<p>Over the course of a student's junior and senior year what are the best thee times, windows of oppurtunity if you will, for a student to take the SAT1. An earlier poster mentioned January of Junior year so one might brush up on problem encountered areas encountered on the PSAT (taken in Oct.). Are there built in gaps in most HS curiculums that afford a student more of an oppurtinity to prepare. I also understand SATII's, if taken, can conflict. I guess I'm asking when most juniors and seniors take the SATI if they've decided that three times is the optimum.</p>
<p>There is no typical schedule.</p>
<p>What is typical, in my experience, is for kids to completely ignore the SAT Subject Tests until late in junior year/early in senior year and then frantically try to figure out which tests to take and when to take them. That definitely works to the student's disadvantage.</p>
<p>As for the SAT, it depends on the kid's goals. My first kid, who aspired to our state university, took the SAT once, in April (I think) of his junior year, got a score that he knew was high enough for State U, and never took it again. My second kid took it in January of her junior year, was disappointed with one of her scores, took it again in May of her junior year, was pleased with the result, and didn't take it a third time. But she knew that if she had wanted to take it a third time, she still had an opportunity to do so on the first senior year test date even though she planned to apply Early Decision.</p>
<p>marian:</p>
<p>while the OP did not ask about Subject Tests, the best strategy is to take them in the spring of the year that the student takes the class -- even better if its an AP class that year. Math 2 requires completion of precalc.</p>
<p>"There's a train of thought that the ACT is not looked upon as favorably as the SAT at selective schools, but I don't think that's at all true these days."</p>
<p>There may be some truth to that rumor. When I called Penn's admission office to ask if a 34 ACT should be cause for a re-take (family dispute), the person on the phone said "Tell him to take the SAT I instead. We prefer it, because the broader score range gives us more information." That was just a few months ago.</p>
<p>But no school admits that in writing, as far as I can tell.</p>
<p>slight correction to above. Thinking back to when S took the ACT, that conversation with Penn admit office would have been sometime during the last school year. Also, the Penn statement does not necessarily mean they disparage the ACT. In our case, S wanted to retake the ACT, and the rep suggested taking the SAT I instead of retaking ACT.</p>
<p>I agree with you, bluebayou. I just wanted to make sure that the OP realized that SAT Subject Tests should be taken into account when planning a testing schedule. A student might want to take one or more of those tests more than once, too.</p>
<p>The issue of whether colleges really look at all the applicant's scores even though they say they are only looking at the highest scores also applies to SAT Subject Tests -- maybe even more so. Many colleges say that they require any two SAT Subject Tests and that they use the two highest scores if the student has taken more than two tests. Theoretically, then, they should consider each of the following students to have the same Subject Test scores:</p>
<p>Student A: French 750, U.S. History 700, Math IIC 650
Student B: French 750, U.S. History 700, Math IIC 550</p>
<p>But do they really consider these students to be equivalent in terms of Subject Test scores? Who knows?</p>
<p>" But do they really consider these students to be equivalent in terms of Subject Test scores? Who knows?"</p>
<p>It might even depend on the school. I gather that some schools make a little card where they fill out the highest SAT score, the required SAT scores etc. Extra scores might not make it into the file that is actually examined. But other schools seem to look at all the information.</p>
<p>As for when to take the tests. This is not what we did, but if you strictly want to optimize your ability to send only the best scores to college. You'd take the ACT first, then the SAT2s only if required, sending in them in before sitting for the SAT1 so that if you didn't like your SAT1 score you wouldn't have to send it in. Of course this requires having your entire college list ready before you take the SAT1. </p>
<p>We knew from the PSAT score that the SAT was unlikely to give us any major headaches. In that case I think taking the SAT1s in January gives you time for a second sitting in May or June if you don't like the scores and a third senior year. May or June of Junior year is probably also an optimum time to take SAT2s though some may have taken courses as sophomores that cover material and should take them then. I agree if you take an AP course in a subject the SAT2 is likely to be a breeze in comparison. Take the tests at the same time.</p>
<p>The principle of "if you take the AP course, the SAT Subject Test will be easy" applies to biology, chemistry, U.S. history, and probably foreign languages. (Scroll down through the Parents Forum a bit for a thread where this is extensively discussed for U.S. history.) </p>
<p>The principle may not apply to physics, where there are two AP courses focused on different topics, and the SAT Subject Test is not as specialized as either of these courses. </p>
<p>It definitely does not apply to math; the AP math courses are 100% calculus; the SAT Subject Test is 0% calculus. </p>
<p>I haven't heard any opinions about whether it applies to world history or literature.</p>
<p>A version of mathmom's test scheduling strategy can be used for kids who are applying to one college that requires them to take a specific SAT Subject Test on which they may score poorly but who do not want the other colleges on their list to see that score. (For example, certain colleges specifically require a math test, and not everybody excels in math. Students who don't excel in math might not want colleges that merely require "any two Subject Tests" to see their math score.) </p>
<p>The trick is to take all of the other SAT Subject Tests one needs as early as possible (say, by the end of 11th grade) and send the scores to all the other colleges to which the student is applying. Then, in early 12th grade, take the Subject Test on which the low score is anticipated, and send it only to the one college that requires it. The other colleges will never see the score.</p>
<p>Of course, like mathmom's strategy, this requires the student to assemble a final college list very early.</p>
<p>SAT physics correlates very well with AP Physics B. The two AP Physics C courses are more specialized than the SAT physics exam. Furthermore, the AP Physics C courses are calculused based, but the SAT physics exam is not. </p>
<p>The history exams correlate well between the AP courses and the SAT exams. Once a student has studied for the multiple choice portion of the AP, he has essentially also studied for the SAT.</p>
<p>"I do think I would wonder why student B would take the SAT I so many times and ask the question whether such a student would be a good "fit" at the college if most admittees had taken it a couple of times."</p>
<p>I doubt that my own D2 will even be able to take it "many times," btw, so this is a disclaimer. (Given the need for some intellectual readiness, actual preparation/practice, the time window for registration, the few opportunities to take the SAT during the acad. yr, yadayada, I always wonder about how realistic it is to have "many" opportunities, within a relatively short time, to increase one's score.) That said, here's my point:</p>
<p>A situation that might warrant repeated tests would be the following (and boy, do I know many <em>current</em> cases like this, among h.s. juniors & seniors): </p>
<p>(a)You're documented LD, you have documented accommodation at school & have fulfilled all the CB requirements for the paperwork, & still are refused time accommodation from CB -- although you've met the bar for all their supposed parameters for accommodation. (And appeals are doing no good -- naturally.)</p>
<p>(b) You've been tested professionally & it is documented that time accommodation is warranted, but your high school won't buy it because your grades in tough courses seem to indicate that you're just too damn smart. (Never mind the hoops you've had to jump through without help to achieve those grades singlehandedly.)</p>
<p>In those cases I could see taking the SAT repeatedly in the hope that one of the sittings would yield a better grade on a portion, & I would explain all the above to the college (app or attachment). (In the case of #a, I would also attach the flippin' documentation, to embarrass CB.)</p>
<p>End of rant. Sorry. Back to your discussion.</p>
<p>I remember my son telling me that AP Chemistry and SAT Chemistry have some disconnects, too.</p>
<p>Just a reminder that, more than likely, your high school sends all the scores--ACT, SAT, SATll's, etc--to every institution, employer, etc. that gets your high school transcript. I'm thinking that most people are not aware of this....</p>
<p>ah, but not if they don't have them. I suggest that students NEVER list their high school when registering for these tests.</p>
<p>Check with your HS. Our guidance department used to put AP scores of 4 or 5 on transcripts, but not SAT or ACT scores. They have informed us that ALL College Board scores belong to the students and it is their option/responsibility to have scores sent directly from the College Board and that they are no longer allowewd to put them on the transcript. Therefore colleges will only see what you send.</p>
<p>I think it makes sense not to name colleges for the free score reports unless you are CERTAIN that you want those scores sent. For some students, it is obvious that their ACT score conversion will be higher than their SAT will likely get to, even with multiple sittings. In that case, you probably are better off submitting the ACT scores. OF course, if the school requires SATII subject test, this doesn't work. </p>
<p>I thought that xiggis advice from several years ago was good. Paraphrased, it was that "" while an admissions representative might somehow discount a score that resulted from many sittings, you could be certain that they would never add 40 or 50 points to your score because you only took the test once.</p>
<p>Its my unverified opinion that at the highly competitive, top 10 schools, there IS a difference in scoring, say, low 1500s compared to high 1500s. In fact, if you are male, there is a great difference, because we can be fairly certain that the 75th %tile break point for males is higher than the published number, which is the "blended" number for males and females taken together. (this assumes a school which is about 50/50 male/female. In those extreme "right- tail" score schools, I think its worth retaking if you think there is a decent chance to pop one of the scores up by 40-50 points.</p>
<p>One way to get a "free" shot at increasing your score is to complete ALL of your testing by fall of senior year, and then do one final retake of the SAT at the last sitting date that can make it to the colleges before they read the apps. If you don't like the score when you get it, just don't send the last one. It requires that you decline the free reports, and pay later if you liked it, but it serves the purpose of one last shot that you don't need to disclose.</p>
<p>dadx: I like your "free" shot tactic. I'm going to do just that! Thanks!</p>
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<p>I can't imagine a school averaging SAT scores since many tests are taken in different years --- It wouldn't be fair to average an SAT score taken as a freshman with a much higher SAT score taken as a senior.</p>
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Its my unverified opinion that at the highly competitive, top 10 schools, there IS a difference in scoring, say, low 1500s compared to high 1500s. In fact, if you are male, there is a great difference, because we can be fairly certain that the 75th %tile break point for males is higher than the published number, which is the "blended" number for males and females taken together.
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<p>That's an interesting rationale, dadx. Can you explain it a little more? I mean, I know that the SAT is the part of a college application package where the male applicant is most likely to shine, but I'm not sure why you would think that a college would think that a difference between, 1520 and 1570 is more important for a guy than a girl.</p>
<p>The difference in scores is equally important for both of them.</p>
<p>However, there are about twice as many males in the extreme high end of the score range as females, primarily because of math scores, but also because females do not outscore the males at the upper levels, despite what is (inaccurately) reported about male and female performace. </p>
<p>Its all in the college board data tables.</p>
<p>My point is simply that if the %tile break point were subdivided by gender, at Harvard, Yale, Princeton and others, the 75%tile point would be higher for males, and lower for females, than the number reported........which is obviously the combined number. Said differently, being at the 75th %tile break point is more impressive for women than for men at those super high score colleges.</p>
<p>The schools around here also get Kaplan, et al to come and administer "practice SATs" to students for free or a minimal fee. DS1 just did this (cost was $10) -- he has never taken the SAT and we figured it might be good endurance training w/the new format. It's also a good run-through for the PSAT in a few weeks (and this year it counts). No report to CB, we'll know where he stands, and we'll ignore their solicitations for tutoring.</p>