies right behind them. African Americans were accepted into the Class of 2008 at a rate of 44.6 percent, while legacies had a 35.4 percent acceptance rate. Native Americans and Latinos enjoyed acceptance rates of 34.6 and 29 percent, respectively. </p>

<p>With so much of the applicant pool enjoying these benefits, it leaves others receiving below-average acceptance rates. </p>

<p>White Americans, who make up over 60 percent of applicants, had an acceptance rate of 16.2 percent. International students had the hardest time getting into Dartmouth, accepted at a rate of only 10.2 percent. </p>

<p>**“Roughly 40 percent of applicants are ‘tagged’ in some way. **That means 60 percent aren’t,” Hernandez said. “Overall, the SAT average is not coming from the 40 percent tagged acceptances. The 60 percent have to have higher numbers to pull up the tagged applicants getting a break.” </p>

<p>Breaking down statistics from the Class of 2008 applicant pool, the “tagged” applicants are not the only ones receiving a bit of an advantage. Because more male applicants apply to Dartmouth, but the goal male-to-female ratio of the admit class is 50:50, male applicants were accepted at a below-average rate of 16.8 percent, while female applicants were accepted at a rate of 20.1 percent. This difference will likely continue unless female applications catch up with their male counterparts. </p>

<p>But what does all this mean? Well, for one, that no matter how you look at it and no matter who you are, Dartmouth is one of the most selective institutions in the country. </p>

<p>“There are probably no more than about 50 institutions in America that admit less than 50 percent of their applicants,” Furstenberg said, “and you wouldn’t find any population in our pool that gets admitted above 50 percent.” </p>

<p>The other interpretation? If you’re an African American female legacy who plays hockey and has at least one 800 SAT score and a GPA above 4.0 … welcome to Dartmouth. </p>

<p>[TheDartmouth.com</a> | In admissions, many get ‘special’ attention](<a href=“http://thedartmouth.com/2004/05/13/news/in/]TheDartmouth.com”>http://thedartmouth.com/2004/05/13/news/in/)

</p>

[sybbie719]

<p>Artilcle 4</p>

<p>

Top high schools, public or private, place grads well</p>

<p>Editor’s Note: This is the fourth in a series of articles examining higher education admissions in the wake of last year’s University of Michigan Supreme Court decisions. This article examines the role socio-economic class plays in admissions.</p>

<p>From SAT tutoring to private college counseling, families are willing to pay almost anything to get their children into the college of their dreams. Some take it a step further, paying upwards of $20,000 annual tuition at some of the most elite private schools in the country to prepare their children for top colleges.</p>

<p>While statistics seem to show that attending an elite high school improves chances of admission to college, there seems to be very little distinction between public and private. Statistics suggest that it may even be slightly more difficult to get into Dartmouth coming from a private school.</p>

<p>Nearly 65 percent of the applicants for the Class of 2008 came from public schools and were accepted at rate just slightly above Dartmouth’s overall rate. 18.8 percent of public school applicants were accepted compared to 18.3 percent of overall applicants. By comparison, only 18.l percent of private school applicants and 13.9 percent of parochial school applicants — also technically private schools — were given admission.</p>

<p>Dean of Admissions Karl Furstenberg dismissed any notion that there was preference given along public versus private school lines.</p>

<p>“There’s no point in having a preference for public school or private school,” he said. “The preference is for interesting and talented kids.”</p>

<p>At Phillips Andover Academy in Massachusetts, one of the most prestigious private schools in the country, 16 of the 40 students who applied for the Class of 2006 were admitted — a full 40 percent.</p>

<p>But the acceptance rate for Stuyvesant High School in New York City, an elite public school, was even higher. Of 73 seniors who applied to Dartmouth, 32 got in.</p>

<p>In her book “A is for Admission” Michele Hernandez ‘89, a former Dartmouth admissions officer and currently a private college consultant, reported similar numbers form other top schools in the mid-1990s. She recalled a year during which the Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology, a selective public magnet school in Virginia, sent 29 applicants to and got 14 accepted — nearly 50 percent.</p>

<p>Whether public or private, it seems clear that students attending any elite school do appear to be receiving a benefit — though not necessarily in the admissions process itself.</p>

<p>It is the increased educational opportunity at these elite high schools that improves an applicant’s chances, not any benefit given to the applicant during the admissions process itself, according to Stephen Singer, director of college counseling at Horace Mann School in New York City. He speculated that it may even be more difficult for students from elite schools to stand out as exceptional among the overall applicant pool because they face more competition from within their own school.</p>

<p>Furstenberg, however, said that applicants are not compared to others applying from the same high school.</p>

<p>But, he said, some are miffed when they find that receiving a diploma from a prestigious private school does not guarantee admission to Dartmouth — even if the high school has a history of sending many of its students to the College.</p>

<p>“A lot students and families at elite private schools feel like part of what they’re buying is access to the kind of schools like Dartmouth. But you just can’t afford to have any kind of special relationship with any school based upon history,” he said. “Admissions is a very future-oriented activity. What’s relevant to us is where are the talented students?”</p>

<p>It is because of this “class warfare” in admissions and because of debates over race-based affirmative action that people like Hernandez are proposing replacing race as a factor in admissions with a consideration of income.</p>

<p>“If socio-economic class were considered instead of race, you would pick up minorities in that pool, and it would be a more fair evaluation,” said Hernandez.</p>

<p>Furstenberg admitted that there were “educational arguments” and “fairness arguments” for giving an advantage to first-generation college students and low-income students who “as a national population haven’t had as much access to educational opportunities.” However, two things in particular make it difficult, he said.</p>

<p>First, it’s difficult to turn down yet another highly-qualified applicant in order to accept a student who has not yet had an opportunity to prove himself.</p>

<p>Second, admitting more first- generation low-income students adds strain to the financial aid budget. Financial aid is a major expense for the College and has been growing at a double digit rate, according to Furstenberg.</p>

<p>“I think you’d have to consider very carefully about just how you are going to do this because you don’t want to, all of a sudden, add $5 million to your financial aid budget.”</p>

<p>But a third, unmentioned complication is need-blind admissions. Most of the best colleges and universities now use need-blind admissions, meaning they do not take an applicant’s financial aid needs into account when reviewing an application. However, need-blind admissions also prevents the admissions office from definitively knowing whether an applicant is low-income and has missed out on educational advantages other, more affluent students had.</p>

<p>Even without consideration of socio-economic background, Dartmouth has managed to incorporate a large number of low income and first-generation college students. According to rough figures from the admissions office, 16 percent of Dartmouth students are first-generation college. Meanwhile, 15 percent of the College — though not necessarily the same group — come from families with annual incomes below $45,000.</p>

<p>“Essentially a third of our financial aid candidates are in this low income category, and that’s more than other Ivies,” Furstenberg said.
[TheDartmouth.com</a> | Top high schools, public or private, place grads well](<a href=“http://thedartmouth.com/2004/05/12/news/top/]TheDartmouth.com”>http://thedartmouth.com/2004/05/12/news/top/)

</p>