<p>I actually think CMC is more known for being an almost even split rather than being ‘moderate’. I don’t know if that’s what you mean though.</p>
<p>As for Georgetown? Hardly. Georgetown is notorious for being a very liberal Catholic university who often gets in trouble for it with the church.</p>
<p>Hi, I’m the OP and you all have such great insight. I especially like what you’re saying ‘Baelor’ and ‘mom2collegekids’ you’re dead on. I do enjoy watching you decipher my motives, but I should’ve been more clear. I think its important to have an “environment where both sides are debated and discussed,” but I also stand by my words that i want “the students of the school to be grounded in the same principles as I am.” </p>
<p>Here’s how I see it:
I know myself enough to say that to go to a college where the strong majority stands on principles opposite of mine and hear them leak those liberal trends of relativism and such into their philosophy, history, and political science would be like me forcing myself to sit through 4 hours of MSNBC a day. I just wouldnt get much out of it. and also, I say again that I also want people who relate to me, my best friends have been those who I could speak very deeply and honestly with about things that only they, being “likeminded,” can appreciate and feel me on. </p>
<p>I do have to say though, I know that I am certainly not yet wise, but I just say those things from what I think would suit me best.</p>
<p>Also, I’d certainly rather go to an unaffiliated school like Princeton and know that what I’m getting may be secular… rather than going to Georgetown and being taught stuff that is not in line with the church’s authority and guidance but being labeled as Catholic.</p>
<p>Christendom College or Furman University might work. Baylor is another possibility … though it’s not Catholic of course. Conservative views would be welcomed at each of these. I’m still unclear how OP will determine that the student body is grounded in the same principles.</p>
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<p>As a Catholic parent, I completely agree. I get sick when I hear a young (or older) Catholic spout out some nonsense about the faith that he/she “learned” from some left-wing priest at ND or Georgetown or similar.</p>
<p>My kids are at Alabama. The student body is middle-ground (Obama ruled last Nov), the profs are middle to left of center, some are more left. However, my kids feel comfortable speaking their opinions even to the more left-leaning profs, maybe because the rest of the classroom isn’t completely tilted left. If the profs AND the students were all leaning hard left, it would be hard to be the “voice in the wilderness” expressing a different point of view.</p>
<p>I know some conservative kids who are comfortable at Santa Clara University. Jesuit, like Georgetown, but not as liberal, despite the Bay area location.</p>
<p>going with the catholic schools I’m seeing, which would get me into the best graduate program in philosophy between University of Dallas, Christendom College, Thomas Aquinas College? Anybody have an opinion?</p>
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<p>LOL. Obviously someone needs to spend time at top universities and interact with the wide-ranging political beliefs of the student bodies.</p>
<p>Fair enough, but I’d like to hear some other ideas on the reasons why so many have the impression, right or wrong, that “the USNews list of top 25 schools” are left-leaning. I do agree with mom2collegekids that they are, but apparently for different reasons. 
I think it is the nature of what they do that attracts left-leaning professors, which produces a left-leaning reputation, which attracts many left-leaning students. I’ve read many complaints here, I thought by conservatives, that the majority of colleges are left-leaning, but that’s not to say that there aren’t wide-ranging political beliefs of student bodies, more at some than others.</p>
<p>Bottom line, I disagree with Baelor that most colleges are conservative (i.e., laughing at my view that most colleges are not very conservative).</p>
<p>VERY relevant:</p>
<p>[The</a> Yale Law Journal - Deliberative Trouble? Why Groups Go to Extremes](<a href=“Page Not Found :(”>Page Not Found :()</p>
<p>Short version: Choosing to go to a place where you’re the majority makes you go to extremes. Its better for you, AND the liberals, to be in a more mixed, balanced situation.</p>
<p>And yes, Cass Sunstein is more liberal. But if you deny he’s brilliant, you’re deluding yourself, and this fact cuts both ways. MSNBC is just as bad as Fox. (I get my news from foreign news sources, though even that’s starting to get a bit slanted for me…)</p>
<p>In short, I disagree with Baelor pretty directly, though not fully: I DO think that liberal OR conservative students who choose VERY conservative, or VERY liberal schools do themselves a disservice. You need to be comfortable on campus, but if you prevent yourself from being exposed to opposing ideas at all, then yes, you’re harming your own intellectual development. If the OP wants to really study Philosophy, he’d be best served being able to go toe to toe with ideas fully in opposition to his. Its a discipline of confrontation and rational debate, not just quiet contemplation.</p>
<p>And as I said in the other version of this thread, your concerns about Notre Dame fairly noted, they’re more likely to admit you than Princeton, frankly, and their Philosophy department is almost as good (and less polluted by Utilitarians).</p>
<p>Just some thoughts, no answers:</p>
<p>If I were OP I might check into whether some of the christian-affiliated colleges, such as Fordham and Iona in NY, or Rockhurst U in Kansas City, might be friendlier than most. It may turn out that in actuality individual schools might lean either way, in the middle, or nowhere, but it seems to me that if a solid chunk of attendees are "people of the “right” faith,and the school as an institution has not divested itself of its religious affiliation, that’s got to be a decent starting point to look, anyway. Schools located in relatively conservative parts of the country might tend to be more promising, since most people attend college within 4 hours of their home.</p>
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<p>I never once said this. You really need to stop fabricating statements.</p>
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<p>I support this statement 100%. You must disagree with a notion that you attribute to me but that I never made.</p>
<p>“Very conservative” =/= conservative. You will find many liberals at ND. BYU might be a different story.</p>
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<p>I think if you’re going to major in Philosophy, you should go to a Catholic college. Unfortunately, there are too many atheists in the philosophy depts at secular schools, and too much time is spent with profs declaring that God doesn’t exist.</p>
<p>As to your list of Catholic U’s…
St. Thomas Aquinas (Santa Paula, CA) [Thomas</a> Aquinas College](<a href=“http://www.thomasaquinas.edu/]Thomas”>http://www.thomasaquinas.edu/)</p>
<p>St. Thomas offers a unique program where every student follows the same curriculum - one based on the “great books” - a classical education. It doesn’t have a philosophy major, because everyone gets the same liberal arts degree. However, I think you should look at this…this may be very good for you.
[The</a> Degree](<a href=“http://www.thomasaquinas.edu/curriculum/degree.htm]The”>http://www.thomasaquinas.edu/curriculum/degree.htm)</p>
<p>They use the Socratic method.
[The</a> Socratic Method](<a href=“http://www.thomasaquinas.edu/curriculum/socratic.htm]The”>http://www.thomasaquinas.edu/curriculum/socratic.htm)</p>
<p>Why they use the Great Books…
[Great</a> Books](<a href=“http://www.thomasaquinas.edu/curriculum/greatbooks.htm]Great”>http://www.thomasaquinas.edu/curriculum/greatbooks.htm)</p>
<p>Plus, for a private…they’re cheap…not much more than an instate public… I think total cost - including room and board - is less than $30k</p>
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Sorry, I misunderstood your “LOL” objection to my statement that “Most colleges and universities are … not very conservative.”</p>
<p>University of Dallas [University</a> of Dallas - Home](<a href=“http://udallas.deyogroup.com/library/]University”>http://udallas.deyogroup.com/library/)
Philosophy dept… [University</a> of Dallas - Philosophy Department Home](<a href=“http://udallas.deyogroup.com/academics/undergrad/majors/philosophy]University”>http://udallas.deyogroup.com/academics/undergrad/majors/philosophy)</p>
<p>Requirements for the Philosophy Major - Forty Credits in Philosophy, including:</p>
<p>Phi 3325 Ancient Philosophy
Phi 3326 Medieval Philosophy
Phi 3327 Early Modern Philosophy
Phi 3328 Recent Philosophy
Phi 3339 Symbolic Logic
Phi 3351 Junior Seminar
Phi 4141 Senior Thesis
Phi 4331 Epistemology or 4333 Philosophy of Science
Phi 4336 Ethics or a Special Topics in Ethics course
Phi 4337 Philosophy of God or 4338 Philosophy of Religion
Phi 4341 Senior Seminar </p>
<p>Also required, in the spring semester of the senior year, is a passing grade on a special written comprehensive examination (covering the entirety of the student’s coursework, a departmental reading list, and also testing his or her ability to comment intelligently on philosophic texts) with a follow-up oral examination. In case of failure on either the written or oral portions one retake is permitted. </p>
<p>Students should seek electives in other departments, such as Theology, English, Politics and Psychology, which will inform and broaden their philosophical experience.</p>
<p>Christendom College - Virginia
[Christendom</a> College–Roman Catholic Liberal Arts College in Front Royal, Virginia :: Catholic College](<a href=“http://www.christendom.edu/]Christendom”>http://www.christendom.edu/)</p>
<p>Philosophy dept: [::</a> Christendom College :: Philosophy and Natural Science Department](<a href=“http://www.christendom.edu/academics/depts/phil.shtml]::”>http://www.christendom.edu/academics/depts/phil.shtml)</p>
<p>Requirements for major: [::</a> Christendom College :: Philosophy and Natural Science Department](<a href=“http://www.christendom.edu/academics/depts/phil.shtml#req]::”>http://www.christendom.edu/academics/depts/phil.shtml#req)</p>
<p>Junior semester in Rome (UDallas has this, too. Thomas Aquinas might, also) [::</a> Christendom College :: Academics :: Semester in Rome Program](<a href=“http://www.christendom.edu/academics/rome.shtml]::”>http://www.christendom.edu/academics/rome.shtml)</p>
<p>I posted the above info so that the OP and others could review and give the input that the OP desires.</p>
<p>I think that the OP would get what he wants from any of the above 3 colleges, because all provide outstanding programs. </p>
<p>If all things are about equal then…I think that a final decision may rest on “other issues” that are often important to prospective students - school size, location, rec facilities, social activities, res halls, cost, male/female ratio, etc.</p>
<p>I would add this…UDallas is conservative, but it is probably the least of the three. It will be more cosmopolitan than the other two - way more so. I’m not saying that is a bad thing…that may be a good thing. I think it would be a good thing.</p>
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<p>It was in response to the thoughts that preceded that statement.</p>
<p>You might also want to consider the University of Chicago.
Much of your Core course content there is likely to cover books and ideas that predate the 20th century, and in any case, to focus on “close reading” of demanding texts (not on your or the professor’s personal philosophy.) </p>
<p>Many colleges seem to lean left but actually are home to a range of viewpoints. Plus, there are other important “fit” issues besides ideology (big/small, urban/rural, climate, sports and Greek scene, pre-professional vs. strictly liberal arts, etc.)</p>
<p>^^^</p>
<p>My concern at secular colleges is that many profs in the philosophy dept are atheists and spend too much time in some phil classes arguing that God doesnt exist. That is a waste of time to a believer. </p>
<p>It’s one thing to have an intellectual discussion about whether God exists, but when your profs are rigidly against the possibility of the First Cause, and spend a lot of time on the topic, it becomes tedious.</p>
<p>At a Catholic U, the arguments against the existence of God will certainly get presented, so “both sides” will be heard.</p>
<p>“My concern at secular colleges is that many profs in the philosophy dept are atheists and spend too much time in some phil classes arguing that God doesnt exist. That is a waste of time to a believer.”</p>
<p>Not only is this egregiously false (the vast majority of professors in my department, for instance, are very observant Jews or Christians), its stupendously closed minded. You can’t study philosophy without addressing “secular” philosophers- almost none of whom have been atheists, and whose theories do not require the absence of god. Kant, Levinas, Arendt, Thomas Aquinas… And I was under the impression the catholic church was a fan of Aristotle’s work for quite some time. Furthermore, it is NOT a waste of time for a believer, from my understanding of faith, to have their faith challenged and strengthened as a result.</p>
<p>One of the first assignments in most intro classes is arguing for OR against the existence of god.</p>
<p>I find it interesting you’re familiar enough with every philosophy department at every university to slam them that hard.</p>
<p>All that being said, Christian Ethics IS a sub-field field (at many colleges its in religion), and entirely worthy of study. Those programs will obviously be stronger at Catholic schools. Notre Dame and Boston College are superb programs with somewhat more conservative leans, but will certainly have more liberals than a place like Dallas or Thomas Aquinas.</p>
<p>And Baelor, I was disagreeing with this statement: “Is every liberal student at Reed/New College/Columbia/Yale/etc. doing himself a disservice? Hardly.” But mostly in response to Reed and New College, less to Columbia or Yale (which are said to be more balanced, certainly, than the first two).</p>