Tangent
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There are probably high schools that have to offer pre-algebra (-1 math track).
However, comparing the high school I attended decades ago versus now, the math level appears to be higher now. Back then, the norm was +0, with some on the +1 and -1 tracks, with a student on +2 every few years. Now, it seems that +1 is the most common, and there are enough +2 to fill classes. Both the local SES level and college going rate have increased (the college going rate was about a third to four year colleges then but almost all now).
Also, there were not many AP classes then (two were English literature and calculus BC, three were three different foreign languages, and there may have been about two others), and students did not try to take the maximum (meaning all non foreign language ones plus one foreign language). Now, there are many more…
Could the possibility of massive job losses due to AI as discussed in ChatGPT and the Future of Colleges have something to do with increased student striving and parental pushing?
If AI cuts 25% of jobs across industries and job categories (as discussed in the linked thread), that means that the bar of achievement, credentialing, or some other desired status to find a place in the labor market becomes significantly higher. Of course, of the remaining 75%, the bottom end of that is most vulnerable to future advances in AI, so it is best to be at the elite end of the labor class, at least until one is able to join the capitalist class.
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The increased student striving precedes chatgpt, but is consistent with competition from abroad – specifically China and India in some of the higher paying industries, and to general automation (before even AI has come along) and hollowing out of various industries.
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If fear of AI/ChatGPT was a primary driver of perfectionism and parental pushing, then we’d expect to see a sharp change in perfectionism/pushing behavior as AI/ChatGPT because more well known and more advanced. I haven’t seen any evidence of this occurring. I don’t doubt that perfectionism has increased, but I believe it is more of a gradual trend, without sharp changes soon after ChatGPT became well known.
Employment fears are nothing new, nor is fear of technological advances/changes. Rather than perfectionism, there is more evidence for these types of fears influencing things like major choice. For example, there was a decline in tech majors following the dot com bust. Any time there is a recession, there is a corresponding change in major distribution. If AI causes perception of different employment fields to change, then I’d also expect a corresponding change in distribution of related majors.
Unless students, like their parents, worry that AI will affect most jobs and there really aren’t “safe” majors
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Copy machine or appliance repair or automotive or aviation mechanics ? Plumbing ?
Oh, yeah not at traditional colleges.
The list of most affected industries pretty much covered most traditional college majors.
It is like surfing. I guess you need to be ahead of the wave, if you can be.
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Inflated grades are the norms in most US high schools. Standardized test scores are no longer needed in most cases for college admissions. We’ve effectively created a system where a slight grade “imperfection” may make an outsized difference in some cases. Who actually deserves more blame for the pursuit of “perfection” among some students and their families?
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I am actually curious if kids are in fact trying to be perfect. In any class there may be a handful. But are most kids feeling the compulsion to be perfect? Do we have documented evidence on this? Do we also have evidence of student stress, any more than what students had in the past? I don’t mind back in the 60s – I mean more recent past such as the 90s, or the 00s. or even the past decade?
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It’s not just believing that most jobs aren’t safe regardless of major. It would require believing that only the perfectionists get jobs. For example, a notable portion of students believe that getting a few B’s will keep them out of Harvard or keep them out of med school. A notable portion of students would need to similarly believe that because of AI, getting a few B’s will keep them from getting a quality job. I haven’t seen any evidence of this being a common belief. There are a few unique employment fields where a notable portion of students believe that they need straight A’s, but this pattern did not change in response to AI.
That was the case for SATs as well - a 1510 versus 1560 is a brain fart or experience. The effects of a wrong answer in determining the SAT score is also oversized. The differences are far smaller than people seem to believe, especially since the correlation between number of correct answers does not have linear relationship with the scores, and the score does not have a linear relationship with the percentile.
So tests are exactly the same - a small test “imperfection” leads to an outsized difference.
But tests are worse, since that “small difference” can be the result of a single bad morning or night, while the small difference in GPA is generally the result of a semester or year long difference in performance.
We indeed do:
https://publications.aap.org/aapnews/news/8333?autologincheck=redirected
That’s what happens when you make the tests easier. The US aversion to long tail testing continues to baffle me. I guess its a natural consequence of not wanting to make people feel bad…
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In my average public high school it’s quite rare TBH. More kids don’t care about their grades than do. The vast majority are happy with Bs. The vast majority of the college bound are also heading to state schools of some sort or private schools that give them aid to be similarly expensive (certainly not Ivies for these kids).
I suspect in many of the good public schools and especially private schools where parents are paying a ton and want results it’s less rare.
I suspect the stress on students is higher at the latter too.
Even adults move here from cities because they like the more laid back (aka less stress) atmosphere - along with the gorgeous scenery. We get a lot of retirees from elsewhere, along with families.
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Making them more difficult still doesn’t solve the issue of high stakes tests that really do not reflect the type of skills that colleges need. Being able to do well on one standardized test does not say much about the ability to do the daily, weekly semester and year-long continuous work that is required in college.
I think that what the USA needs is a standardization of high school curricula and grading. Also of teaching, food, facilities, etc. That will make GPA a lot more meaningful.
Watch the book bannings, etc. to learn quickly why there will NEVER be a standardization of HS curricula. We are not France.
One can always dream…
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Absolutely. Especially if you thought that controversy over education ended with the Scopes Trial!
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Perhaps the supposed drive to perfection is a not irrational response to a shrinking pie-a hollowed out middle class, fewer job opportunities, more competition for the existing jobs,the threat of AI-students cant control much in an uncertain world, but may feel an exceptional academic record will help them weather the uncertainties ahead.
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