I think it is not clear the restrictions in place by September will be that onerous. Restaurants and gyms will be open with 75% capacity next week here, so I expect colleges here will do the same with dining halls and fitness centers. Perhaps they will reach even higher capacity by September. I expect there will be student watch parties for sports, and some colleges will let some fans attend in limited numbers. Masks will be required inside, and some classes will be remote, but students will find a way to socialize, and perhaps even romance.
@GKUnion Some schools require students to live on campus (sometimes for a year but sometimes longer).
The only benefit to being on campus is if supply lines are hit hard again (grocery stores near us are still struggling to keep toilet paper in stock and Clorox wipes are impossible to come by) schools will pull from commercial supply chains.
I think you are right that if no major shortage of supplies happens it would be better to be off-campus but that is not a choice for many.
@roycroftmom I agree. Things are opening up in all states, no? Retail, restaurants, gyms, etc. We can now go to our mall (it’s an outdoor mall), hit the Barnes and Noble, get lunch at a table outside (which is six feet away from other tables but there are a LOT of tables and people walking around). Why would colleges be any different?
Maybe there will be times kids will have to rotate through a cafeteria or a gym. Inconvenient, yes, but I really doubt now that kids will be wearing masks and standing six feet apart picking up to-go meals. Summer camps are open with seven kids to a cabin instead of ten. That’s still way more than two kids living together in their dorm room. I don’t know why people continue to think college kids will be in lockdown in their rooms.
None of the colleges that has announced its intent to bring students back on campus has promised what portion of its classes will be in-person. In fact, all classes can be switched from in-person to online instantaneously should the need arises. There’s no guarantee any class will be in-person and stay in-person. A promise to try to have in-person classes isn’t worth much. The most challenging piece of the puzzle is how to de-densify student housing. Few of those colleges have addressed that. Stanford is one of the few exceptions but it isn’t going to bring every student back on campus at the same time.
My son’s club golf team should be relatively unaffected. Club jujitsu…that’s going to be a problem.
No. Here in Northern California I doubt we’ll have restaurants or gyms any time soon. Cities where I live are looking at opening up streets for restaurants.
Things are opening in NC… and cases (including hospitalizations) are rising. Gyms are still not opened, nor are bars.
I am basing what students will be limited to do based on what plans schools are releasing. One school said all to-go meals for dining halls, another has a plan for a single meal option if served… if students cannot even eat their meals together in the dining halls should we anticipate large groups gathering to watch sport events?
We are still waiting on info on how Bowdoin will look in the fall but S19’s daily life will look different but maybe not gloom and doom.
So, he gets up and goes to breakfast. Either has to pick something up or will have a time he can go grab some food, dons a mask for a socially distanced class with 10-12 kids in it, maybe goes back to his room or the library to log in for a remote second class. Goes back to grab some lunch at his appointed time. Finds a place to study in one of the many buildings he likes to study in after lunch or maybe meets one on one with a professor and then finds his XC buddies to run at 4:00. Long run then dinner with them socially distanced (or not? people are not socially distanced at restaurants here…and they are not divided up by family). More studying at night maybe with study group either in a dorm room or a building on campus. Or kids meet in someone’s room to watch sports on tv or something.
On the weekends, you know kids are still going to get together. In Maine right now, groups of 50 can be together. Not sure what the “party” situation will be but he’d be happy most nights hanging with ten or fewer in a dorm somewhere. Kids don’t go out to bars at Bowdoin so that’s not a thing.
Frisbee, football throwing, pick up basketball, hiking, biking, hanging out in their hammocks - all options when not studying on the weekends. Winter will be harder but that’s a bridge to cross in late January. Indiana U is doing first few weeks of second semester at home and going back mid-Feb. That would be a great idea for cold weather schools like Bowdoin too.
It seems there is a clear divide here and that is fine, but I hear very little about those who will lose out if campus is closed, the quote unquote “little people who clean campus, feed campus, keep campus running” Not sure where we should draw the line, if a professor is older ( like I am btw) or not in great health, make accommodations, what if they are healthy but a spouse is not??? I have been saying for about 5500 post college is a business and they will open in 90% of the time they have to to keep paying the bills, if schools are online only in the fall, folks may , suck it up for another semester but if it rolls around again in Jan , many will be asking what exactly are we paying for. Most schools live like most Americans it seems paycheck to paycheck, either by choice , keeping up with the Jones or bc they have no choice.
@austinmshauri - Honestly , like sports team we root for the jersey, not the players, if my kid went to a Ivy, the name on the door is much more important than the player, it may be right but that is the truth. I think in many cases most if folks are being honest that is the case, I do not know any business that ever asked who was your teacher. they look at where you went to school not who taught you. I think most teachers want to be in a classroom not on zoom, for a small number they can not be in that classroom, but that is a small number and I will trust the school and teacher to make that decision, if that number becomes a fairly large number I think that college will have a issue moving forward, unless they are a top 25 school. Just my 2 cents and I am sure you will not agree.
Looks like those things will be open next week.
There is no doubt in my mind that all states across the country will be open in a “phase 3” type level by August. Especially since protests with large groups of people were allowed to happen despite the heath prohibitions ongoing for Covid. Colleges will be able to open without alot of criticism now.
I do agree with the opinions that the survival of the college for the next 50 years and beyond is the primary goal of the board of trustees. The needs of everyone on campus rank lower than that goal. So for fall 2020 I would expect to see accommodations for faculty, students, and staff. That will probably continue thru spring 2021. But by fall 2021 I think people who have a higher risk may have to make a choice (within guidelines of OSHA, the ADA, union agreements, and state and federal regulations).
People who work on college campuses don’t have to guess what plans might be in place in the fall. Long range plans are being discussed, and unions are already negotiating for conditions to return to work. The idea that only elite faculty will have the option to work remotely is inaccurate.
The idea that teachers don’t matter and you’re just paying for a label, a brand is, frankly, beyond silly. People are the most important ingredients in higher education, just like in any other pursuit. In a college, the most important people are you, your fellow students and your teachers, not necessarily in that order. You go to college and spend four or more years of your life to get an education, not a label on your back. An empty suit with a designer label is still an empty suit.
Yes, provided their lives aren’t on the line.
Colleges are not ranked for their teaching ability, nor is tenure granted for it. The top ranked colleges get that designation for their research, and teaching is an adjunct to that in the Ivies, for example. HYPSM has many of the very best scholars in the world, but not necessarily the best teachers. The credential is why many parents are willing to pay $77k per year. That, and the residential college experience.
I have to laugh at this. Not at you though.? I just have never heard anyone I know when sending their kids off to HYPSM say it’s because of the scholars. Honestly, if the parents didn’t go there it was for the name and status. Of course their going to get a great education and this is always the top priority but never heard “The scholars are awesome there”.
I agree completely, parents and students do not really care about the scholars, but that is what gets the school the high rank. The highest ranked schools have outstanding scholars, but not necessarily outstanding teachers-ask any undergrad there. The rank, and credential, are based on scholarship at research universities.
@roycroftmom there is a list of “best undergrad teaching” for universities and some Ivies are near the top.
Here’s the description of the list
“Many colleges have a strong commitment to teaching undergraduates instead of conducting graduate-level research. In a survey conducted in spring 2019, the schools on these lists received the most votes from top college administrators for putting a particular focus on undergraduate teaching”
Princeton is number one. Brown number three. So some Ivies do give undergrads attention and I’m sure students choose these places partly for the experience they have with their professors. I hope most of them can show up in the fall.
https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities/undergraduate-teaching
While it’s true that faculty who excel in research aren’t necessarily best teachers, they aren’t mutually exclusive. As a matter of fact, best researchers are more likely than not to be good teachers. They often possess unique insights and perspectives others don’t have, because they acquired their knowledge in the subject areas more profoundly and insightfully themselves. This is not only for higher level courses, but also for intro courses. The Feynman lectures on physics is one good example of it.
Some professors are better communicators than others, but most professors are decent communicators. Communication is a two-way street. Students also need to give professors feedback and make effort to go to office hours and ask good questions. All professors like good students and students who make great efforts learning the course subject.
Signs point toward Davidson having in-person classes this Fall but no final decision yet. My D, like many, doesn’t have housing b/c she was supposed to go abroad. The college is looking at what to do about housing, but my D and some of her friends are proactively looking for off-campus housing.
PSA: I’ve told her in case classes do go online at some point, I’d like her to have her own bedroom. Feels like an important time to have some personal space to study and do remote classes, if need be. Plus, reduces impact if a she or an apartment mate gets sick. Just mentioning in case others are in same boat.
They really want something in walking distance but no luck so far. Because 97% of students live on campus there’s no real student housing like you see other places.
Agree with both prior comments-great teaching and research can coincide, but do not always, which is why the USNWR teaching rankings do not match their overall rankings (see, for example, Elon and Georgia State).